Nooska

Since we don't do 25 man raid till tomorrow night I can only show you pre patch wws (a bit useless)

I will screen somthing tomorrow if I find a fight thats comparable - so far Idon't see any from the 10 man we started tonight.

 

elfyperson

is bm going to be the highest dps?

 

Iru

According to the spreadsheet no. It's just not going to be as far off as it was post-3.0.8 nerf

 

• Dwimmerlaik

Has anyone been able to produce a WWS post-patch yet, despite the... amazing stability of our servers?

Also, has anyone found Gondria, the new Spirit Beast?

 

Ghtshan

I have looked for Gondria and also noticed other Hunters in the area at the same time. Im still looking for loque so i the thought of trying to find another spirit beast is a little disturbing right now.

 

Stark92

what spreadsheet are you using? link or something plz?

 

Peldin

I won't be testing it until tonight, but I'm very curious as to how the BM hunter will compete when fighting XT-002 Deconstructor.

In this kind of fight, I found myself moving around a good bit either when I got Light Bomb or when someone near me got it. This can really mess up MM dps if they are in the middle of using Rapid Fire. SV hunters can hurt too if they have to move out of range and can't fire an ES when it's up. However our pets have no problems and continually dmg him the entire fight. Also, during his add phase, the pet can keep damaging the heart while you are AOEing the adds.

Now that BM dps is more competitive, I wonder if a dual spec to BM would be beneficial for this fight. Tonight my guild will be killing him so I'll try to remember to come back here to provide a parse.

 

halabar

Even if BM is lower dps, all is not lost.

There have been some threads popping up in other places about CC actually being needed, and the lack of trapping that SV hunters can do, since they are using their trap cooldown for BA. So there just might be a place for BM in raids, even if the dps isn't the same. (Or we might be a lot closer to a SV hunter, maybe even passing them, if trapping is required, and they hurt their dps by doing so... )

 

sylvestro

sorry, in advance, if this has been addressed elsewhere, but with 3.1 here has the general concensus concerning the overall dps as far as cats for sv/mm and dino for bm changed? and if so what to?

 

Ashenmoor

BA is not a must and survival hunters will surely trap on cc needed pulls, and have wyvern sting for added cc in a pinch.

 

Rosamonde

This is addressed in the first post of this thread and also in the Pet Management thread, first post.

Cave canum...

Florimel (hunter) / Argent Dawn
Rosamonde (mage) / Argent Dawn
Lisieau (priest) / Argent Dawn

 

Nooska

First 25 man done tonight. Not a lot of progress sadly, but some interesting numbers.

We only had 1 of our SV hunters there (the other had too low attendance to get in on the first go) so not a whole lot to go by.
On both trash and specific boss fights I was doing equal too, sligtly better or slightly worse. With the new components of SV priority that might be the case for a while till it gets firmly stuck under their belts, but we aren't far off, thats for sure.

I will update with WWS for tonight when I get it up (just waiting for 1 more combat log to be transferred) and post a comparative wws from one of the last 2 weeks.

(I did suck in cntinualy forgetting my AotDh after wiping, so I could have done better dps)

Edit:

Too bad WWS doesn't show boss fights right now, so only a total is available. But here is 1 pre and 1 post patch as requested. They aren't very informative as they include me and 1 sv hunter in both (the same) and an additional sv hunter in the older one.

Tonights run compared with the other hunter; Wow Web Stats
A run 2 weeks ago from most of naxx (including patch): Wow Web Stats

I don't think I got any upgrades between these 2 runs as I've been thoroughly unlucky on rolls, so they should be more or less comparable. I did switch from core hound to wolf with 3.1 though.

 

Corbetti

Not really, since traps proc LnL which is a nice source of burst DPS, whereas BA is a pain with lots of quick dying mobs. SV builds also generally have a shorter trap CD. Then there is Wyvern, which is great on the rare occasions one gets to use it

Now if pet OTing is ever viable, that'd be a great BM niche.

 

• Intermission

I'm not so sure.

I've been BM mainspec so far in Ulduar - our guild does not have a ret paladin at the moment, and we wanted the 3% dmg buff slot filled - and I've been not only competitive but usually quite a bit ahead of my Survival counterparts. Our WMO parses dont seem to be loading*, so I'm afraid this post is simply anecdotal, however I believe it's still worth mentioning because it feels like far too many people are simply assuming one spec is going to be dominant.

*Will edit when their servers are back up, and post an actual dps figure.
[edit]An update on the dps figures, they weren't really anything special. Then again, the fights had phase change breaks, target swapping, etc. So it was 3.5 to 6 depending on the fight.

On P1 Mimiron, which we did heaps of times due to melee failing in P2/P4... my dps was only roughly 5.0. Having said that, you need to pull your pet out for ~5 seconds every ~30 seconds, and I was out of range of SoE. Seems 5.1 or 5.2 would be an average BM number for a typical fight (plus the 3% raid buff, which is very very important obviously, if you have no ret paladin).
[/edit]

Last night we killed Auririairuya, Freya, and Thorim. We didnt have PTR experience, so we had a few attempts on each of the bosses too, including Thorim (a stand and nuke boss phase pretty much). And I was consistently ahead of the pack. On Thorim, the dps order was roughly: BM, Rogue, SV, SV, other classes. This was for all 3-4 pulls where we made it to the boss phase. The gap between myself and the first SV was a good 15% or so. On some of the other bosses, BM and the rogue were usually on top, with the SV's anywhere from 2-6 on the list.

The previous night was similar:

Flame Levi - vehicle fight.
Razor - while the damage meter showed an even spread, BM did more damage on Razor. The other specs seemed to knock the adds over quicker though.
XT - similar to Razor, BM did more damage on XT and the Heart, however SV/MM would kill bombs easier.
Kologarn - pet doesnt work, I swapped to Marks.
Council - I dont remember to be honest. I think I was still mucking around with Marks because my pet talents were bugged after I swapped specs. There was only the one pull anyway.
Hodir - Hard to tell. We only had one pull, and a lot of us hadn't done it on the PTR, so we were still learning how and where the buffs worked. Damage would of varied a lot.


I know SV does not have its Explosive Shot glyph yet, and there are also a few bugs (ES not proccing mana regen or GftT, some Black Arrow prolems too?). That might bump it back up again. Or maybe my SV guildmates weren't performing top notch. Perhaps it's because of the unfamiliarity of fights: BM is far easier to play than SV, so a BM hunter can really perfect everything they do while still also learning and discovering new tactics for boss fights - whereas SV might lose a lot of potential damage while they focus on important aspects of the encounter instead.

Regardless, don't write off BM is all I'm trying to say. And it's stupid not to be BM if there is no ret paladin online. No difference in spec is ever going to make up for 3% of total raid damage done.

edit: this is all 25 man.

 

◊ Lactose

Workaround: Move pet close to boss (on passive and follow, move in close to Kologarn), then order it to attack. I tend to put it on aggressive as well. Once here it can attack attack all three targets if you place it near the center.

Look, Lactose, we'd rather you didn't eradicate the whole human race.
- Sam & Max

 

• Intermission

Thanks mate. I also saw your other post about this issue in the other thread, but unfortunately it was after the fight.

 

◊ Lactose

The workaround should no longer be needed:

MMO-Champion BlueTracker - Recent In-Game Fixes - 4/16/09

Look, Lactose, we'd rather you didn't eradicate the whole human race.
- Sam & Max

 

Baphomette

Has anyone given Spirit Strike a shot since 3.1 hit? Curious how the new spell hit works and hoping it's as simple as "pet spells use physical hit table, so they also cap at 263".

Picked up Gondria this evening after (too) much camping over the last three days; never levelled my Loque to 80 but think I'm going to be using this ghost cat 4 a lot of fite.

 

Antorylis

Spirit Strike still misses with the physical hit cap of 263. I'm seeing 3-6% miss rate on a Heroic Target Dummy. It's the same miss rate I saw pre-patch, so it appears the intended change did not go live, despite the patch notes.

 

Landais

Do you use a wolf in bm spec ?

 

Crydak

A devilsaur is quite superior than a Wolf if you specc deep BM (51 point talent) according to the spreadsheet.

 

Nooska

Devilsaur is better on paper, thats true but there are 2 hold ups for devilsurs (at least in my book):

1) Accessibility - you will have to go to un'goro to be pretty sure to get one, and you have to level it (compared to the wolf which is instant lvl 80)
2) Hit box - the defvilsaur still has a huges hitbox with problems resulting from that (last I heard, I haven't tested it myself)

I can see myself going to pick up a devilsaur at some point if 2 is resolved, but the wolf is simply more practical to deal with for a very very slight decrease in dps (and we don't have to worry about switching pets when switching specs)

 

Rinsenrepeat

theres a level 70 one in netherstorm, not that is much less out of the way though.

 

KraxisSingular

Normal King Dred can be tamed. Of course it requires a nice group to help you.

The Devilsaur also annoys the melee rather often. Big red and noisy.

 

Nebelwerfer

Yea he is.

Mimiron we seemed to be very even, but the SV hunters were kiting and so Inter managed to pull ahead. BM looks to be in a very good place at the moment.