Mage: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 151

Light4 · 09/12/09, 3:31 PM

What about one of the Warlocks going Affliction instead of the mage being on scorch duty? Are there any numbers on this? I assume that unless an Elementary Shaman is also missing, Demo-WL is not really an option.

Mynak · 09/12/09, 4:33 PM

Meta/Ruin Warlocks are always the best rDPS option for the 5% crit debuff, even if an Ele Shaman is in the raid. The benefits of Demonic Pact for the raid are greater than the personal loss of DPS of the Warlock, and Shadowbolt is their main nuke covering the ISB debuff.

thunderstung · 09/12/09, 10:32 PM

Edit: Nevermind, covered in UI thread

OHWHATDA · 09/13/09, 5:29 AM

I answered my own question, deleted.

thescottmorton · 09/13/09, 1:07 PM

Originally Posted by Sinless

Why is it that every mage specced into 18/53/0 goes for 2/2 Flame Throwing instead of Dragon's Breath and Blastwave? I wouldn't ask this question if I saw at least a few mages here and there speccing into BW and DB, but nope. The spec is already as weak as it gets for AoE, why are we skipping these two hallmark AoE talents? 36 yard on your main nukes are enough in most every scenario and 30 yards on Scorch is not a game-breaker.

Anyone care to elaborate?

because you blizzard to Aoe. if you are DBing Or BWing it means you arent blizzarding = dps losss

Megarea · 09/13/09, 3:18 PM

As shown over in the Optimal Sets thread, enchanting your chest with +15 spirit and boots with +18 spirit becomes optimal when you reach 2pc. T9. (The bonus converts 15% of spirit into crit.)

1) Does that also mean it's best to shift a 18/53/0 FB-TTW build to 20/51, to max out 3 talent points in Student of the Mind?

2) When going for 20 points in Arcane, most people steal two points from Fire by losing Combustion (or Blast Wave if they have that instead) and 1 point out of Flame Throwing. But after 3.2.2, Combustion ceases to proc from Living Bomb and becomes a useful cooldown again. Does 20/51 with no Combustion still trump 18/53?

3) If Combustion becomes desirable again, where else is a viable place to steal a point from to max out Student of the Mind?

Mynak · 09/13/09, 6:34 PM

Originally Posted by Extrudedcow

Some quick numbers pulled from rawr based off my gear:

1 SotM: 6969.05 dps 773 spirit
3 SotM: 7005.96 dps 818 spirit

Two points of SoTM is only worth around .53% dps. In a 5 minute fight I would only need about 1.58 seconds of movement saved by flame throwing to compensate for the loss of spirit. Yes, with a very well oiled raid group I could see dropping flame throwing, but with a less than perfect group the ability to compensate for bad positioning is far too valuable.

A single botched spell or forced reposition due to range in an encounter is enough to give flame throwing an advantage over the second two points in SotM with my gear, and I suspect this is true with all gear levels. More important is that in situations where SotM has an advantage (no movement), it's a marginal improvement. However when flame throwing has an advantage (shadow crash at 40 yards), it can make a significant impact.

SotM is a terrible DPS talent. 20/51/0 with no Combustion is not going to outperform 18/53/0 and you should not be pulling out points to max SotM.

Megarea · 09/13/09, 7:58 PM

Originally Posted by Mynak

SotM is a terrible DPS talent. 20/51/0 with no Combustion is not going to outperform 18/53/0 and you should not be pulling out points to max SotM.

The post you quote was written a full month before 3.2.0 (and thus T9) arrived on the scene. At the time, it was completely correct. However, with the 2 pc. T9 bonus, spirit becomes a legitimate stat to stack, and SotM becomes much less of a joke. With my current gear, Rawr spits out 5337.15 dps for a standard 18/53 build versus 5347.41 with 3/3 SotM. In short, I think it's worth revisiting the point.

I had not, however, considered the DPS loss from losing a point in Flame Throwing; I will definitely weigh that when considering my options.

Kajall · 09/14/09, 11:18 AM

Originally Posted by Megarea

The post you quote was written a full month before 3.2.0 (and thus T9) arrived on the scene. At the time, it was completely correct. However, with the 2 pc. T9 bonus, spirit becomes a legitimate stat to stack, and SotM becomes much less of a joke. With my current gear, Rawr spits out 5337.15 dps for a standard 18/53 build versus 5347.41 with 3/3 SotM. In short, I think it's worth revisiting the point.

I had not, however, considered the DPS loss from losing a point in Flame Throwing; I will definitely weigh that when considering my options.

Which version of RAWR were you using? Because Combustion is being changed by 3.2.2 and thus your comparison will change depending on which version of Combustion it is using to model.

myztikrice · 09/14/09, 6:43 PM

15% of whatever extra spirit 3/3 SotM gave was only like 1% crit for me.

murk00 · 09/16/09, 11:28 AM

I'm just trying to look for ways to max my dps and was wondering if anyone uses any macros for fire like to cast pyroblasts or anything?

♦ Seonid · 09/16/09, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by Megarea

However, with the 2 pc. T9 bonus, spirit becomes a legitimate stat to stack, and SotM becomes much less of a joke.

Latest version of Rawr with my character shows that 3/3 SotM as 17.36 dps and with 2T9 as 20.71. It's still really not worth it for anything other than a filler to reach TtW.

Burra · 09/16/09, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by murk00

I'm just trying to look for ways to max my dps and was wondering if anyone uses any macros for fire like to cast pyroblasts or anything?

I do have a stopcasting macro for pyros, so I can get off the pyro if I'm in the middle of something else and need to get off a hot streak, or if the boss is about to die and my HSPyro will get off before the fireball does.

#showtooltip
/stopcasting
/cast pyroblast

Note: Don't use this if you're very far into a fireball, this can kill your damage if you don't have a proper amount of self-control (i.e. if you're 2.5 secs into a fireball cast, don't "munch" your own fireball by popping off the pyro).

Salus · 09/16/09, 3:35 PM

Originally Posted by Burra

I do have a stopcasting macro for pyros, so I can get off the pyro if I'm in the middle of something else and need to get off a hot streak, or if the boss is about to die and my HSPyro will get off before the fireball does.

#showtooltip
/stopcasting
/cast pyroblast

Note: Don't use this if you're very far into a fireball, this can kill your damage if you don't have a proper amount of self-control (i.e. if you're 2.5 secs into a fireball cast, don't "munch" your own fireball by popping off the pyro).

Or, better yet, don't ever do this. It has been said many times before, and I'll say it again. Stopping one cast to cast something else is always a DPS loss, don't do it. If the boss is going to die in the next GCD, you should've cast Fire Blast already, not queued up a useless Fireball.

Gukreb · 09/16/09, 3:58 PM

I am wondering if anyone has compiled a list of raid bosses where Amp/Dampen magic should be used? Clearly those bosses with lots of AoE raid damage are great for dampen (Hodir), but before I delve into determaning the amount of damage caused by each boss and the type of damage it is, I am hoping that someone out there has already done this work so I don't have to duplicate it.