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Old 04/18/09, 9:44 AM   #1516
Masaru
Von Kaiser
 
Draenei Death Knight
 
Mannoroth
EDIT - Apologies, I missed that someone had asked my same basic question with actual math.

Re cloak enchants, as an engineer I have access to the new Springy Arachnoweave chant (18 spell power). Rawr doesn't have this chant yet and I haven't seen any maths comparing it to the 23 Haste enchant. Can someone verify I'm calculating correctly?

1) Look at relative stat values in Rawr
(Spell power = 1.39, Haste = 1.12)

2) Calculate:
18x 1.39 = 25.02
23x 1.12 = 25.76

ergo, Haste enchant is still a bit better, especially since slow fall obviates the need for the /use

I understand that relative stat values change as gear does, but (please correct me if I'm wrong) as haste becomes more useful as spellpower increases, and given all gear has spellpower, it seems likely the 23 haste will always outperform the 18 sp.

Last edited by Masaru : 04/18/09 at 9:50 AM.

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Old 04/18/09, 1:43 PM   #1517
Insei
Glass Joe
 
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Blood Elf Mage
 
<Og>
Burning Legion
Originally Posted by Enthorn View Post
It also requires mirror images to attack the correct target (thanks for attacking those zombies on Gluth, really helps), not run in melee range (once they get in melee range, they tend to just stay there), not pull the boss/add (still can happen), and so forth. Did you also take into account that their Fire Blast damage was halved (supposedly from 200 per to 100)?
Despite Blizz supposedly 'fixing' some of mirror image's issues with threat, it's still a buggy ability that's barely worth the global and can/has wiped raids. I'm taking it off my bars and banishing it to spellbook only until something is done to improve it.

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Old 04/18/09, 3:01 PM   #1518
Enthorn
Don Flamenco
 
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Undead Mage
 
Dunemaul
While I've never wiped a raid with images -- I have heard of a boss doing some odd things in the past, such as making its way across the room to one-shot an image (which could wipe the raid on a number of fights, like Malygos if he breathes at the wrong time).

But just because I've heard of it happening (and not recently) doesn't justify removing its potential use. Mirror Images work perfectly fine with their fade mechanic in that regard. My comment that you quoted was in reference to a comment saying that if they survive for their full duration, their DPS is worth the global cooldown. But I don't use MI for DPS -- I'm quite sure many are the same way.

I would have pulled aggro every time on Sarth 3D if I hadn't of used MI. And it's certainly a fun ability for trash and AoE. It's not so buggy that you should feel you need to remove it from your bar. That's like saying you aren't going to use blink ever because it sometimes doesn't work.

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Old 04/18/09, 5:07 PM   #1519
Insei
Glass Joe
 
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Blood Elf Mage
 
<Og>
Burning Legion
Originally Posted by Enthorn View Post
While I've never wiped a raid with images -- I have heard of a boss doing some odd things in the past, such as making its way across the room to one-shot an image (which could wipe the raid on a number of fights, like Malygos if he breathes at the wrong time).

But just because I've heard of it happening (and not recently) doesn't justify removing its potential use. Mirror Images work perfectly fine with their fade mechanic in that regard. My comment that you quoted was in reference to a comment saying that if they survive for their full duration, their DPS is worth the global cooldown. But I don't use MI for DPS -- I'm quite sure many are the same way.

I would have pulled aggro every time on Sarth 3D if I hadn't of used MI. And it's certainly a fun ability for trash and AoE. It's not so buggy that you should feel you need to remove it from your bar. That's like saying you aren't going to use blink ever because it sometimes doesn't work.
I dunno about your images, but mine are naughty and like to wipe raids. It's happened to me a couple times. They pull a boss, they pull an add off a tank, they DPS things they shouldn't and boom, someone's biting my head off on vent for some buggy clones' actions I had no control over. And on the opposite end, I can't think of a time when having them was especially beneficial. I'm glad you've found uses for it, but I'm sure I'm not the only one who has had rotten luck with it. And as far as blink is concerned, one bugged blink might result in one dead mage, but not very likely a wiped raid. It's a personal weigh of cost vs. benefit, your mileage may vary

Last edited by Insei : 04/18/09 at 5:13 PM.

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Old 04/18/09, 5:25 PM   #1520
Pheroz
Piston Honda
 
Troll Mage
 
Malfurion
Can you give specific examples on when they've pulled aggro? I havent seen mirror images pull threat since the fixed the issue of them spawning with 133% of the mages threat.

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Old 04/18/09, 6:26 PM   #1521
Enthorn
Don Flamenco
 
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Undead Mage
 
Dunemaul
You'd have to have an absurd amount of threat lead over the tank for images to pull aggro. If your tank has 100k threat and you have 304k threat, then each image is receiving 100,320 threat, which won't pull aggro off the tank, as they aren't in melee range.

Then the question becomes: how did you get a 304% threat lead on your tank? If the answer is that you somehow had 100% crit rate for 15 seconds and your tank forgot to hit the target at all, then you should have used mirror images right from the start (and probably invis, hang out back, cuz you're going to wipe).

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Old 04/18/09, 9:10 PM   #1522
Duravi
Piston Honda
 
Undead Mage
 
Kalecgos
My guild is recommending adding improved blizzard to my FFB spec for the deconstructor fight. Is there a general opinion on this one way or another? I'm not convinced it even works on the adds since frost trap didn't appear to, but I won't be able to test this out for another couple of days.
There is absolutely zero reason you need imp blizzard in ulduar for anything. Frost trap, EB totem, frost nova, etc all work on those adds and they all die very fast.

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Old 04/18/09, 10:17 PM   #1523
Aeldaar
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Mug'thol
The Improved Scorch and Shadow Mastery debuffs can be up at the same time. Has anyone tested if they stack or overlap?

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Old 04/18/09, 11:04 PM   #1524
manly
Soda Popinski
 
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Troll Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
No its just yet another majorly annoying bug with scorchio2, if thats what you mean. And yes on scorchio it shows the shadow debuff as stacking to 5, which of course makes no sense. If only it would at least properly track living bomb.

<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS.
Very Manly Staff

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Old 04/18/09, 11:15 PM   #1525
Aeldaar
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Mug'thol
Originally Posted by manly View Post
No its just yet another majorly annoying bug with scorchio2, if thats what you mean. And yes on scorchio it shows the shadow debuff as stacking to 5, which of course makes no sense. If only it would at least properly track living bomb.
I'm using power auras, but believe I saw the actual debuffs on the default UI

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Old 04/19/09, 12:15 AM   #1526
Salus
Von Kaiser
 
Human Mage
 
Hyjal
I've literally tunred off everything except improved scorch stacks with Scorchio 2. It is far too inconsistent with everything else to be worthwhile until it is fixed. It's a shame, because it seems that when it is working as intended, it will actually be close to a "must-have" for fire mages.

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Old 04/19/09, 8:23 AM   #1527
 ash2ash
Operation Asian
 
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Undead Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Salus View Post
I've literally tunred off everything except improved scorch stacks with Scorchio 2. It is far too inconsistent with everything else to be worthwhile until it is fixed. It's a shame, because it seems that when it is working as intended, it will actually be close to a "must-have" for fire mages.
I am using classtimers. Does single target very well, I only wish that I could specify an option that prevented the bars from switching places depending on time left on debuff.

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Old 04/19/09, 11:38 AM   #1528
Shaewyn
Piston Honda
 
Draenei Mage
 
Malygos
Originally Posted by ash2ash View Post
I am using classtimers. Does single target very well, I only wish that I could specify an option that prevented the bars from switching places depending on time left on debuff.
Try using "sort by Maximum time" or "sort alphabetically" (I'm not sure of the exact option name), this works well for me.

The problem that I'm finding right now is that the "hot streak" default sound seems to have been changed and is much harder to hear.

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Old 04/19/09, 11:38 AM   #1529
hypetech
Don Flamenco
 
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Draenei Mage
 
Elune
With all the problems with Scorchio2, I'd recommend you guys try Burnout. I've been using it since early WotLK and I've never had a problem with it. Tracks scorch time left from any mage, living bomb time, and hot streak procs very well and easily noticeable. It's a great all in one mod. Burnout - Addons - Curse


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Old 04/19/09, 2:15 PM   #1530
manvswow
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Mage
 
Azgalor
Hey gang, just wondering if anyone know how I can setup rawr to optimize my frost mage for pvp, mainly arena? The only thing I tried was optimizing for survability but for the options, Im not sure what to fill in. I know rawr is for pve, but I heard its possible to use for pvp too. ANy suggestions would be appreciated. Thanks!

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