Pheroz

When you have an ignite running on a boss, and crit cuasing another ignite, the damage is added together and it is kept as a single debuff/running tick.

The problem comes when dealing with spells with travel time (like fireball) that create a gap between the two times calculations are done (when spells leave your hands, when beuffs are calculated on the boss).

If you have a Fireball leaving your hands that is going to crit and change the value of the ignite on the boss, then fireblast which also crits, the fireblast will change the value of the ignite, then the fireball will change it again, but without the fireblast. So some damage can be lost due to 'ignite munching'.

Other peoples testing has indicated that in addition to losing damage to ignite munching, we also gain damage due to similar ignite bugs, and that it tends to average out to the appropriate damage done.

 

Toshimo

So, I'm still working myself into the FFB mage role as I didn't have any previous fire experience.

However, I get the feeling that I'm still missing something since my dps feels a little low.

Can you guys take a look at this WWS and let me know if I'm getting everything down correctly (with the obvious exception of the 1 odd fire blast)?

I'd like to make sure I'm playing the spec properly early so I don't get into bad habits.

Thanks.

 

Dankz

Its pretty hard to judge your dps since the WWS you posted isn't a kill. Your Missing Molten Fury range, Bloodlust, and 2nd Combustion + Icy Veins + MI. However I do see that you cast Living Bomb only 5 times on a 2:48 fight. And you missed one Hot streak Pyro. But without a complete WWS its impossible to give better feedback.

 

Sbo

Anyone know of a good mage buff/debuff timer mod?

See, I'm having this issue - my DPS is much much lower than it should be. My problem is pretty simple, in that I can't maintain more than 50% LB uptime over any one fight, and I'm missing some Hot Streak procs (or simply not getting them off fast enough).

I setup Elkano's Buff Bars and configured a few bars, one to show self-relevant buffs (Hot Streak) and one to show target debuff timers (Imp Scorch, Living Bomb, and for kicks Ignite). The problem with this is that it's showing all Living Bomb debuffs, not just mine - and all told there are three mages in any one raid. I lose track of which debuff is mine, don't recast it, or I think I recast it (but I cast it too early) and think that another debuff is mine.

Having a separate, clearly defined alert for Hot Streak helped immensely, but Living Bomb still isn't working out due to "which one is mine" syndrome.

I'm just curious how others here effectively manage their buff/debuff timers, namely as it relates to Hot Streak and Living Bomb.

 

Toonie

For Scorch and Living Bomb Scorchio2 works wonders.
For Hot Streak, Trinket Procs, etc I've set up Elkano's Buff Bars + Very obvious warnings in Parrot.

 

Swindley

I would highly recommend the mod "Needtoknow". It's incredibly simple to set up and can track any debuff/buff you want. Also only your own debuffs if you want. It's easy to make it track only your living bomb and ignore others. I also use it to track hotstreak, scorch, trinket procs, icy veins etc.
I also use another mod in addition to warn me of hotstreak. A loud voice goes "Hotstreak!", which is pretty cool and usefull. It's called MageAlert, and it works for fingers of frost, brainfreeze and missile barrage as well.

 

mystical

I use event alert puts the hot streak icon on my screen (hard to hear a ding in 25 mans) right in middle cant miss it usually

i have a quick questionl.. is it worth giving up frost channeling for playing with fire? the basic math says 1 mill damage = 30k extra damage with pwf. where as 10% mana reduction would = more dps in theory?

 

Sojik

In my opinion you want both. I don't see what talents you might want to grab that won't allow you to have both unless you're specing for better AOE which is useless since Blizzard is pretty powerful completely untalented.

Go with PWF if you MUST pick one. If you have mana issues, respec and give up World In Flames if you have it and grab Frost Channeling.

 

dmxcom

I have a Question to Manly´s Tip in his Signature.
I would build a Macro with
/cast Frostfirebolt
/use Crystallized Air
/use Eternal Air

But after the First Frostfirebolt, the Macro stopped to Use
the Crystallized/Eternal Air.
If i put an /stopcasting at the End, i cannot Spam longer the Macro.

Any Tipps ?

 

Soulfly

Perhaps change the order. I know for mine I use:

/use Eternal Earth
/use Crystallized Earth
/cast Frostfire Bolt

and I haven't had any problems.

 

dmxcom

I have try´t this also.

but when i spam the Button, it works only at the first cast.
All other actions where only ffb´s.
when i wait after the 1st cast until the castbar is faded, it works.
I want it, that it works when i spam the button.

 

LBXZero

Sbo, I have a suggestion for Living Bomb. The problem with the suggestion is that it does not help if someone is dispelling Living Bomb.

I have a macro like this for Living Bomb. Once I cast Living Bomb, the icon changes to Attack and will change back as long as I don't press the button for 12 seconds, duration of Living Bomb. So if I notice the LB icon is there, I can cast it safely. If I need to cast it immediately, I just hit it twice.

#show
/castsequence reset=12 Living Bomb, Attack

Attack is just a filler where the #show will show a different icon than Living Bomb if the timer is not up. It works for a decent in-game timer.

 

Shoein

Why would you want to know this? How would you react to it differently than when it's not up?

Just curious.

 

Roywyn

When a boss drops below 35% while your cooldowns come back up, you can wait until Sundial procs to blow all your cooldowns.
It very much depends on the fight, and you must make sure that don't actually lose out on ability uptime.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

Sbo

This is an absolutely ingenious solution. It requires a button on my currently non-existent bars, but it isn't another addon and further it'd work just about perfectly.

Don't get me wrong, I appreciate the earlier replies and will likely wind up trying out said addons/writing my own, but kudos for the ingenuity.

As a matter of fact, that'd integrate VERY nicely into an addon... hmm...

 

Roywyn

I did something like that to get a ghetto DoT timer to toy around with warlock specs.

I wrote Unknown instead of Attack, which gives me a big red question mark which made it stand out even more.


[Edit]: When you click it while in "Unknown" mode, the 12s timer resets to 0.
It does the same if "Attack" is added as second attack in the sequence if I'm not mistaken.

I guess it boils down to what you prefer as icon, or what deters you best from clicking it.

The Blue Bar and you - the complete Fire Mage 2.4 mana compendium: http://elitistjerks.com/658230-post3191.html

DPS spec and class comparison in Naxxramas gear: http://code.google.com/p/simulationc...i/SampleOutput

And [Timbal's Focusing Crystal] doesn't proc on AM.
Neither does [The Egg of Mortal Essence] since 3.1.

 

LBXZero

I have just tested Unknown. If you click it on Unknown, the cast sequence stays on Unknown and the timer until reset is refreshed to 0. Basically, if you hit it too early, you just locked out the button for 12 seconds from that time. Not too desirable to me.

 

Silabiss

I use Elk in exactly this way, but don't have an issue with it showing the LBs of other mages. I'm not at my home pc atm so can't check my setup, but could there have been a config option you missed for this debuff group? Or is your EBB an older version per chance?

 

Hipster

This is how I have EBB set up for Living Bomb. Right-click your bar group:

Filter >> Self Cast Buffs >> Whitelist

 

Incindia

I’m always reading that hit until cap is the most important stat – however when I review this WWS report a mage with a lot less hit than me is still pumping out the dps. I don’t think that there is too huge a difference our gear. (other than the hit)

WWS Report 12.23.08

So my questions are: is hit really that important?

**other difference would be he does tend to pull agro a lot, while I always watch my omen.

 

Dorrinal

Incindia I don't know which mage you're talking about so I made a quick glance at the log for both mages close to your damage and two things stood out to me: First, Kaser got in 20 more Pyroblasts than you. He also got about 20 more Hot Streak procs than you so I'd say that a good night with the RNG > Hit Rating. Secondly, Ocasturselfo barely cast Scorch at all. You and Kaser were his bitch.

 

LBXZero

Incindia, hit is important, but prioritizing one stat is a typical min/max error. As Hit increases, the potential boost of adding 1% in Crit increases.

Here is a similar problem. You have a square with lengths 2 by 2. Now I allow to lengthen a pair of sides of the square by up to 2. What would provide the greatest area? Adding 1 to length pairs and 1 to width pairs to make it a 3x3 square.

With Crit bonus under 100%, Hit is always better in improving DPS over Crit Rate. When it gets above 100%, it changes. For example, Burnout + Ignite is expected to yield a crit bonus of 145% gets a better DPS improvement from Crit over Hit until 30%. For Frostfire Builds, Crit is better until 53%.

But this is all percent-wise improvements. So the math really changes when you convert percentage boosts to point value.

I am using a simple formula of (1 + Crit Rating * Crit bonus)* Hit Rating.

 

spaace

Incindia,

I had no idea which "other" mage you were talking about, so I decided to get into the details of every mage in your raid. (Mostly because I look for tricks I can pickup and blend together) Would these "other mages were you talking about, happen to be FFB capped, rather then full out hit capped?

The first thing I noticed was DPS time, for specific bosses and everything. Overall, you and Kasar are the same, which resulted in being around the same amount of dps. ocasturselfo had a much smaller dps time (3% more. and yes, 3% does make up a nice chunk)

That would be more of a tank issue, rather then dps issue, unless he's attacking before the tanks.
I know myself, I have an issue with one of our tanks, where if he doesn't pop vigilance on me or our fury warrior, I'll be riding his threat in 100-120%, forcing me to stop and use invis before 35%

 

ravenndude

If you want it not to reset if you happen to hit that macro a couple times, you can just do what the multiboxing community does for their "round robin" macros

/castsequence reset=12 Living Bomb,,,,,,,,,,

You can now hit living bomb, get the red ?, then hit the button 10 more times without resetting the timer.

 

galzohar

A common mistake is to be too careful with threat. At least you're not using it as an excuse for bad dps. While pulling aggro is a bad thing even if your tank is bad, threat is never an excuse for having less dps than people of the same class, since if they could do that damage and lived to tell the tale, you could do at least as much as them without pulling aggro.

Looking at instructor, you had 3.2 min of actual casting time (based on how many and which spells you casted, before even factoring your haste gear), while the fight lasted 4:14, and this is on a fight with nothing that should really stop you from dpsing, not even threat. The top mage spent 3.65 min of actual casting time, 14% more than you, so unless he has 14% less haste that's something you should be improving. In fact, almost every time I looked at a WWS of someone who does bad on a regular basis (or even on a single occasion), I see he spends less time actually dealing damage than the higher DPSers. Gear differences, luck streaks and doing something like relying on scorch bitches tend to also play a part, however the time spent actually DPSing seems to be the #1 cause for people having different DPS.


Keep in mind that while 1% crit can get better returns than 1% hit, it also costs significantly more rating, so what you should really be comparing is 1 hit rating to 1 crit rating, which is why hit always wins if reaching the hit cap isn't trivial with your available gear.