Fire Cataclysm Discussion: OP Updated for Release - Page 29

Raencloud · 10/16/10, 2:48 AM

Couple things I've noticed tonight while doing more testing:

1) FFB and Fireball are now essentially doing the same damage. Tooltip wise, Fireball does 2 more damage than FFB at my 3717 SP (5763 for FFB and 5765 for Fireball). This is with both FFB and Fireball glyphed. The only difference is the FFB DoT versus the 5% fireball crit from glyphs.

2) LB explosions are doing less damage than the DoT ticks for me as well. I tried to "roll" the LB DoT with trinket procs and damage buffs but it did not take. It doesn't appear that the explosions will have a significant impact on single target DPS anymore though, and it may even be a DPS gain to refresh it prior to the explosion outside of AOE usage.

Codester · 10/16/10, 4:08 AM

Originally Posted by Guac

Has anyone been able to produce the Pyromaniac bug when specced 2/2 into that talent? I was having it bug consistently at 1/2, so I respecced to 2/2 and have not been able to reproduce it since then. Checking the logs posted earlier in this thread, the tooltip for the bugged Pyromaniacs shows it as a 5% haste buff. I'm wondering if I'm just having bad luck reproducing it or if it has something to do with the number of talents point put into it.

The behavior with this is interesting. During ICC25 tonight, Pyromaniac bugged on me at some point following Deathbringer Saurfang, causing me to have the buff constantly until it fell off at some point between the Princes and BQL. My assumption would be that the bug has to do with despawning targets. I can't say for sure, but I know we had a full group of Blood Beasts despawn at the end of the fight, and it would have been quite easy for some of them to have disappeared while affected by dots. On the other hand, I don't have the slightest idea what caused it to later fall off since it dropped prior to me dying or leaving the instance.

I have 2/2 in Pyromaniac though, so I don't think it has anything to do with having 1 or 2 points. I should point out that World of Logs always seems to be showing the buff as the 1 point version regardless. For reference: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

On a different topic, I found an interesting side effect of Cauterize during a failed Heroic Sindragosa attempt. Apparently 'dying' to asphyxiation causes the ice block to disappear when Cauterize procs. I don't know if it was intended, but it was useful nonetheless.

BeeLz · 10/16/10, 6:12 AM

Ignite seems to munch even more than before.
Looking at my Rotface log World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

My expected Ignite : 1035013
My actualy Ignite : 466803

That's over 50% of my ignite damage that disappeared due to munching.

Expression Editor:

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Lusty · 10/16/10, 6:44 AM

I'd like to add to this after reading the first post. Having checked the Blizzard forums under Known Issues it is not listed there either.

Impact does not spread "Pyroblast!" this is the instant Hot Streak version of the Pyroblast DoT.
It does however spread "Pyroblast", this is the regular DoT applied when casting a 3 second Pyro.

While unable to confirm it, it leads me to believe that Combustion also does not consider Pyroblast! as a valid DoT.

jandrarth · 10/16/10, 8:49 AM

Does anyone know if the glyph Mirror Image increases damage or is it a pointless gyph?

Mardi · 10/16/10, 9:16 AM

glyph of mirror image increases their dmg for a few hundred (600 unglyphed vs ~900 glyphed) as fire.

Methusula · 10/16/10, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by Mardi

glyph of mirror image increases their dmg for a few hundred (600 unglyphed vs ~900 glyphed) as fire.

I was under the impression that mirror images casted more slowly when glyphed and it ended up being about the same dps. Of course I can't remember where I saw that so its validity is suspect.

Shaewyn · 10/16/10, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by Maje

Pyroblast! doesn't contribute or resetHot Streak, also the c in K(c) is different than your crit as it shouldn't include debuffs (and probably glyph buffs).

Thanks for the reminder!

So, our formulas should be:
$K(c_{cs})=-2c_{cs}+0.85$
$P_{HS}=cK(c_{cs})+ \frac{c^2}{1+c}(1-K(c_{cs}))$

Where:
$c=$ actual (observed) crit rate
$c_{cs}=$ character sheet crit rate (not including debuffs or glyph bonuses)

Kastor · 10/16/10, 12:59 PM

I really don't know why they put Pyroblast as a contributor to Hot Streak, because it is only worth using with Hot Streak, but as you get a Hot Streak your Pyroblast turns into Pyroblast!, and it is not listed as a Hot Streak contributor. I can't imagine a build which uses Pyroblast as a main nuke or even as a filler, because of its cast time.

Also, Ican confirm that the Pyroblast! DoT can not be spread via Impact, only the Pyroblast DoT, which has zero uptime in a normal rotation.
This is must be a bug.

hypetech · 10/16/10, 1:01 PM

Originally Posted by Raencloud

Couple things I've noticed tonight while doing more testing:

1) FFB and Fireball are now essentially doing the same damage. Tooltip wise, Fireball does 2 more damage than FFB at my 3717 SP (5763 for FFB and 5765 for Fireball). This is with both FFB and Fireball glyphed. The only difference is the FFB DoT versus the 5% fireball crit from glyphs.

2) LB explosions are doing less damage than the DoT ticks for me as well. I tried to "roll" the LB DoT with trinket procs and damage buffs but it did not take. It doesn't appear that the explosions will have a significant impact on single target DPS anymore though, and it may even be a DPS gain to refresh it prior to the explosion outside of AOE usage.

Fireball has a higher coefficient than FFB, so even if the tooltips are equal, Fireball gets more damage from your spell damage.

Tyfon · 10/16/10, 5:04 PM

Originally Posted by hypetech

Fireball has a higher coefficient than FFB, so even if the tooltips are equal, Fireball gets more damage from your spell damage.

I'm under the impression that the tooltips take spell power into account.

Logix · 10/16/10, 5:13 PM

Originally Posted by Tyfon

I'm under the impression that the tooltips take spell power into account.

This is correct.

Tooltips now apply all spell power gains and all non-debuff based damage multipliers (i.e. all things like Arcane tactics, Fire power and spec specific specialization bonuses are part of the displayed damage in the tooltips. Damage multipliers from debuff effects, e.g. TTw for arcane or Curse of Elements for all, are not reflected in the tooltips).

To this effect, displayed damage in the tooltips can somewhat reliably be used in comparing spells.

Kastor · 10/16/10, 5:42 PM

I don't know if it was mentioned, but it seems like Combustion tick crits doesn't apply Ignite on the target.
Is it intended or also a bug?

jandrarth · 10/16/10, 8:44 PM

I turned on x-perl and it shows cast time on mirror image when i selected it and they do cast slower. No glyph they cast frostbolt every 2.0 seconds with roughly 600 damage. With glyph as fire Spec they cast fireball every 2.5 seconds with roughly 900 damage. No glyph mirror image damage is roughy 9000 vs. with glyph mirrior image damage is roughy 10800. So it is increase in damage but very min amount. Im just going to go with polymorph glyph or frostfire bolt glyph for major glyph.

mightypirate · 10/16/10, 9:06 PM

Originally Posted by jandrarth

Does anyone know if the glyph Mirror Image increases damage or is it a pointless gyph?

The cast time is slower but they hit a bit harder.

The big dps loss is that once you gylph this, they no longer cast the fireblast, which is usually around 500 damage. In the end it seems to even out and make this glyph useless