ash2ash

Generally refreshing living bomb takes priority over HS pyro.

 

Moder

I know trinkets are somewhat bugged in Rawr. Being the only cloth DPS in a 10 man Ulduar the guildies showed Elemental Focus Stone in my inventory. I am caped on hit rate and play cookie cutter Arcane. I have a feeling I will get less DPS if I swap out my Dying Curse.

Am I right or wrong? Rawr 2.2.2 seems to back me up.

 

Pye

As long as you're still hitcapped Dying Curse will be better, because of the higher spd increase on proc.

 

ash2ash

It actually gives 522 haste rating, not 522 SP. Alacrity of the Elements is the name of the proc. Dying curse would still be better, apparently rawr is bugged.

 

Specks

Weird question... What do people suggest for a purely 10man raid spec in Ulduar: FFB or TtW/FB?

I've been assuming that FFB is the better choice due to the buff restrictions in 10man content and lack of gear when first entering the instance, but I'm simply not sure if TtW/FB would even be viable with BiS (BiS in 10man content that is).
EDIT: I don't put Arcane as an option because I would be maintaining the Scorch debuff.

 

Enthorn

Specks -- I have not had any problems in 10-man raiding as FB/TTW. You'll need tanks that can apply a snare debuff consistently (that doesn't mean just your main tank, because there are many other targets on a lot of fights). Warriors generally help for this due to Thunder Clap's AoE, but generally anyone will suffice as long as they stay alive.

I haven't had mana issues yet on any fights -- I do use T7 2P, but I would switch to T8 4-piece if it were available. I do not currently use mana potions either. In my particular 10-man, I don't have 3% hit from Misery/Faerie Fire, but I just swap out [Embrace of the Spider] and replace it with [Elemental Focus Stone]. It's an absolutely ridiculous amount of hit though, so I additionally have to swap out [Bindings of the Expansive Mind] for [Unsullied Cuffs].

I've generally seen better results with FB than I was seeing with Frostfire, and this is likely due to the higher crit rate of Fireball -- 3% from Focus Magic and 3% from Glyph of Fireball (vs Glyph of Frostfire). Because I'm still hovering at ~400 spirit, Glyph of Fireball was the clear choice over Glyph of Molten Armor.

I'm not sure I understand what you mean when you say you don't believe FB/TTW would be viable though. In what ways?

 

Specks

I mentioned it because I thought there might be mana issues since the gear is of lower 'quality', but you addressed that.

Also, according to your armory, you use your Glyph of Improved Scorch and I was curious if it was simply because of convenience? Would you drop it for Glyph of Molten Armor if you had more Spirit?

Another question out of curiosity, what buffs/debuffs are the typical ones you have in your 10man?

 

Enthorn

My 10-man consists of a prot warrior, prot paladin, 2x resto shaman, resto druid, 2x surv hunter, combat rogue, myself, and then either another rogue, or DK (tank), or warlock.

I use glyph of scorch because I'm the only one keeping up the debuff in 10-man (warlock isn't consistently there), and due to the number of targets in some fights, it's much faster than stacking 5 scorches. My 10-man isn't ideal for me sometimes, but I do get 2 mana tides, rejuvination (from resto druid or surv hunters), and mana spring (since I get kings instead of wisdom), so mana really isn't an issue. If it's absolutely an issue, I would get an innervate as well.

I wouldn't worry too much about gear to support FB/TTW. The main issue is your tank's ability to keep snares up on targets. Naturally, you should be able to get 3% hit to offset the loss from Elemental Precision, but even if you're slightly low, it should still be a DPS increase on single target -- on top of the 3% crit from Focus Magic you'll be giving someone.

Flamestrike Rank 8 and Rank 9 rotations work well for AoE. I generally avoid using Blizzard due to lack of talents that support it. Arcane Explosion suffices alright for close range, due to having 6% increased damage from Spell Impact, but I would still recommend LB/FS for AoE.

 

Schulzy

Armory Link: The World of Warcraft Armory

I am currently pulling ~2100 DPS in my 10-man raids, and I am unhappy with this number. I am using a cookie-cutter frostfire spec. Is this a bad spec to be using right now? I seem not to be doing terrible with my rotation (Keeping up LB and Scorch while shooting FFBs and Hot Streaks) and my gear seems to be okay. Nonetheless, I am made a fool of on the meters by boomkins and hunters, and people whom I should be out DPSing due to gear.

Where does my issue lie? Bad gear? Bad spec? Bad rotation? I'm posting here as a last resort, because I'm clearly missing something that isn't obvious to most people. I've scanned the forums here, but nothing seems to stand out as helping to fix my problem.

Please advise.

 

Hinalover

Your haste is real low. I would say, get your haste to 11-14% and you should be good. Plus your over hit for FFB spec. you only need 11% hit if you have a SPriest or Boomkin in your raid, unless your trying to get the hit gear to switch to TtW/FB Spec.

 

Magelove

Just out of interest sculzy where are you on the overall damage meter? It has been said before in these threads that dps on recount is not a good way of comparing yourself to other classes, only for comparing different specs of the same class. For instance, i was arcane pre patch, pulling 4k dps regularly on raids, but always 3rd-4th on the overall damage meters, i recently made the switch to fb/ttw, and although my dps has gone down, my overall damage has gone up. I would use wws reports if you want a more accurate analysis of how your doing in raids versus other dps classes.

 

Moder

Yesterday we failed on the Deconstructor 25 man. We had way to many scrapbots reaching the boss. Personaly I can't be responsible for more than my corner. I had horrible troubles handling bombs and scrapbots as arcane. the Arcane AoE slurps mana like no tomorrow and I can't help thinking about using a frost spec for that fight.

I was best cloth DPS on boss but I think the upside of less healing on the boss is more than my decreased damage on the boss. Do any of you guys use frost on Deconstructor?

 

Light4

I used frost in 10 Man, but Arcane in 25. I have no problems with mana, although I refrained from ABspamMBAM even during cooldowns. I typically evocate after the bombing and the use about 50% mana in the following phase.

As a side note: I normally run towards the bots and nova them in place where the come out of the scrap pile, if you time it right you can nova any remaining bots again near the boss.

 

Weepel

Short question:
To amp or not to amp in Ulduar?

 

TigaFin

You can still cast blizzard even if you are arcane specced. Quite a few arcane talents boost blizzard DPS and I don't think improved blizzard works on the bots. Frost/TTW benefits from the water elemental, but you get maybe one ranged freeze during each bot phase, because you also want the elemental DPSing the exposed heart.

 

mandachuwa

For deconstructor, I go frost as my main job as a mage is to keep the scrapbots from reaching him. We have enough DPS otherwise to kill him in a timely manner, and as frost I free up warlocks and the like to DPS the heart instead of helping out on the scrapbots. Going for improved Blizzard helps a lot in this fight, never mind that you also have another freeze from your elemental if things get bad.

 

Reltius

I would be interested in a discussion on optimal specs for various fights now that dual spec has been implemented.

Could someone who has access create a new thread in the Mage Discussion forums here to discuss this issue, I wasn't able to.

 

Northerner

FFB with Improved Blizzard and even Frostbite and Shatter is pretty much tailor-made for Deconstructor. You are afforded good burst for a heart phase and simply amazing tools for snaring, rooting and otherwise dealing with bombs and bots. It is overkill once you are used to the fight of course but definitely something to consider if you are initially having problems. Snaring and otherwise impeding the bots is not strictly needed but combining that with intelligent bomb use makes the time spent on them quite trivial.

 

Reltius

The reason for my asking is that yes there is obviously a more efficient spec for each boss, but if say, FFB is only the best on Deconstructor, then I would be more inclined to go Fireball and Arcane as my two specs. I would want to choose the top two specs used on the majority of fights.

So just hoping for a discussion to generate this list.

 

◊ manly

I'm not sure I get what you mean, but you seem to imply that you get more than one pack of scrapbots. If such is the case you're doing something wrong. (the piles only spawn mobs if decontructor is in range).
I personally believe one of the 2 mage specs has to be ffb. You can't always rely on TTW requirements to be met, and as such I wouldn't run both specs that rely on it. It also happens to be an interesting spec for aoe purpose and longevity, so I am not sure why you would be so fast to dismiss it away. But again, the choice of your spec varies a lot depending on your playstyle philosophies.

Log on with different model:
1- Create a character of the desired model. Log on/off.
2- At character selection screen, select your actual character; mouseover the new, desired model character, and hold down left click; hit enter and release left click at the same time.
bug Arcane Potency only applies to the first Arcane Missile bolt.

 

Enthorn

This is one of the reasons I've considered going back to Frostfire. The reliance on Torment the Weak is too much sometimes if tanks aren't always consistent. If I'm single targetting mobs on Freya or Auriaya, by example, a tank isn't always hitting them with a snare, even though Feral Defender is clearly up long enough to be hit with it.

I haven't really had mana issues, but I have had to use Evocation nearly every fight. Flamestrike can be especially brutal, especially when targets move at the last minute. They don't generally move enough to make Blizzard cumbersome. I do obviously see higher single target DPS with Fireball, but I'm already being passed by rogues and hunters on meters (and sometimes other classes... but I don't want to talk about it), that DPS isn't something I'm terribly worried about. In other words, I'm not trying to maintain a position -- I'm trying to do the encounter right (one of the reasons I don't even have a mod like Recount running).

And yeah... never knew about the deconstructor pile spawning thing. I guess I assumed it was random, but that's good to know.

 

Schulzy

@ Hinalover: Thanks for the advice, I didn't think that haste was a huge deal for my spec. As for the hit issue, I can't gaurentee Spriests or Boomkin in my group every run right now.

 

◊ manly

Well I had in mind more things like yogg tentacles where you generally won't have a tank on it. I mean it can be snared, but its just cumbersome. It isn't meant to be somewhat. Basically, any flying mob will have the same issue, or any mob that can't be tanked. As far as results go, even with FFB I think I've had excellent results. I certainly ain't complaining.

As far as playstyle philosophies goes, I do favor a lot builds that give consistent results. I mean I know all of mage TC revolves around providing optimal dps, and thats fine, however as far as I'm concerned the dps difference between the top 3 specs isn't really amounting to something big. The real difference is where they shine and where they don't, but outside of that they are all very similar. I mean I don't think a ffb mage is so much worse off than a fireball mage that you wouldn't invite one to a raid; or that that mage would specifically prevent the progression of the raid as a whole. Every bit helps, for sure, but as a player there is something else I value a lot. And thats where I repeat myself to say consistency. If all specs have similar results (on single target dps), then I don't really especially care to be, say, on par with #2 on dps, or to be vastly over #2 on dps. As long as I get in the ballpark. However, what I especially do not want to happen is to fall low on meters. I think most of the TC focuses on the high-end (top dps), whereas I prefer to work on the low-end of meters. This is where also I believe the difference is far more noticeable, and also where FFB gives really good consistent results. I do love arcane' flexibility as a whole, as I did condemn it somewhat as being too flexible, but to me its also a spec that relies a lot on evocation actually working, and ultimately it goes against my goals as a playstyle philosophy to always maintain the most consistent results.

Then again, I do get solid results as FFB so I realize my opinions are vastly tainted by that fact.

Log on with different model:
1- Create a character of the desired model. Log on/off.
2- At character selection screen, select your actual character; mouseover the new, desired model character, and hold down left click; hit enter and release left click at the same time.
bug Arcane Potency only applies to the first Arcane Missile bolt.

 

Swindley

I agree about FFB being a good spec in Ulduar.
Though I've only been up to Thorim so far, I've found FFB to be a far more versatile and usable spec than Fireball in general.

I keep Fireball as my offspec, and I have some spare hit gear, but I've more often found myself using FFB.

There's alot of aoe and add targeting which fireball performs worse for.
As FFB you can also afford stuff like recasting blizzard because the tank is moving.
You can also afford the mana to fireblast while moving (with a slightly stronger fireblast) which is something that I use in nearly every single fight in Ulduar with all the movement.
Not to mention the same reason arcane works well. The needed burst in some phases makes FFB a very good spec. Not only because of Icy veins, but also because TTW might not be up from the first seconds. (I don't know if thunderclap would be the first thing a warrior would cast for example)

I'd still concider all 3 specs solid in Ulduar, and I guess people serious about pve might have 2 pve specs anyway.

 

Phatpharm

For Deconstructor: We run with 2 dps and a healer designated for each corner. I am fine as arcane. I DPS the heart until I see the second (spawning) spark on my heap. Then I blink (if scrapbot) to root them as far away as I can, this can buy you the CD time for a second root if needed. I preserve my PoM for a FS then blizzard, finish off with a few running AEs.

Another trick if the Bomb comes first is to lock it down, and pop it when the scrapbots come close, the AoE will kill them.

If the side (north to south) close to you is getting slammed, and yours is not, save your nova to root any incoming scrapbots.

I don't think theres is any perfect time to Evocate, but do make sure you have at least half your bar when engaging the adds.