Rivkah

I went through a bunch of class set bonuses to see if this is a consistent pattern:
- T7 warlock 2pc - no proc chance listed (wowhead says it's 15%), no ICD
- T10 warlock 4pc - proc chance listed at 15%, no data yet on ICD
- T8 mage 2pc - no proc chance listed (wowhead says it's 25%), 45 sec ICD
- T8 mage 4pc - no proc chance listed (wowhead comments quote anywhere from 10-30%), no ICD
- T9 rogue 2pc - no proc chance listed (wowhead says it's 2%), no ICD
- T10 rogue 4pc - proc chance listed at 13%, no data yet on ICD
- T7 warrior dps 2pc - no proc chance listed (wowhead says it's 10%), no ICD
- T8 warrior dps 2pc - no proc chance listed (wowhead says it's 40%), no ICD
- T10 warrior dps 2pc - proc chance listed at 3%, no data yet on ICD
- T10 warrior dps 4pc - proc chance listed at 20%, no data yet on ICD

The only pattern I see here is that until T10 Blizzard didn't make a practice of putting proc chance in the description of the set bonuses and now the proc based bonuses generally do include the chance in the description. So I don't think this tells us anything. It does seem though like the bulk of proc based set bonuses previously have not had ICDs (all I was able to find so far was the mage 2pc T8 and hunter 4pc T8 that had them). So that does seem to make it more likely that the 4pc bonus wouldn't have a cooldown, since the proc on the ability should be fairly predictable, making the damage it gains predictable enough that it wouldn't need a cooldown to keep it from proccing too often.

I've updated my site to assume that 4pc T10 does not have a cooldown for now but everyone should keep in mind that we don't have full data at this time on the bonus.

 

Rullis

Ok guys. I've noticed this alot lately with me and a other hunter in the raid.

The problem is as following:

- I do around 'x' quivershots per boss and around 'y' quick shots. (With the new bow).

- He does around 'x+7' quivershots per boss and 0y quick shots. (He doesnt have the bow).



So, we talked a bit about this and well. Can it be that the wild quiver doesnt proc as often if you have the new bow? That quick shots takes over the wildquiver proc instead, and lowering it.

Has anyone else noticed this? Or is this not a problem at all for you?


Thanks in advance for the answers!

 

alienangel

What bow does he have, and how much haste? Or rather, how many autoshots does he fire per fight compared to you? If he's firing more autoshots (e.g. by having a faster weapon, or being better at minimizing movement), he'll have more wild quiver procs.

 

Rullis

Sorry, forgot to mention that.

I had around 5-10 more autoshots than him everytime. And yet he had more Wild Quiver procs, around 5-10 more.


It's really wierd..

 

markovicous

Finally - I've gotten around to what I hope is legitimate testing on the Hunter tier 10 2set bonus (first time doing a test like this).

Here's the info, with logs attached.

Before we start - the cooldown I got from Procodile was 2 seconds (time between auto shots). There is no internal cooldown on the 2set piece bonus.

Test 1: 21:29 (1 289 seconds), done with full gear and a typical MM rotation.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Total Auto Shot - 235 reg + 285 crit + 26 block = 546
Exploit Weakness - 21 procs, 191.1 seconds uptime, 14.8%
21/546 = .038 * 100 = 3.8% per shot to proc

Test 2: 56:56 (3 416 seconds), done with no proc or haste gear, auto shot only.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Total Auto Shots - 714 reg + 463 crit + 55 blocks = 1 232
Exploit Weakness - 52 procs, 647.6 seconds uptime, 19.0%
52/1232 = .042 * 100 = 4.2% per shot to proc

Test 3: 45:11 (2 711 seconds), done with no proc gear, and 100 haste, auto shot only.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Total Auto Shots - 599 reg + 437 crit + 52 block = 1 088
Exploit Weakness - 49 procs, 466.7 seconds uptime, 17.2%
49/1088 = .045 * 100 = 4.5% per shot to proc


Overall Total

Test 1 shots + Test 2 + Test 3
546 + 1232 + 1088 = 2866

Test 1 procs + Test 2 + Test 3
21 + 52 + 49 = 122

122/2866 = .04256 * 100 = 4.26% chance to proc over all 3 tests.

Test 1 time + Test 2 + Test 3
1 289 + 3 416 + 2 711 = 7 416 seconds

Test 1 uptime + Test 2 + Test 3
191.1 + 647.6 + 466.7 = 1 305.4

1 305.4 / 7 416 = .1760 * 100 = 17.60% uptime over all 3 tests

Another thing to look at, is maybe shots per second on each of the attempts.

Test 1: 546 / 1 289 = .42 auto shots per second

Test 2: 1235 / 3 416 = .36 auto shots per second

Test 3: 1 088 / 2 711 = .40 auto shots per second

I did the math, and included the logs for anyone interested to take a look at. All tests were done without a pet, and were hopefully long enough to have relevant results. I wish I could have done the last test with more haste, but that is all the haste gear I have for now. If anyone with a built-up haste set would like to give it a shot, go for it. I double checked my math, but there's still a chance I could have gotten it wrong, feel free to double check if you see anything off.

 

Kluian

Zod's bow is bugged and is terrible. When it procs it has some odd behavior. It acts like it resets the swing timer, but its worse than that. Some cases people have reported 8+ second delays in autoshots.

WoW bug forum for reference : World of Warcraft - English (NA) Forums -> [Bug]Zod's Repeating Longbow's quick shot

 

Lilyana

Please remove this post, I am in error (or rather, wowhead is in error!)

 

Rivkah

Distant Land Heroic (which is the one used in the profile) has 3 sockets according to the official WoW Armory. I'm assuming the 2 socket data on wowhead is out of date information from the PTR.

 

Bowaflex

Hi, I'm sorry if this has been covered somewhere (I can't seem to find it) but I was wondering at what ArPen rating should I drop arcane shot from my rotation. I'm at ~613 ArPen, and my arcane shot crits are still averaging higher than my steady shot crits

WorldofLogs: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

There are the Improved steady shot procs that factor in to play as well... any suggestions or a link to where it's been covered would be appreciated

 

Rivkah

You can check my site to see what your dps should be estimated at with and without arcane shot. At that gear level it's almost for sure going to be worth dropping. The factor for when to drop it is not when arcane shot does more damage than steady, but when the steady shot plus the piercing shots it can proc (which arcane shot doesn't) and ISS if you have it will cause more damage than arcane shot. It typically is a factor both of ArPen and crit rating and you have a fairly substantial amount of both.

 

Rivkah

I've added experimental support on the site for MM hunters who refresh their serpent sting when the 2pc T10 bonus procs and keep it maintained the rest of the fight with chimera shot (you can disable this behavior in the settings if you like). I also corrected serpent sting and black arrow to properly benefit from Culling the Herd and the 2pc T10 bonus.

 

marv

The dps analyzer shows 1360 arp rating as the cap. With my 1289 arp rating 92.10% armor reduction is displayed in game while the analyzer offers 94.95% reduction for the same arp rating. And also, when a raid boss has 8317 or lesser armor, with 100% armor penetration we should be able to reduce its armor to 0 but the analyzer shows the effective target armor as 467. Is it analyzer error or am I wrong here?

 

Hagen

1360 might be shown as your cap because you have selected ArP buff food. ArP caps at 100% (1399.57 ArP rating) not necessarily at 0 target armor.

 

Rivkah

What Hagen said is probably the problem, if you use buff food or elixirs they won't show in the stats from gear but will be calculated into the final stats. It should display how far you are from the ArPen cap in the final stats however, is it saying there that you're 40 rating below the cap?

100% armor penetration doesn't reduce armor to zero, there's a constant that affects how much armor the ArPen can be applied to.

 

marv

yes you are right, I totally forgot about the food.

Are you referring to the constant C=16635 in the cap formula (C+armor)/3? According to this formula, we should be able to reduce the sundered+faeri fired boss armor to 0 with 100%arp, or you are referring to another constant?

 

Rivkah

In Shandara's spreadsheet, the constant is derived from player level and is a lower number which was creating a gap in armor that could be penetrated. When I originally built my site I inquired about this and was told it was correct. I just did some checking however and I found multiple references which referred to the constant being derived from target level so I've changed it. I'm not sure if there's some reason why it's set the way it is in the spreadsheet.

 

alienangel

I think several threads here have gone over that at the initial explanation time, and more recently, coming to the conclusion that Ghostcrawler was just wrong about which constant to use. I can't dig up too much at work, but the following are examples:
Combat Ratings at level 80
Official 3.1 changes and discussion

I've been ignoring most of the recent complaints from people saying "OMG the spreadsheet is wrong" (and reporting some of them for not reading the necessary background) on the assumption that this conclusion hasn't changed. Did I miss something along the way that makes GC right? I can't claim to have tried testing it myself.

A potential point of change in the formula would be when they "fixed" warriors being able to go into negative armor, which I believe those 2 posts predate.

 

Rivkah

Thanks alienangel for the clarification. I recall having checked into this at one point and not changing it then but I couldn't remember why, then when I did some hunting all the stuff I was finding was using the target level in the constant. Clearly I wasn't looking in the right places. I've reverted the change to work off player level again. I haven't tested it myself either so it's hard to tell sometimes which is the correct information when there are references everywhere giving different data.

BTW, I've also fixed the 2pc T10 uptime to be properly affected by Quick Shots procs.