First, yes i know the thread about Rolling Ignite: are they back? but the posts are not really applicable to WotlK.
I have actually 702 Crit rating and my crit frequency climb higher and higher. However what are yours strategies to avoid ignite munching?
I've thinked about FFB+FFB (Hot Streak) -> Scorch -> Hot Streak Pyroblast -> FFB but the results of some dps tests are not really meaningful.
(Hot Streak -> LB refresh -> HS Pyro is artlessly natural)
On a similar note with the above poster, so is it always good to use scorch before the instant pyro, even if you just scorched right before hand (scorch -> ffb, another proc) [assuming that living bomb is still up] or would be throwing a fireblast or some other spell be more worth while?
You would be casting far too many scorches if you did that. It made more sense back in TBC when crit rates were low, but theses days I doubt its really an option. Of course, if youre near due a scorch refresh, might as well go for it.
In any case, keep in mind ignite munching, when it happens, seems to give a 2% dps variance. I have not seen any data going above 2% averaged. It can go 2% your way, or 2% against you (since both free ticks and munching exists). Its not going to majorly ruin your dps.
<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS. Very Manly Staff
I'm sure someone has checked this already but has anyone considered the possibility of Flask of Pure Death working improperly with FFB mechanics and double dipping?
It probably isn't the case since FFB should only be dealing 1 type of damage (whichever the mob is more susceptible to) but I was sitting here at work and wondering about the EP "bug" and was just wondering if anything else might be beneficially effecting FFB.
The dps difference between 10 and 25 man is pretty staggering. I pretty much do nothing but 10 mans minus a couple 25 man pugs I do every once and a while. It's just really hard to cover all the possible buff categories with only 10 people. I was around 3100 dps on patchwerk last week in 10 man minus quite a few huge upgrades I'm missing. In a pug 25 man Archavon, I was close to 4000 dps with the same gear. Seems like elemental shaman are just amazing to have in 10 mans since they cover so many buff categories by themselves: +5% crit, +3% crit debuff on boss, +spellpower from flametongue, +5% spell haste from wrath of air, and bloodlust. Just missing the +13% spell damage, +3% haste, and +3% hit. Moonkin can cover all 3 of those. Assuming at least 1 mage (yourself), an optimal spell damage 10 man raid would consist of:
Mage
Moonkin
Elemental Shaman
There obviously are other combinations that cover all the buff categories but bringing those 3 would be pretty kick ass.
It probably isn't the case since FFB should only be dealing 1 type of damage (whichever the mob is more susceptible to)
The tooltip for FFB has been outdated since WotLK was in Alpha. the spell has practically always done Frostfire (or Frost+Fire, as it was called in early alpha) damage, not Frost or Fire damage. Again, the part of the tooltip that says "If the target is more vulnerable to Frost damage, this spell will cause Frost instead of Fire damage." should be ignored as it has no relevance to the actual functioning of the spell. Might want to add that to the first post.
As far as double-dipping from Flask of Pure Death, you can test that easily, but I'd be surprised if the devs missed that. Elemental Precision is another story...a story for manly's sig, imo.
Edit: I see the Zaldinar post you linked on page 1 does clarify the damage type used by FFB, it seems people just haven't read it.
The tooltip for FFB has been outdated since WotLK was in Alpha. the spell has practically always done Frostfire (or Frost+Fire, as it was called in early alpha) damage, not Frost or Fire damage. Again, the part of the tooltip that says "If the target is more vulnerable to Frost damage, this spell will cause Frost instead of Fire damage." should be ignored as it has no relevance to the actual functioning of the spell. Might want to add that to the first post.
As far as double-dipping from Flask of Pure Death, you can test that easily, but I'd be surprised if the devs missed that. Elemental Precision is another story...a story for manly's sig, imo.
As far as I know, school-specific damage does not double dip from ffb, and I personally tested. However, I do admit it wasn't extensive tests to the point where I checked how it was done. If I recall zaldinar tested it in depth, and posted the results. If I recall correctly, it takes the highest fire or frost spell damage from every piece of gear and every buff, and uses that. In other words, you could mix and match gear with both pure frost damage and gear in pure fire damage and end-up 'winning' through ilvl formula abuse.
<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS. Very Manly Staff
On these mobs I am abandoning LB since the mob is never alive long enough for it to explode. ?
Thanks.
One technique that is useful in 5 mans and probably can be applied to raid trash is to not LB the targeted mob, but instead the 2nd or 3rd target. Tank AOE threat is really good on the first 3 targets, you won't pull the mob off it with just LB, but it'll do all its damage and blow up on the pack reliably. More than one LB per trash pack isn't recommended.
AOE is always worth it on trash mobs if it does more than your single target dps. I actually use AOE a lot more on 2-3 trash pulls these days because the threat is strong on them. I have to be more cautious on the really big pulls unless they're so weak they'll just die before they get to me if I pull aggro.
You should pay more attention to my signature. It tends to include broken stuff, and usually it gets fixed too.
(except maybe for when I put rune of razorice eventually)
<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS. Very Manly Staff
I have a noob quest i couldn't find this answer anywhere.... i been looking for day does Arcane Focus give hit rating to all spells or only to arcane spells? if ur taking FFB spec
I have a noob quest i couldn't find this answer anywhere.... i been looking for day does Arcane Focus give hit rating to all spells or only to arcane spells? if ur taking FFB spec
It has always been only arcane spells. Until someone has proof that this is not the case, which AFAIK hasn't been posted on this forum ever.
Is it generally accepted that Fire Blast should always be used when you're forced to move? I'm having huge problems keeping up with others as Frostfire and am certain I'm missing something huge.
Is it generally accepted that Fire Blast should always be used when you're forced to move? I'm having huge problems keeping up with others as Frostfire and am certain I'm missing something huge.
Well, if an encounter forces raid members to move it should be common sense that doing something is always more beneficial than doing nothing. Your only options are either re-applying living bomb if it just wore off or fireblasting on the move. Without a WWS parse it's hard to tell where the huge difference is coming from.
Also, that's more for the simple answers/questions thread, but well ....
I'm having huge problems keeping up with others as Frostfire
The two prime factors for people asking things like this (assuming they are mostly competent at the basics of playing FFB) are: Your gear, your FFB crit % rate and your raid composition (which ties back into the aforementioned point). Not necessarily in that order, either. Things like should I Fireblast when moving - are just trivial by comparison.
As the typical frostfire spec, has anyone done any math regarding how much of a dps increase the chaotic skyflare meta gem and the 4 piece tier 7 bonus actually are? The tier 7 helm just won't drop for me so I'm wondering if it would actually be a dps increase to use an inferior helm that has a meta socket just to take advantage of the skyflare meta gem.
Hoffski, a quick search for "chaotic skyflare" answers your question, leading you to the following post. As for what item to use while you wait for a drop... the first page of another thread answers that.
Hoffski, a quick search for "chaotic skyflare" answers your question, leading you to the following post. As for what item to use while you wait for a drop... the first page of another thread answers that.
Thanks. Probably gonna clear Nax tonight. If it doesn't drop again I'll probably just craft myself the [Hat of Wintry Doom] until I can get my hands on it. What about the 4 piece set bonus? The bonus has similar wording to the meta gem, but according to the first post doesn't give nearly as much benefit to frostfire bolt even though it's 5% compared to 3% on the meta. Hopefully the helm will be my 4th piece and I can knock both bonuses out with one item.
You should pay more attention to my signature. It tends to include broken stuff, and usually it gets fixed too.
(except maybe for when I put rune of razorice eventually)
On the topic of your signature, why do we not want it to apply to frostfire, isn't it working as intended to increase damage done, or is causing us to do less damage somehow because of how which type of spell will hit harder?
More likely because it relies on a single class/player with a specific rune (of which they might prefer others) to gain said benefit. It's nothing like the old COE issue, but it's a small footstep in that direction for those who really like to min/max thoroughly. A quick glance at rune of - Wowhead Search reveals nobody else besides frost/frostfire mages stand to lose anything (on the same level as up to +5% damage) from not having a DK with a specific rune in the raid.
More likely because it relies on a single class/player with a specific rune (of which they might prefer others) to gain said benefit. It's nothing like the old COE issue, but it's a small footstep in that direction for those who really like to min/max thoroughly. A quick glance at rune of - Wowhead Search reveals nobody else besides frost/frostfire mages stand to lose anything (on the same level as up to +5% damage) from not having a DK with a specific rune in the raid.
Ahh okay, I understand. So basically it is because it is a specific buff that only a single class can bring is what makes it unfair/improper (and that it only benefits other frost DKs and frostfire/frost mages).
Well, I specifically left out frost mages because I think frost mages could use the dps boost. However, even for frost mages, it sets a bad precedent. The problem is, if you need an esoteric debuff to compete on dps it
1- goes against the buff/debuff homogeneisation principles
2- forces you to have a DK with rune of razorice in the raid before inviting (non-arcane) mages, which is equally bad
However, right now I think the only place it proves to be problematic is for FFB specifically. Are we really looking forward to patchwerk parses of mages using rune of razorice + (loatheb spore or the metanoia buff) ? Because I know people will. And I know people will keep using those as a 'please nerf mages heres the definitive proof something is broken'.
So yeah, rune of razorice working with DKs, thats fine with me (even though somewhat bad for the same reason). It really ought to be a self-only debuff.
<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS. Very Manly Staff
Imagine Mage Armour applied a raide-wide aura that increases damage done with dagger attacks by 5%.
You think that's completely dumb and doesn't make any sense at all?
Well, that's pretty much how Rune of Razorice works.
2T7 and 4T7 values
In currently obtainable raid gear, 2T7 is 75 DPS and 4T7 is 55 DPS. Roughly. If yours are vastly different, update Rawr
You can see their value in Rawr when picking "Chart: Buffs > All Buffs" on the big window on the right in the long list.
Mage DPS parses
Well, parses of the "Top DPS" will always be problematic for mages, because Frostfire DPS is so extremely volatile due to crits.
Check Simcraft in my Signature. FFB Mage - 5177 DPS +/- 809, Shadow Priest - 4911 DPS +/- 296
The expected deviation of FFB specs is 2-3 times that of Shadow Priests. Also, every Mage is Frostfire while not every Priest is Shadow, increasing the gap between top and average even further.
That means when the best parses of Shadow Priests are perhaps 5% above their expected DPS, the best parses of Frostfire Mages are nearly 15% above their expected DPS.
So, in Top Class DPS Charts, Mages will always be relatively higher than in Average Class DPS Charts.
There will be Patchwerk parses with 75% crit chance and everyone crying Nerf.
But nobody will see the corresponding parses with 35% crit chance on the bottem which balances it.
Razorice 2T7 and 4T7 values
4T7 is 55 DPS. Roughly. If yours are vastly different, update Rawr
You can see their value in Rawr when picking "Chart: Buffs > All Buffs" on the big window on the right in the long list.
Finally I found some numbers!
But I expected them to be higher.. since T7 Chest+Hat are about the worst slot choice ever with that 60+spirit, it might be at least as good to pick random items (e.g. Malygos Chest, Gothic Hat) instead? I'll just find some more numbers
12/08/08, 2:10 PM
