Mage: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 2

aikiwoce · 11/17/08, 11:23 AM

Originally Posted by Light4

on TtW

From my tests on live, Infectious Wounds works with TtW and can be applied to bosses, at least to those in the Nexus or Utgarde low level dungeons.
This is however counterintuitive, as it would mean that the best situation for a raid would be TtW specced mages and the requirement to bring an IW specced druide along. If I understand Blizzard correctly, this is exactly not what they intended.

They are not Boss level mobs. I.E. They do not have a skull for their level. Instance Boss levels in WotLK. Which means that they are not subject to the same limitations I previously mentioned.

Light4 · 11/17/08, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by aikiwoce

They are not Boss level mobs. I.E. They do not have a skull for their level. Instance Boss levels in WotLK. Which means that they are not subject to the same limitations I previously mentioned.

Is the list a list of bosses where the limitations apply or don't apply?
So basically all Bosses should qualify for testing purposes. I guess the best way to test would be either MC or Alterac Valley.

Valean · 11/17/08, 12:57 PM

Okay, forgive me if this is posted in one of the other threads, but I'm looking for a couple quick answers.

Does anyone have a link to a 0/53/18 spec? I've got a basic idea of what talents I want but I want to ensure I snag all the right ones.

Also, hit rating for the same spec. I know with the removal of the 1% we could never get, Fire hit rating went from 164 higher, but exactly how high did it go? I've heard a few different numbers thrown out but I'm looking for a raw hit rating without considering any other class or race talents/racials.

diag · 11/17/08, 1:17 PM

My guildie told me that focus magic can always be casted on mage only:

2 mages : A<-->B
3 mages : A-->B-->C-->A
etc.

In this perspective, focus magic is a 6 % crit talent (and you will never benefit another classes!), will it make FB dps higher than FFB?

Pasture · 11/17/08, 1:52 PM

Originally Posted by diag

My guildie told me that focus magic can always be casted on mage only:

2 mages : A<-->B
3 mages : A-->B-->C-->A
etc.

In this perspective, focus magic is a 6 % crit talent (and you will never benefit another classes!), will it make FB dps higher than FFB?

Focus magic can be cast on whoever you want to cast it on. No need for them to be mage though it's nice to exchange with another mage and get 6% rather than 3%. I often throw it on a Boomkin or Enhancement Shaman.

And given that frostfire has awesome crit modifiers crit will probably benefit it more than any other spell.

Roywyn · 11/17/08, 3:03 PM

Originally Posted by Valean

Does anyone have a link to a 0/53/18 spec? I've got a basic idea of what talents I want but I want to ensure I snag all the right ones.

Also, hit rating for the same spec. I know with the removal of the 1% we could never get, Fire hit rating went from 164 higher, but exactly how high did it go? I've heard a few different numbers thrown out but I'm looking for a raw hit rating without considering any other class or race talents/racials.

Just grab everything that increases Frostfire Bolt damage and mana efficency.
Fire side lets you choose between "World in Flames" and "BW+DB+stuff", or grab both and lose range/pushback talents (not advised).
Frost is Ice Shards, Icy Veins, Elemental Precision, Piercing Ice. And Frost Channeling for mana, but you may also want 1 point in Imp. Blizzard and 3 points in Shatter if you go for more AoE power on slowable/freezable and less mana efficiency.
Or you cut Fire down to 51 to get 20 points in frost to get those AoE talents.

A sample of 0/53/18 with garbabe AoE would be Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Mage WotLK thread has a whole section for hit rating.

Originally Posted by diag

In this perspective, focus magic is a 6 % crit talent (and you will never benefit another classes!), will it make FB dps higher than FFB?

Check the mage post, Rawr, Simcraft, Magegraf or my signature.

Originally Posted by Light4

TtW

From my tests on live, Infectious Wounds works with TtW and can be applied to bosses, at least to those in the Nexus or Utgarde low level dungeons.
This is however counterintuitive, as it would mean that the best situation for a raid would be TtW specced mages and the requirement to bring an IW specced druide along. If I understand Blizzard correctly, this is exactly not what they intended.

What did you test it on?

It definately doesn't trigger Torment on the elite harpy on Storm Peaks.
She's not slowable, Infected Wounds do apply, damage is not increased.

Which bosses did it increase damage on for you, and how exact was your testing?

Valean · 11/17/08, 4:28 PM

Originally Posted by Roywyn

Just grab everything that increases Frostfire Bolt damage and mana efficency.
Fire side lets you choose between "World in Flames" and "BW+DB+stuff", or grab both and lose range/pushback talents (not advised).
Frost is Ice Shards, Icy Veins, Elemental Precision, Piercing Ice. And Frost Channeling for mana, but you may also want 1 point in Imp. Blizzard and 3 points in Shatter if you go for more AoE power on slowable/freezable and less mana efficiency.
Or you cut Fire down to 51 to get 20 points in frost to get those AoE talents.

A sample of 0/53/18 with garbabe AoE would be Talent Calculator - World of Warcraft

Mage WotLK thread has a whole section for hit rating.

Check the mage post, Rawr, Simcraft, Magegraf or my signature.

What did you test it on?

It definately doesn't trigger Torment on the elite harpy on Storm Peaks.
She's not slowable, Infected Wounds do apply, damage is not increased.

Which bosses did it increase damage on for you, and how exact was your testing?

Thanks for the help! One last question is spell rotation. Do I substitute FFB for Fireball in my Scorch x 5, Fireball x 7, Scorch x 1 rotation?

Sorry for sounding silly, I haven't raided seriously in about a year and lots of stuff has changed. I leveled to 80 as arcane but I've become frustrated with it.

Pheroz · 11/17/08, 5:34 PM

For the 0/53/18 Build that Roywyn Posted the single target boss DPS rotation is a little more complex then your used to, but it is still fairly simple.

Reapply Scorch before the debuff wears off, but as close to that time as possible.
If Living Bomb is not on the boss, reapply living bomb (as Mana allows, and use max mana consumables as needed to ensure that Mana allows)
If Hot Streak Has procc'd, cast an instant Pyroblast.
If not doing one of the 3 things above, spam Frostfire bolt.

Beyond that, there's cooldown management, movement issues and whatever other major issues you may have to contend with in an ingame, sustained DPS situation.

Jonny_Monroe · 11/17/08, 7:06 PM

I've been playing around with some FFb specs for instance and grinding and I've come across a point where I struggle to choose which tree's AoE I should be using.

-Blizzard's DPS is mad, but using it in solo situations requires 6 talent points I wouldn't otherwise take.
-Flamestrike, when stacking 2 ranks, is awesome DPS and most of the time I'm able to hit all mobs with it. I only really need 2 extra talent points to get it instant after a DB.
-Stacking both of the above in tanked, static AoE (like 4 mobs elite packs in violet hold) gives nice results but I'd rather cut the talents from either frost or fire and just focus on 1.
-I'm pretty sure my solo AoE won't be hurt from only using 1 of the above rather than both. Which leads me to:

Based on maths, anecdotal evidence or both; which AoE am I better off taking as Frostfire?

Fireflash38 · 11/18/08, 8:51 AM

Originally Posted by Jonny_Monroe

I've been playing around with some FFb specs for instance and grinding and I've come across a point where I struggle to choose which tree's AoE I should be using.

-Blizzard's DPS is mad, but using it in solo situations requires 6 talent points I wouldn't otherwise take.
-Flamestrike, when stacking 2 ranks, is awesome DPS and most of the time I'm able to hit all mobs with it. I only really need 2 extra talent points to get it instant after a DB.
-Stacking both of the above in tanked, static AoE (like 4 mobs elite packs in violet hold) gives nice results but I'd rather cut the talents from either frost or fire and just focus on 1.
-I'm pretty sure my solo AoE won't be hurt from only using 1 of the above rather than both. Which leads me to:

Based on maths, anecdotal evidence or both; which AoE am I better off taking as Frostfire?

Are you planning on AoE grinding? If not, then don't go for blizzard.

To get the full benefits of Blizzard, you need Permafrost, Imp Blizzard, Shatter, Ice Shards, Frostbite, Fingers of Frost, and Chilled to the Bone. No Frostfire spec will be getting those. Still, Blizzard is really powerful. so in instances with AoE, use Flamestrike to toss up the dot, then Blizzard, and repeat.

Dustwhisper · 11/18/08, 9:10 AM

Is a frostfirebuild really worth it pre-80? Right now experimenting with frostbuilds I'm having close to zero downtime with mage armor up. Nice critmodifiers and MOE I can see doing good but will it be as little downtime as frost equivalents (especially with clearcasting) ?

Lgs · 11/18/08, 10:39 AM

While raiding Naxx and OS last week, I noticed that scorch is taking longer to reapply itself. eg I the spell would leave with 1 second (and possibly more than 1 second in some cases) left on the debuff, and not be reapplied in time. Also, if cast in the middle of the timer it still takes a couple seconds for the timer to reset.

Is this for all scorches or just glyphed? I am hoping it's not just me.

LiquidHAL · 11/18/08, 11:44 AM

Originally Posted by Dustwhisper

Is a frostfirebuild really worth it pre-80? Right now experimenting with frostbuilds I'm having close to zero downtime with mage armor up. Nice critmodifiers and MOE I can see doing good but will it be as little downtime as frost equivalents (especially with clearcasting) ?

I would definitely not recommend it for leveling. The main DPS advantage is the big crits with ignite, but more often than not ignite will be wasted as regular mobs will simply die from the initial crit damage. That DPS advantage is also only calculated for bosses that are immune to freezing effects. With frost nova and WE's freeze you can always have shatter combos going off, pushing frost way ahead of FFB.

One of my favorite tools leveling was a fully talented blizzard (w/permafrost, frostbite, chilled to the bone, etc.), many quests can be completed in 1-2 pulls by just AOE'ing them down, and there are tons of random packs along the way.

I never even bothered looking at efficiency though. I quested and there's so much traveling time and a higher than previous percentage non-kill and vehicle quests that if you go through questing, you'll almost never have to worry about mana.

manly · 11/18/08, 11:50 AM

pretty sure thats the good ole buff/debuff delaying that has been pervading wow for quite some while.

Salus · 11/18/08, 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by manly

pretty sure thats the good ole buff/debuff delaying that has been pervading wow for quite some while.

I have seen this, but I always assumed it had more to do with latency than an actual bug. Given how heavy the load is on most servers right now, I would suspect a 1 second delay could easily be added into the equation.