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Old 01/23/09, 1:34 PM   #751
sirrand
Glass Joe
 
Gnome Mage
 
Elune
WoW Meter Online - The Best World of Warcraft Combat Log Analyse System!Fully support Wrath of the Lich King!
My latest parse from Patchwerk, this was also before I picked up Gothik's Helm, also missing a Elemental Shaman for raid buffs, they seem so hard to find. I see that i only had 1 combustion, should have been able to squeeze 2 in there, and my weak point is keeping Living Bomb up as much as possible, just wondering if some of the guys on here could give me a few tips/thoughts, I'd love to push past that 5k mark on this fight.

Also, I currently run my "Boom" macro in this order, Combustion, IV, Mirror Image, FFB, if I wanted to add a Speed Potion and my Mana Gem in there as well is there a optimal order to include all those items?

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Old 01/23/09, 3:03 PM   #752
solbergb
Don Flamenco
 
Gnome Mage
 
Earthen Ring
Speed potion probably shouldn't be in a general purpose macro like that, unless you never fire it until you're in the molten fury range. It's very short duration and once/combat. Me, I like to see how the combat is going manawise before pulling the trigger on the speed potion. As the fight is in execute phase, I can judge whether my mana will hold out or needs a pot, and if it doesn't need a pot, I'm free to toss a haste potion on the fire.

The order in the macro normally doesn't matter, it's supposed to execute everything simultaneously, ending with the first thing in the macro that causes a gcd.

I don't like mirror image as part of a generic boom macro, I feel it is too useful as a threat tool to waste as a tiny dps enhancer. There are differences of opinion on that point *shrug*.

Note that combustion and icy veins have different cooldowns, so they'll only stack the first time you fire that macro. You might also consider stancking in any clicky-stuff you have on your gear (eg, /use 13 /use 14 for your two trinket slots, /use 10 if you have hyperspeed accellerators on gloves etc). Trinkets can't be used simultaneously but if you are tying this to your main frostbolt key, they'll fire "whenever they're up" and will stack the first time you use them.

One thing your'e not stacking is your mana gem (assuming you have 2T7 bonus). I've been having enough mana to pop that and other cooldowns with my first frostbolt (after living bomb/scorch take a bit of mana away and allow firing the gem) and still get it to fire a second time in execute phase on most boss fights. I have not got mana gem and mirror image to work in the same macro though, so you may have to separate that out.

You're correct that your living bomb uptime is lacking. You had only 3 hits in 4 minutes, so it's only up 1/8 of the time. Scorchio 2 will help with that, as would other mods that track dots.

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Old 01/23/09, 5:22 PM   #753
Reeshet
Piston Honda
 
Human Warlock
 
Emerald Dream
Originally Posted by Faceprint View Post
but it doesnt make sence.

Also, it seems to me your formula is flawed, unless im doing it wrong which i dont see how.

i plug in my numbers into the haste formula, and get ~9k... which is so wrong...

I ((1+0.1)/(780/(0.86+1945))3278.998947 = 8898.1028... im sure 1 haste =/= 9k spell power.
I can see you've already been banned for bad math, but in case someone else is making the same mistake

m/r + d is NOT the same as m/(r+d). m/r + d using your numbers is 2851.9767. m/(r+d) is about .400851

Dividing by .4 instead of 2852, you expect to get bad numbers. You're not allowed to just add parentheses wherever you like. Like gravity, it's not just a good idea, it's the law.

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Old 01/23/09, 5:43 PM   #754
manly
Soda Popinski
 
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Troll Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Reeshet View Post
I can see you've already been banned for bad math, but in case someone else is making the same mistake

m/r + d is NOT the same as m/(r+d). m/r + d using your numbers is 2851.9767. m/(r+d) is about .400851

Dividing by .4 instead of 2852, you expect to get bad numbers. You're not allowed to just add parentheses wherever you like. Like gravity, it's not just a good idea, it's the law.
Aw, just when I thought I had found a loophole that made 2 crit rating worth 3000 spell damage !

<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS.
Very Manly Staff

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Old 01/26/09, 3:49 AM   #755
 ash2ash
Operation Asian
 
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Undead Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by solbergb View Post
Speed potion probably shouldn't be in a general purpose macro like that, unless you never fire it until you're in the molten fury range. It's very short duration and once/combat. Me, I like to see how the combat is going manawise before pulling the trigger on the speed potion. As the fight is in execute phase, I can judge whether my mana will hold out or needs a pot, and if it doesn't need a pot, I'm free to toss a haste potion on the fire.

The order in the macro normally doesn't matter, it's supposed to execute everything simultaneously, ending with the first thing in the macro that causes a gcd.

I don't like mirror image as part of a generic boom macro, I feel it is too useful as a threat tool to waste as a tiny dps enhancer. There are differences of opinion on that point *shrug*.

Note that combustion and icy veins have different cooldowns, so they'll only stack the first time you fire that macro. You might also consider stancking in any clicky-stuff you have on your gear (eg, /use 13 /use 14 for your two trinket slots, /use 10 if you have hyperspeed accellerators on gloves etc). Trinkets can't be used simultaneously but if you are tying this to your main frostbolt key, they'll fire "whenever they're up" and will stack the first time you use them.

One thing your'e not stacking is your mana gem (assuming you have 2T7 bonus). I've been having enough mana to pop that and other cooldowns with my first frostbolt (after living bomb/scorch take a bit of mana away and allow firing the gem) and still get it to fire a second time in execute phase on most boss fights. I have not got mana gem and mirror image to work in the same macro though, so you may have to separate that out.

You're correct that your living bomb uptime is lacking. You had only 3 hits in 4 minutes, so it's only up 1/8 of the time. Scorchio 2 will help with that, as would other mods that track dots.
Mirror image is wierd because it triggers a GCD on spells that don't have a GCD (bug?) - try using MI with all your bars visible and you'll see that spells that normally show a refresh animation during a GCD will not refresh but all your spells off the GCD will (IV, combustion, combustion etc.) This is the opposite behavior of any normal spell that triggers a GCD (your normal spells will refresh but your spells off the GCD will not)

I usually have a separate key bound for MI, then have a macro that does IV, Combustion, Managem, /use 13, /use14 (trinkets), and then starts casting FFB. None of these trigger a GCD

I also have a separate macro that does the same thing except adds a speed pot which doesn't trigger a GCD either.

I have had instances where using these macros occasionally drops one of my cooldowns. I have no idea why this occurs.

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Old 01/26/09, 8:11 AM   #756
Pintofbrew
Now with Karate Grip! (TM)
 
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Orc Death Knight
 
Frostwhisper (EU)
This is not the only reason to avoid having MI in a macro. Everything else will cool at a different rate (most likely a faster one) and while pushing your macro with Combustion still cooling (or speed pot, or managem, or whatever) it'll just ignore it and do the rest, if you push the macro with MI in it and it's cooling it'll not read past that point in the macro and you'll end up with an error message, half your cool-downs going off, and no casting.

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Old 01/26/09, 5:54 PM   #757
YttriumIRL
Glass Joe
 
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Blood Elf Mage
 
Frostwhisper (EU)
I use a simple macro really which contains all of these, but just relies on the secondary button press. This macro is brilliant because depending on what I need, I can use all at the same time, or split it and use them at different times. I usually will pop a haste pot just before going into combat assuming I trust my tank, otherwise I will just save it. I have never had this bug out with GCD or just general errors, ocassionally FFB won't cast because I am spamming with more than 1 modifier left held down. Even though I have this macro, I do have all trinkets and abilties bound to separate keys on my right hand just incase.

#showtooltip
/use [mod:shift] 13
/cast [mod:shift] Icy Veins
/cast [mod:shift] Combustion
/cast [mod:alt] Mana Sapphire
/cast [mod:ctrl] Mirror Image
/cast Frostfire Bolt

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Old 01/26/09, 8:21 PM   #758
semanteme
Glass Joe
 
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Blood Elf Mage
 
Dreadmaul
Originally Posted by ash2ash View Post
Mirror image is wierd because it triggers a GCD on spells that don't have a GCD (bug?)
Isn't this only true with certain spells? I remembered GCDs being triggered when I first tried to cast Combustion
with it (by clicking on one than the other >_>). Then I put it in the same macro with IV, and it worked fine. I think it was having IV in between MI and Combustion that did it for me, so I guess its a matter of putting something that doesn't bug MI out between it and other spells that does.

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Old 01/27/09, 2:17 AM   #759
druicifer
Glass Joe
 
Tauren Druid
 
Thrall
Relative values of stats

Where can I compare the relative values of haste/crit/hit/SP with my current stats? I'm not too great at crunching numbers, is there a site with a calculator?

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Old 01/27/09, 6:21 AM   #760
Tenspeed
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Mage
 
Archimonde
Sorry if this was covered, I think I read something about it but I can't find it now. During a Lust/IV is it still optimal to be casting LB? Also does Lust or IV affect GCD haste at all?

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Old 01/27/09, 6:21 AM   #761
Tenspeed
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Mage
 
Archimonde
Originally Posted by druicifer View Post
Where can I compare the relative values of haste/crit/hit/SP with my current stats? I'm not too great at crunching numbers, is there a site with a calculator?
Get Rawr or use www.magegraf.com

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Old 01/27/09, 6:47 AM   #762
Pye
Von Kaiser
 
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Undead Mage
 
Draenor (EU)
Originally Posted by Tenspeed View Post
Sorry if this was covered, I think I read something about it but I can't find it now. During a Lust/IV is it still optimal to be casting LB? Also does Lust or IV affect GCD haste at all?
Yes and yes.

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Old 01/27/09, 7:50 AM   #763
Pintofbrew
Now with Karate Grip! (TM)
 
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Orc Death Knight
 
Frostwhisper (EU)
LB is almost always DPS increase. The only debatable time to not cast it is when the mob is almost dead, where it's not clear if the mob will live long enough. Strictly, though, that's being quite a bit picky; imagine what locks have to deal with, who may have up to 6 DoTs to keep up.

The really a lot more relevant question, is should you use Hot Streak when hasted to below 1s. Personally, with bloodlust, of course, I prefer to use one HS pyro on the third charge of Combustion and ignore HS for the remaining IV duration until instants are back above 1s.

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Old 01/27/09, 7:59 AM   #764
Tenspeed
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Mage
 
Archimonde
Originally Posted by Pintofbrew View Post
LB is almost always DPS increase. The only debatable time to not cast it is when the mob is almost dead, where it's not clear if the mob will live long enough. Strictly, though, that's being quite a bit picky; imagine what locks have to deal with, who may have up to 6 DoTs to keep up.

The really a lot more relevant question, is should you use Hot Streak when hasted to below 1s. Personally, with bloodlust, of course, I prefer to use one HS pyro on the third charge of Combustion and ignore HS for the remaining IV duration until instants are back above 1s.
Is there a mod that will show me what my current GCD is at numerically so this is easier to gauge?

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Old 01/27/09, 9:30 AM   #765
nogzilla
Glass Joe
 
Undead Mage
 
Illidan
Originally Posted by Tenspeed View Post
Is there a mod that will show me what my current GCD is at numerically so this is easier to gauge?
Just look in your spellbook at any spell that normally has a 1.5 second cast time, like polymorph (and keep in mind 1 second is the minimum).

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Old 01/27/09, 9:31 AM   #766
 nathanbp
Great Tiger
 
Gnome Mage
 
Aegwynn
Originally Posted by Tenspeed View Post
Is there a mod that will show me what my current GCD is at numerically so this is easier to gauge?
If you use a mod like Quartz it will show you how long it is taking to cast your spells. Your GCD is the minimum of (1 second, half the the casting time of Frostfire Bolt).

Also, Theory Craft-o-Matic says that ignoring Hot Streak procs is a really bad idea, probably until Frostfire Bolt starts clipping the GCD at unattainable 200% haste.

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Old 01/27/09, 1:24 PM   #767
manly
Soda Popinski
 
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Troll Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Tenspeed View Post
Sorry if this was covered, I think I read something about it but I can't find it now. During a Lust/IV is it still optimal to be casting LB? Also does Lust or IV affect GCD haste at all?
Well, I used to not cast LB during lust+IV+haste potion because it was giving me 0.7s casts. However, now that LB can also proc HS, I just don't see any justification for it. Always cast LB.

<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS.
Very Manly Staff

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Old 01/27/09, 7:11 PM   #768
Asmozre
Glass Joe
 
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Human Mage
 
Bladefist
Am I doing something wrong in RAWR? It's showing 19/52/0 as being a little higher than 0/53/18 for me by about 100 DPS when I swap between specs and glyphs.

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Old 01/27/09, 8:12 PM   #769
solbergb
Don Flamenco
 
Gnome Mage
 
Earthen Ring
No, that's probably correct, assuming that torment of the weak and arcane focus had near 100% uptime.

Arc/fire is a bit better than frostfire in single target dps with raid buffs and debuffs right now than frostfire. There just hasn't been as much buzz about it with the arcane boost

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Old 01/28/09, 3:58 AM   #770
Keat
Glass Joe
 
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Human Paladin
 
Garona
Did anyone notice a drop in Frostfire (0/53/18) DPS?

Perhaps i haven't checked in enough to notice - But it was so bad today, It forced me into Arcane.

Any input? Did i miss a stealth Nerf?

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Old 01/28/09, 4:03 AM   #771
manly
Soda Popinski
 
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Troll Mage
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Keat View Post
Did anyone notice a drop in Frostfire (0/53/18) DPS?

Perhaps i haven't checked in enough to notice - But it was so bad today, It forced me into Arcane.

Any input? Did i miss a stealth Nerf?
I guess its a bad day to buy lottery tickets for you.

<Eej> YOU"RE GONNA PULL
<Eej> IF YOU SQUEEZE OFF ANOTHER ARCANE BLAST
<Spectear> You've obviously never played with Manly.
<Spectear> That's hardly a reason to stop DPS.
Very Manly Staff

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Old 01/28/09, 4:13 AM   #772
Keat
Glass Joe
 
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Human Paladin
 
Garona
Bah!

Guess it was just bad luck on HS procs

Non the less! Thanks for your response!

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Old 01/28/09, 4:35 AM   #773
Kuosi
Von Kaiser
 
Troll Priest
 
Vek'nilash (EU)
If you are logging wws reports from your raids you could compare to get rid of the doubt :P

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Old 01/28/09, 4:55 AM   #774
ArchJared
Glass Joe
 
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Undead Mage
 
Frostwhisper (EU)
Originally Posted by Kuosi View Post
If you are logging wws reports from your raids you could compare to get rid of the doubt :P
No point, FFB only acquired more DPS through LB proccing HS now. We all know how weird/lucky/unlucky/situational FFB's DPS is.

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Old 01/28/09, 7:09 AM   #775
BeeLz
Don Flamenco
 
Undead Mage
 
Frostmane (EU)
When I use magegraf and compare 18/53/0 with 0/53/18 the frostfire build gives a 1000dps advantage fully raidbuffed on a 4 minute fight. Just wondering what might be causing it since from what I've read a fireball spec with ttw up should be slightly outdmging a ffb spec.

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