Arcane in Cataclysm: Updated for 4.01 - Page 10

Zaldinar · 10/27/10, 1:01 PM

/cast Frostbolt
/script start, duration, enabled = GetSpellCooldown(GetSpellInfo(116));
/script DEFAULT_CHAT_FRAME:AddMessage("GCD of "..duration.." Seconds");

Change "frostbolt" to "arcane explosion" and the 116 to AEs spell ID. That will tell you its GCD value.

Nerdling · 10/27/10, 1:03 PM

sry delete this pls, I posted into wrong thread. But ty for that info Zaldinar. Learn something new everyday.

antiscian · 10/27/10, 1:26 PM

Originally Posted by Draginclaw

Last week Heroic ICC-reforged haste to mastery

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

This week Heroic ICC-reforged crit to mastery

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I basically would spam AB on most fights. Use CD's at 82% mana (then when they are up again) and evocation around 32% (when possible).

I could tell I was using more mana with the higher haste. On some fights I was struggling at the end with a low mana pool. With the RNG on fights i couldn't tell much of a difference between the overall numbers. On Lich King this week I got picked up by valks three times so mana was never an issue with mage armor ticking. For Festergut we didn't use heroism so can't really compare one week to the other. And so on....

Draginclaw: Why use cooldowns at 82% and not either immediately after engagement or after 4 stacks are up?

Metallan · 10/27/10, 1:45 PM

My guess is he doesn't want to waste the mana regen from Mana Gem + Mage Armor + Replenishment. I do something like that for that reason.

Draginclaw · 10/27/10, 2:13 PM

Originally Posted by antiscian

Draginclaw: Why use cooldowns at 82% and not either immediately after engagement or after 4 stacks are up?

So my Improved Mana Gem buff is up with Arcane Power and Mirror Images (4PC). My mana pool is over 40k so I can spam AB while the 4 stack is up not worry about mana issues. 82% makes sure I don't waste the mana from mana gem or mage armor.

On a side note if I'm getting PI on a fight he waits 10-15 seconds into the fight so it matches up as well with my CD's.

antiscian · 10/27/10, 3:05 PM

Originally Posted by Draginclaw

So my Improved Mana Gem buff is up with Arcane Power and Mirror Images (4PC). My mana pool is over 40k so I can spam AB while the 4 stack is up not worry about mana issues. 82% makes sure I don't waste the mana from mana gem or mage armor.

On a side note if I'm getting PI on a fight he waits 10-15 seconds into the fight so it matches up as well with my CD's.

OK that makes good sense. My rotation is very similar to that, although I blow my load a bit earlier and hit mana gem at about 90%. I think I'll split the difference and blow everything, including gem, at 85%. That will also help with the risk of threat. Thanks!

Draginclaw · 10/27/10, 3:54 PM

Originally Posted by antiscian

OK that makes good sense. My rotation is very similar to that, although I blow my load a bit earlier and hit mana gem at about 90%. I think I'll split the difference and blow everything, including gem, at 85%. That will also help with the risk of threat. Thanks!

Your tank is probably get Tricks of the Trade and Misdirects at the start of the fight. You have a good 30 seconds before that threat drops off the main tank. You should get to the 82% mana around 15 seconds (assuming haste pot before start). Once you pop mirror images you have 29 more seconds without worrying about threat. You can then DPS until 1-2 seconds left on Mirror Images and hit Invisibility (assumes talent points in prismatic cloak). I typically come out of Invisibility with Evocation. It almost lines up perfectly for me with the percents.

Bottlegnomes · 10/27/10, 4:53 PM

Something that I have not seen posted here. Currently Mana Adept is increasing the spell damage done by procs and on use spell damage trinkets such as Reign of the Unliving and rocket gloves. The dps increase from this is minimal but it is something to keep in mind.

tenub · 10/27/10, 6:42 PM

Originally Posted by Draginclaw

Last week Heroic ICC-reforged haste to mastery

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

This week Heroic ICC-reforged crit to mastery

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

1547 dps vs. 16653 on Putricide. I think the higher haste wins here.

Hibbo · 10/28/10, 4:58 AM

I also tried Arcane this ID the first Time and it went quite well. I started with 1154 Haste (used Talisman for Burst Phase because i have no other Trinket - used CTS and Phylactery before ) till Rotface and got Luck to get H-DFO and used it starting from Festergut with about 1324 Haste.

My main Problem was that we always use Bloodlust after 5 Seconds in the Fight (Marrowgar,Saurfang, Festergut, Rotface).
I went very fast to 30% Mana and had still 10-12 seconds left on my Images. So i burned longer and went down to about 10-15% Mana because using Evo during Images was not the way in wanted to go.

My Impression was that 1324 Haste is a bit to much, with 1154 it felt quite good. I reforged now both Haste Trinkets to Mastery Rating giving me 1183 Haste, 34,71% Crit, and 16% Mastery.
So for me 1200 Haste is the way i aim for.

Here are the logs if someone is interested in: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Pasture · 10/28/10, 6:46 AM

Fire:
Molten Shields now causes your Blazing Speed effect to also removes any movement slowing effects.
Blazing Speed now dispells all effect that prevent movement.

This is a little disappointing for Arcane PvP. The effect was obviously split because it was too good a tool for Frost, but of course it has the effect of pushing it out of reach for Arcane too. What I would rather see is Improved Counterspell pushed to tier 2 in Arcane. That way Frost has to choose between Improved Counterspell and Blazing Speed (old version) and Arcane has to choose between Blazing Speed and Improved Cone of Cold.

As its current effect the talent is pretty useless. If a melee is wailing on you, chances are you're going to be slowed too and if the slow isn't going to be dispelled Improved Cone of Cold is probably the more useful alternative. The problem is that Frost (which is already an incredibly powerful spec in PvP without dipping into any other tree) can pick up BOTH Improved Counterspell and Blazing Speed. Likewise Fire can grab Improved Counterspell and Improved Cone of Cold. Just push Improved Counterspell up a tier and make all three PvP specs have to choose and Blazing Speed can remain in its older form. Splitting the effects is just a heavy handed way of denying Frost.

Elrin · 10/28/10, 10:10 AM

Another mechanic which arcane can try to incorporate is the use of Priest's Hymn of Hope - Spell - World of Warcraft

Both parts of the spell are beneficial especially the 15% increased mana.

It should allow us to increase the length of the 'burn phase' down to 25% mana. Then a /w macro to your friendly priest to channel HoH should increase maximum mana temporarily thus allowing evocation to bring you back to max mana.

Currently with raid buffed 50000 mana the burn phase is:
AB spam to 35% (about 17,500 mana)
Evocate for 60% of 50,000 (30,000 mana)
Back to 95% (47k ish mana)

With HoH at our disposal:
Again starting with 50,000 mana
AB spam to 25% (about 12,500 mana)
Hit macro asking for HoH - a power aura telling you that HoH is active is also v useful
Evocate for 60% of 57,500 (34,500)
Back to 95% (47k ish mana) PLUS any ticks of HoH which should actually get you back to 100%

This does of course rely on a priest willing to channel the spell, which in current ICC fights should be no problem. Wonder if any mages have experience of this.

We are currently trying to play with addons/frames so that both arcane mages can benefit from the HoH/ Obviously requires a little co ordination to ensure both are at around 25% mana before HoH is requested. Amazing how RNG procs can affect players during the burn phase - a few lucky procs of CC and you can be 10-15% mana ahead of a similarly geared mage.

Hibbo · 10/28/10, 10:43 AM

I have seen now many Calculations about Mastery,Haste,Crit Ratings.
And most Statements pointed into the Direction that Int > Haste > Mastery > Crit.

But can anyone tell me some indeeper Comparison between Int and Haste.
The Background is that is want to compare Reign of the Dead - Heroic with DFO Heroic

I like the Idea of having a Int Trinket, more max Mana, more regen through Mage Armor, more Mana from Evocation, more Mana from Replenishment.

Edit:

So we have now 170 Haste vs 144 Int. So we loose 26 Stat Points. But can all the Points i mentioned negate the loss of this 26 Haste? But hey we also get Crit from Intellect, and also 2 Buffs like Wizardry and Mark of the Wild.

To Summary up (2 Minute Fight):

170 Haste Rating vs

158,76 Intellect ( 158 Spell Power and 43,72 Crit Rating)

2381 more max Mana
1428 Mana from Evocation
262 Mana from Replenishment
1971 Mana from Mage Armor

6042 more Mana to use in a 2 Minute Fight

Metallan · 10/28/10, 12:33 PM

Right now I'm looking at much more comparissons... and my head hurts.

For example, I'm comparing my Non-Heroic Reign of the Dead against my Heroic Sliver of Pure Ice to see how they compare, and it's pretty tricky. I mean, you lose the proc, but you a bit more of mana + some more mana to extend burn phase. I'm gonna look for a reliable source for trinket ranking. I'd like to compare the Purified Lunar Dust there too, but I'm guessing its totally worthless proc makes leaves it out.

FractalLaw · 10/31/10, 5:17 PM

Forgive me if this has been posted elsewhere in this thread, but lately I've been considering the 4 points I have in Improved Arcane Missiles and Missile Barrage.

They just don't seem worth it.

Admittedly the numbers may skew some when Cata hits, but for right now I'm really wondering if I'd be better off freeing up some of those points for another use.

I'm fortunate enough to be have the Glyph of Mage Armor, so my in combat regen is quite high. I haven't really had mana issues even with heavy, heavy AB spam, and ABr is still available to clear stacks.

Has anyone tried going without those two talents and dropping AM completely?