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02/11/09, 5:15 AM
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#51
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by alarge
I had also never seen a case where AP was valued higher than hit for someone who wasn't hit-capped, but I loaded him from the armory into the spreadsheet, and with no or minimal buffs, this is the case. Interestingly, I show intellect as his most valuable stat, followed by raw AP, followed by hit.
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It's true that being hit capped is one of the most important things for a hunter, especially considering how easy it can be. However, if you are only 10 points or so away from the cap it isn't necessary to socket a 16 hit gem instead of a 16 agi gem. Being that close the hit cap you will almost never miss, and for most fights you will never miss once.
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02/11/09, 10:49 AM
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#52
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Druid
Vek'nilash
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Originally Posted by Natalis
It's true that being hit capped is one of the most important things for a hunter, especially considering how easy it can be. However, if you are only 10 points or so away from the cap it isn't necessary to socket a 16 hit gem instead of a 16 agi gem. Being that close the hit cap you will almost never miss, and for most fights you will never miss once.
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Obviously you don't need to socket a 16 hit gem if you only need 10 hit (note that is not the case with the guy I was responding to: he was about 30 points short of the cap if I remember correctly).
The whole "almost never miss" argument is flawed in two fundamental ways:
1. Nobody is claiming that if you are at 7.9% hit that it is a huge dps loss. There is nothing "magic" about being hit capped. However, the question isn't the absolute value of hit, it is the relative value. Should you add a hit gem or an AP/AGI gem? It is almost always the case (this guy being one of the rare exceptions), that hit has a higher impact on dps (for the same item budget) than any other stat -- all the way up to the cap. If you are only 10 points shy of the cap, however, it may be the case that a hit/agi gem (that still leaves you 2 below the cap) provides a better dps gain than a straight hit gem (where 6 of the 10 points are wasted).
2. Hit is transferred to your pet in whole percentages. So if you were at 7.9% hit, your pet would only be at 7%. While you'd only miss an average of 1/1000 shots, your pet would miss 1/100. For BM, where your pet will actually do more dps than you do on many fights, this is a real concern. Note that this is also why Focused Aim (whose hit does not transfer to pets) is often a bad choice -- especially for BM hunters.
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02/11/09, 11:20 AM
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#53
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Bald Bull
Worgen Hunter
Whisperwind
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Originally Posted by alarge
I had also never seen a case where AP was valued higher than hit for someone who wasn't hit-capped, but I loaded him from the armory into the spreadsheet, and with no or minimal buffs, this is the case. Interestingly, I show intellect as his most valuable stat, followed by raw AP, followed by hit.
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Why would you gem assuming no buffs? To be brutally honest, Asarra's talent build is wildly different from anything that would be recommended for BM on this site, and that's obviously going to mean that the "common rules" don't necessarily work here.
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04/15/09, 6:00 AM
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#54
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Druid
Earthen Ring
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Originally Posted by Faerdael
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i. as of 3.1.
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04/15/09, 6:32 PM
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#55
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Hunter
Dethecus
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I'm a little confused about the prismatic gem. If I place a delicate dragon's eye in one of the blue sockets, does it also count as a yellow for my meta?
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04/15/09, 7:19 PM
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#56
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Von Kaiser
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Originally Posted by brokenarrow
I'm a little confused about the prismatic gem. If I place a delicate dragon's eye in one of the blue sockets, does it also count as a yellow for my meta?
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Yes jc dragon eye cuts count as every color.
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04/21/09, 11:34 AM
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#57
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Hunter
Emeriss (EU)
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so how does it work with the new patch 3.1
it been said that players benefit 25% extra on the armor penetration, so what should a survival hunter choose the agility gems or the armor penetration gems?
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04/21/09, 11:47 AM
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#58
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Don Flamenco
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Given that ArP only affects physical shots, no hunter should chose ArP gems over agility (SV & maybe MM) or AP (BM & maybe MM), as the increased damage from non-physical shots, e.g. Chimera Shot, Explosive Shot, Serpent Sting more than covers the gap and wouldn't get anything from ArP anyway.
The only possible exception is BM where, as TrevvyTrev likes to remind us, autoshot is a significant part of a hunter's damage output. Even there though, ArP isn't going to be a huge value-add because it doesn't transfer to your pet.
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04/21/09, 12:38 PM
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#59
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Don Flamenco
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Originally Posted by Iru
The only possible exception is BM where, as TrevvyTrev likes to remind us, autoshot is a significant part of a hunter's damage output. Even there though, ArP isn't going to be a huge value-add because it doesn't transfer to your pet.
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Probably not even then. The problem with the ArP gems is that they are red, and both AGI and AP seem to be better options for any spec. Fractured (ArP) gems aren't as flat-out horrible as they used to be, though, so if for some reason or another you want to slot a new item with one until something better comes along, it's not too bad (at least for BM). I show a few dps lost for every AP gem that I replace with ArP in the spreadsheet. I have also noticed that the conventional wisdom that ArP gets better the more of it you already have seems to hold up. The per-point gap between ArP and AGI/AP is closing, and ArP is now ahead of crit.
This is all limited to my current gear/spec of course.
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04/21/09, 1:23 PM
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#60
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Glass Joe
Blood Elf Hunter
Gorefiend
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8ag/12 stam vs 16ap/12stam
At this point in 3.1 I'm staying with survival and now that 8agi/12 stam gem is out I was wondering if it was worth it to swap my ap gems out seeing as I already have 36.5 unbuffed crit. Unfortunately I can't run the spreadsheet to figure the numbers out myself.
here is my armory link since I have the stupid characters in my name
The World of Warcraft Armory
Thank you in advance for your responses.
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06/25/09, 11:29 AM
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#61
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Von Kaiser
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From 3.2 PTR: new Delicate Dragon's Eye
Notice that all dragon's eyes retain their prismatic status (at least so far). Also the difference of each in comparison to the new epic gems is +14 (34-20) which results in +42 (14x3) agility bonus for the JC.
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"If you tell a tiger who's never seen a mouse before that it's very scary, then the tiger may not be able to sleep because of fear."
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06/25/09, 2:03 PM
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#62
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Von Kaiser
Blood Elf Rogue
Blackrock
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Originally Posted by elandriel
From 3.2 PTR: new Delicate Dragon's Eye
Notice that all dragon's eyes retain their prismatic status (at least so far). Also the difference of each in comparison to the new epic gems is +14 (34-20) which results in +42 (14x3) agility bonus for the JC.
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That's odd, in this picture they lose their prismatic status, clearly stating which socket the gem matches in the note.
I think the MMO one might be outdated.
http://wowraid.com/gallery/0/1_24_06_09_4_31_22.jpg
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07/22/09, 1:02 AM
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#63
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Glass Joe
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INT Gem and Careful Aim
I would like to know if there are any restrictions with Careful Aim and socketing a yellow gem slot with INT gem.
I am already hit caped so I don't need any hit gems and if Careful Aim will convert the int to attack power it would be a viable alternative for me. I ask this because i am not sure if CA will convert INT gem stats.
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07/22/09, 2:42 AM
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#64
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Don Flamenco
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Yes it converts, but honestly you'd be better off using a red agi or AP unless the socket bonus is so phenomenal or you just need any yellow gem to activate your meta gem.
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07/22/09, 8:01 AM
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#65
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Glass Joe
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Yes it converts, but honestly you'd be better off using a red agi or AP unless the socket bonus is so phenomenal or you just need any yellow gem to activate your meta gem.
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I would like to use a Ap gem but I was thinking ahead for patch 3.2 where my JC gems won't fulfill my meta requirements.
Thank you for the answer hopefully I will have a better option when the patch comes out.
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07/22/09, 8:12 AM
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#66
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Hunter
Doomhammer (EU)
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Originally Posted by cheydurie
I would like to use a Ap gem but I was thinking ahead for patch 3.2 where my JC gems won't fulfill my meta requirements.
Thank you for the answer hopefully I will have a better option when the patch comes out.
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The best solution to fulfill meta requirements in 3.2 is to use the new prismatic gem Nightmare Tear; 10 int and 10 agi, leaving you with red gems in all other sockets (unless a socket bonus is really worth going for, but in this case you would put the Nightmare's Tear in it).
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08/14/09, 12:35 PM
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#67
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Glass Joe
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Is this list going to be updated with a complete list of the 3.2 Gems?
Last edited by seridosgunner : 08/14/09 at 12:36 PM.
Reason: rewording
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08/14/09, 12:40 PM
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#68
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Glass Joe
Troll Death Knight
Shandris
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Originally Posted by seridosgunner
Is this list going to be updated with a complete list of the 3.2 Gems?
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The naming convention holds true into the Epic. So just replace the type of gem, for example if it says Delicate Scarlet Ruby, change that to Delicate Cardinal Ruby.
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12/31/09, 6:48 PM
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#69
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Glass Joe
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Hi, I was curious, for survival hunter is it best to go with all +20 Agility gems and one Nightmare Tear gem to make the meta work? Or would it be better to use some of the +10 agility and +10 critical gems in yellow slots anywhere?
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12/31/09, 9:05 PM
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#70
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Elechan
Hi, I was curious, for survival hunter is it best to go with all +20 Agility gems and one Nightmare Tear gem to make the meta work? Or would it be better to use some of the +10 agility and +10 critical gems in yellow slots anywhere?
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It is always more beneficial to socket 10Agi/10Crit into yellow sockets if they have a +Agi Bonus. In terms of DPS value, 14(sometimes 16) Agi + 10 Crit > 20 Agi. If it provides a +Agility bonus, yellow sockets should have Deadly Ametrine in them.
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01/06/10, 5:35 PM
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#71
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by markovicous
It is always more beneficial to socket 10Agi/10Crit into yellow sockets if they have a +Agi Bonus. In terms of DPS value, 14(sometimes 16) Agi + 10 Crit > 20 Agi. If it provides a +Agility bonus, yellow sockets should have Deadly Ametrine in them.
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Also to add on when you get to end game content gear, you get to a point where you reach crit cap, so AP/crit isn't so bad either or Agi/haste or AP/haste w/e... just keep the crit cap in mind the higher your gear score is because of the diminishing benefits of crit at a high number.
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01/07/10, 12:08 AM
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#72
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Glass Joe
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Originally Posted by Shaynaynay
Also to add on when you get to end game content gear, you get to a point where you reach crit cap, so AP/crit isn't so bad either or Agi/haste or AP/haste w/e... just keep the crit cap in mind the higher your gear score is because of the diminishing benefits of crit at a high number.
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Even if you are specifically talented/glyphed it is very difficult for hunters to reach our crit softcaps for specific shots. It's not something to worry about unless you specifically gear/talent/glyph to reach crit caps, but who does that?
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