Or to avoid headaches, you could fudge average LB uptime as (12 - 0.5*fireball_or_ffb_cast_time)/12 and be done with it.

I doubt the result would differ that much from Shurik's suggestion, since: 1) odds of being in the middle of a Scorch cast are really low, and 2) odds of being in the middle of a PB gcd are really low (since you would wait to cast PB after LB to avoid ignite munching).

Coming up with the uptime isn't that difficult, the simplest way is to check your wws logs and average the uptime. That said it does bring up an interesting point where haste gains aditional value by indirectly allowing your LB uptime to be higher; although not much.

with all the semi-recent discussion that combustion is not a significant dps increase would a spec like http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?mage...0&version=9767 be better off? Also will that 3% extra spirit (assuming approx. 500 spirit to start) which should turn into around .2% crit to everything be better than a point in world in flames?

Emergency update of the front post for the pressing 3.1 questions.
Also mentioned speed enchants since Unholy Aura was chopped.

Glyph of Improved Scorch applies 5 stacks instead of 3.

I guess nows a good time to remember everyone the handy macro:

/script if (GetActiveTalentGroup()==1) then SetActiveTalentGroup(2) else SetActiveTalentGroup(1); end

Something that may be worth investigating: I'm observing base damage on spells that is far higher than what the tooltips suggest (for example, a 1095 Frostfire Bolt hit while naked, untalented, and unglyphed when the stated base damage range is 722-838). Every spell I've tested thus far shows similar inflation under these conditions.

For FFB + Focus magic, it seems that you lose the Focus Magic buff on yourself (belonging to someone else) when you spec out of Focus Magic (going to FFB).

So basically 2 arcane mages can't both cast Focus Magic on each other, and then both switch to an FFB spec because they would both lose the buff, but if an arcane mage casts focus magic on a shadow priest, and then changes to an FFB spec, they would still benefit from their own focus magic buff when the shadow priest crits right?

I have a feeling blizz is going to fix this really soon, I'm sure there are other classes that can exploit this bug as well...it's basically getting free talent points.

Correct. For me, our other main mage is staying Fire/TtW, so we're swapping Focus Magic and I just have to bug him to cast it on me again a lot.

Something else to test would be if PoM or Combustion stay up after swapping specs, although it'd be much less useful than Focus Magic obviously.

If it affects multiple spell one would assume they did a +40% increase to all mage base damage ? In any case, such a sweeping change would likely indicate a more generic change to the way spell damage are calculated. We really need more info on this since the number discrepancy is quite big.

All your buffs are removed upon spec swapping. Regardless of the source. It really is that simple. Also, if you applied any group buff those are stripped from other players. Single-target buffs such as amplify magic, focus magic, will remain.

Was a disease less spec.

Spec 1: FFB
Spec 2: Arcane (or Fire/TtW or any spec with Focus Magic)
Now do the following:

1. Activate Spec 2.
2. Cast Focus Magic on someone.
3. Activate Spec 1. This will remove a Focus Magic buff on yourself if it exists. This will not remove your Focus Magic buff on someone else.
4. If you are receiving Focus Magic, get it cast on you (again).

You do not need to be receiving Focus Magic to benefit from doing this.

Well, let me break it out to you:

setup: 2x FFB mage
result: Both FFB mages cannot abuse the specswap to cross-apply FM. However you can apply FM on one FFB mage and one other player.
optimal use: mage1+mage2 swapspecs to FM-spec. Mage1 casts FM on warlock. Mage1 swapspecs back to FFB. Mage2 casts FM on mage1. Mage2 swapspecs back to FFB.


setup: FFB mage + arcane/fire mage
result: Both mages get FM.
optimal use: ffbmage swapspecs to FM-spec. ffbmage casts FM on arcanefiremage. ffbmage swapspecs back to FFB. Arcanefiremage casts FM on ffbmage.

So if you don't have another mage for focus magic as well is this not worth doing? I'm trying to figure out what's best for me right now as I'm pretty much the only raiding mage in my guild.

Edit: And that's what I meant about not being clear in the OP. I didn't understand the part of having a second mage for the buff as well.

Focus magic is a single target buff. When YOU cast it on someone else THEY get 3% crit, you get the crit buff when they crit. Having a second mage cast it on you means that YOU get the 3% crit AND you get the 3% crit when your focus target crits.

If you are the only mage and you cast it on someone you only get 3% crit when they crit, having a second mage to cast it on you means you get 3% crit all the time in addition to this.

So yes, even if your the only mage there is still a benefit to having focus magic (or having a second spec with focus magic).

I understand the mechanic of how focus magic works. I apologize if I was unclear on that. I was more or less trying to understand how the OP was stating FFB/Focus Magic was the highest DPS spec. I wasn't sure if that was just casting FM on someone else or if it was including having it cast it on you as well. For now I'm going to keep at my second spec and cast it on someone else as I don't feel I have the gear to make fire/ttw viable.

Given the mana issues I've seen in Ulduar so far (even with FFB spec, when aoe is involved, e.g. XT002), FM+FFB is looking a lot more appealing than Fire/ttw. Using the talent swap, (N-1) out of the N mages in the raid can get FM (+ someone else); if no one wants to constantly take one for the team, you can always change the order every boss/attempt.

I claim that "0/53/18 FFB + 3% selfcrit from FM feedback + 3% crit on someone else (maybe even you)" is the highest raid DPS spec. That's how the numbers were with the gear floating around at least. Its DPS is at least on par with Fire and Arcane, it's vastly more mana efficient (no Evocation dependency and interruption issues) and it has better AoE.

If all mages are FFB/FM, then the procedure is as follows:
First mage casts FM onto druid/priest, then swaps to FFB. Second mage casts FM on first mage, swaps. Third mage casts FM on second, swaps. Et cetera, until Manly's sig gets dual-spec nerfed

Cool thank you very much for the information. I'm going to stick with this spec for now as I feel under geared for fire anyway.

Or N mages in the case that one mage main spec has FM already.

Also, on a more personal opinion, I don't see any strong incentive not to go with the following fireball spec:
http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?mage...0&version=9767
(note: this build has no combustion either. This is somewhat very debatable.)

I think that objectively the build makes the most sense for early ulduar. You can skip on range since you assume you do not cast scorch anyway (living bomb/fireball/pyroblast already have decent range on their own). Then you're free to use glyph of living bomb and retain a good mana regen that fireball specs otherwise suffer. Personally that's what I would go for if I were to go fireball spec right now.

Well, I'm mostly waiting for showstopping bugs and particularly seeing complete loot tables and full ulduar clear before I put stuff on the sig. I think FM swappery is a more generic problem that also applies to things like amplify magic. I mean usually it doesn't matter since all we truly care about is dps boosts, but still. In any case I am sure blizzard will notice in no time. Whether or not they decide to fix it though may be affected by how wide the issue is perceived.

Well, it's not an issue of them noticing. The bug was submitted during the PTR and acknowledge by a blue. So it has been entered into whatever tracking system they employ. (Of course, that might be bunch of post-it notes around a dev's monitor...)

I will say after a night of switching to spec 1 for FM, then spec 2 for FFB was a pain. The drain of mana to zero made the procedure:

swap to spec 1
eat/drink just enough to be able to cast FM
wait for mage target to be in range
cast FM
swap to spec 2
eat/drink to full mana

I was almost always one of the last people to be ready. I was on the verge of raising the ire of fellow officers. Of course, choosing to do this on a night of new bosses with wipes/bugging behavior--and thus having to do it many times might have been a bad choice. Doing it on a farm night where you only have to refresh FM every 1/2 hour might be more palatable.