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Old 12/23/08, 4:00 AM   #26
Einhander
Von Kaiser
 
Human Mage
 
Гордунни (EU)
Originally Posted by LBXZero View Post
But why should mages be close to tanking?..
Vek'nilash, Krosh Firehand, Zerevor and even heroic Razuvious - all tanked by me. But neither of those require any resists at all, with exception of Vek'nilash if you are still 60lvl.

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Old 12/23/08, 7:23 AM   #27
threep*
Von Kaiser
 
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Human Mage
 
Eredar (EU)
Please remember that at both mage-tank encounters in TBC resistance was worthless. Fire or arcane resistance had no effect on the dmg from krosh or council.

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Old 12/23/08, 10:05 AM   #28
Pasture
Don Flamenco
 
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Blood Elf Mage
 
Steamwheedle Cartel (EU)
Perhaps there'll be more fights along the lines of SSC Leo for warlocks. Mages will be a natural choice for resistance tanking. The only problem I can forsee in these circumstances is keeping threat.

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Old 01/01/09, 2:03 PM   #29
Nemantopia
Piston Honda
 
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Undead Mage
 
Moon Guard
As a side note Molten Shields and Frost Warding provide similar protective benefits, as do the glyphs for the improved wards. I'm currently using a Fire raiding build that has both [what ELSE was I going to take to jump from Precision to Icy Viens?] as incidental talents, and in fights involving Fire or Frost the wards become amazingly powerful. And I don't just mean 'hey, look, I reflected that Pyroblast back into his FACE!', I mean as raid DPM/DPS are concerned. Obviously, most fights won't see a benefit here, but element heavy fights allow you to turn direct damage into DPS potentially worth the cost of the cooldown and any damage into potential mana gains [like Magic Absorption can]. The idea of the shield paying for itself or boosting your DPS is clearly a fight specific, RNG based trick, but I have actually used it just in Heroic Nexus and noticed significant returns from using Wards: Instead of being at about 1/4th of my mana at the end of the fight, I was nearly topped off and never had to use Evo (I was still relearning my casting cooldowns and priorities, so that meant a lot at the time ^_^; ).

Assuming you're passing up Playing with Fire [because playing with fire can get you kilt!], you can get a reasonable raiding build that combines the benefits of all this together, but sacrifices AoE potential to become specifically a single-target raid DPS bugger that has less to fear from magic dangers in fights [like mana drains, raid-wide magic damage, etc.]. Note that this IS effecitvely a gimmick spec, despite having most of the DPS boosters fire can take. You lose Playing with Fire, both fire AoEs, the possibility of insta-flamestrikes, any survival or DPS Fiery Payback grants, range, BT, and gets no Blaz*cough*Fire Blast CD reduction.

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Old 01/01/09, 6:33 PM   #30
Sunfire
Von Kaiser
 
Blood Elf Mage
 
Crushridge
I'll bite on this thread a little ....

I'm not saying it would be in any way the best use of resources / slots / points etc .....

BUT you could get your resists over 300 by using the Flask (which does stack w/ totems or MOTW) and some Void Spheres.

I've never specced arcane myself so I have a somewhat naive question - does the Incanter's Absorption talent work off resists or only off damage your Mana Shield absorbs?

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Old 01/02/09, 3:32 PM   #31
TitanHawk
Glass Joe
 
Troll Mage
 
Lightninghoof
It does not work off of resists, only absorbtion effects (Sacred shield, mana shield, frost ward, fire ward, ect)

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Old 01/02/09, 4:13 PM   #32
LBXZero
Von Kaiser
 
Gnome Mage
 
Garona
My comment about mages being caster tanks was sarcasm, but...

Think of Magic Absorption + Mage Armor as your primary mana regen. You add Mana Shield and Incanter's Absorption to increase damage, which would increase threat. With other Arcane talents, you can build an Arcane mage meant to be a caster tank given you can find the gear to give those serious boosts to spell resistances and complementing buffs or auras.

The trick for aggro management for a mage is to be the first one to do damage. After that, the mage should have Improved Magic Missile. The problem is getting silenced, and I do not know if Firey Determination has been improved yet.

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Old 01/08/09, 2:42 PM   #33
bombdigie
Banned
 
Human Mage
 
Cenarius
I don't believe that frost, fire, or frostfire builds need mana. With proper replenishment I've never found myself even needing to evocate, even on Sarth +3 Drakes.

However with an arcane talent build this talent is probably manditory.

As a frost and fire spec, you might as well get it, not so much for the mana regen, but for less strain on healers. Although atm CoH and WG make healing a joke, but when its nerfed its going to be hard on healers and making it easier on them with 2 talent points if you are putting in arcane anyway is a good idea imo.

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Old 01/19/09, 9:41 AM   #34
Thegoodman
Piston Honda
 
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Gnome Mage
 
Daggerspine
Originally Posted by Pasture View Post
Perhaps there'll be more fights along the lines of SSC Leo for warlocks. Mages will be a natural choice for resistance tanking. The only problem I can forsee in these circumstances is keeping threat.
This could easily be fixed by a steal-able threat generation buff.

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Old 01/23/09, 3:42 AM   #35
t3hmarken
Glass Joe
 
Human Mage
 
Medivh
Well, I tried out a magic /incanter's spec tonight and did 10man naxx. We had some new people and had trouble with tanking zelik and blamaux, so i went back there and tanked. Zelik was painful, but blamaux I was resiting 1/3 of the dmg from every shadow bolt.

And there were actually a lot more fights with chances to pop wards and mana shield to absorb some damage and boost my spell power. Sapphiron obviously, and frost ward during KT worked well during the frostbolts that came out occasoinally.
Maexxna I mana shieled and grabbed te spider adds. AoE burned them down and gained a decent spell buff.
Thaddius I popped mana shield when polarity got highly stacked on one side (6-7) and absorbed the chain lightning for some nice buffs.
Grobbulus I popped mana shield when I got injected and came back to the fight with some extra spell dmg.

During sapphiron it helped with survival a lot. With a short evocate cooldown, I used frost ward whenever it was up, and if blizzards got bad I would also pop mana shield (since mana shield scales with spell power, i got extra protection for keeping frost ward up before hand).

At any rate, I was quite satsified with speccing for absorption for raiding; I ran some BGs earlier in the day and it was a great boost there as well.

However, I did give up Icy Veins for the spec, so I'll have to try out a spec this weekend using IV instead of absoprtion and see how things are.

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Old 01/23/09, 11:23 AM   #36
Sinless
Piston Honda
 
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Troll Mage
 
Frostwolf
Considering the global cooldown you spend casting the wards or mana shield, dropping IV just to pick up absorption is certainly not a good idea from a PvE point of view.

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Old 01/23/09, 5:54 PM   #37
Tyrian
Bald Bull
 
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Human Mage
 
Frostmourne
Magic Absorption is interesting: it really is a fun talent we'd all like to have, but it can be frustrating to squeeze 2 points free for it from a DPS focused Arcane build.

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