dedmonwakeen

The nature of deferred ticks means that Fire Mages burning down adds in "single-target" fashion will "lose" Ignite ticks. How much of a factor is this in the logs you are familiar with?

http://code.google.com/p/simulationcraft

 

Maje

It's not easy to get a statistically worthy number due to the nature of how WoL works, the fights I've seen the ignite lost was around 10%, I took a couple of Iron Council fights; agreed they have 3 parts where ignite will get lost but then I don't really know of any good patchwerk like fight without interruptions.

EDIT: If memory serves me right there was an addon 'Zit'(?) that Zalindar wrote that calculated the difference between expected and real ignite damage done. I'll try looking for it and see the average numbers on Coliseum heroic clear (though I'm not sure if the real numbers are what we're looking for).

 

mocnor

Hey guys i have a problem and was wanting to see if anyone know the best solution. I have 3 mages, 1 lock, 1 ele, 1 shadow priest and a boomkin in my 25 man togc raid. Should I ask one of the mages to be fire spec for the imp scorch stack? I tried this and his dps was really lacking compared to the other 2 arc mages. Is the 5% buff worth the loss of his dps. We are all basically geared and the arc mages top the meters normally. I don't know if i provided enough info, but if you know please inform me.

 

Shaitans

Our raid is having the same issue. Our thoughts/latest experience at this point is to utilize a demo lock. It's a dps loss for him, but the other raid buffs he can provide (besides the 5% crit), such as the fact that his sp buff can free up a totem for the elemental shaman to use searing totem. Combine that with the fact that imp shadowbolt is apart of the optimal rotation for that spec whereas mages waste a lot of time doing scorches (not apart of the optimal rotation) or waste a glyph (again, bad and it doesn't solve the whole not being apart of the optimal rotation) and it seems the most logical choice.

 

tubawizard

Loosing the 5% Spell Crit is allways a loss of dps when you have at least 3 casters in your raid. Arcane is definitely better dps, but the difference with fire is not that big to loose the 5% crit bonus.
I have been changing from Fire to Arcane too lately, but the difference in dps is only 342 according to Rawr:
Fire-spec 20/51/0 8023 (with 5% Improved scorch buff +349)
Arcane-spec 57/3/10 8365 (with 5% Improved scorch buff +231)

Considering the different fights in the Colliseum, it will be best to have at least 1 caster with the 5% Spell crit bonus, a fire mage or Warlock. Just the fight against the Twin valkyrs is the only exception. The arcane-spec with the Incanter's absorption talent is such a huge dps increase, that its worth to loose the 5% crit there.

It would be nice to have a comparison between the 2 specs (fire, arcane) in the twin valkyrs fight, to see the difference in dps. I am interested how to use rawr to calculate this, so any thoughts on that would be good.

 

Whitemagee

It shoulden't be a too big dps loss if the mage manage to keep the stack upp. And with the upcomming scorch change it's a 1,5 sec cast (tooltip casttime) every 30 sec. So haveing atleast one firespecc mage keeping this upp would be optimal against haveing a lock with 5 points in Isb.

And as for dps comparrison on twins arcane vs. Fire im not sure if that is the best fight to compare dps, as ppl can have the buff stacking differentlig. The amount you can have ignite ticking for in this fight is sick aswell. Seen it ticking for anything between 50-250k, atleast as frostfire. Can get hold of the parse for one of the fights if thats wanted.

 

Geglash

Normally if you try and optimize you'd go with a Demo lock as not only does he free up a potential totem (which can be converted into 500-1000 more dps for the shaman) but he also provides a superior spellpower buff that on it's own is reason enough to warrant his respec when gear gets up to a certain point.

 

morteriag

My guild is on Anub hc 25 man atm.

We have had best luck so far with a heavy melee setup with big focus on cleave/aoe on the adds+boss. At the moment we are having a discussion about what spec would be the the best to use for us mages.

The alternative's we've discussed is:

conventional frostfirespecc using living bombs/blizzard for aoe
frostfirespecc with firestarter using living bombs, flamestrike, blast wave, dragons breath, and blizzard. This would depend on if the 4 adds are tanked together or in two's.
frostspec using blizzard to make sure all 4 adds+boss have 5% crit debuff.

Does anyone have numbers or experience on how to best deal with this encounter as a mage?

 

Whitemagee

We've cleared anub hc two week's in a row now, managing to Get insanity each time. And the setup vary's in the melee based on who's there and buffs etc. But we are trying to have atleast 2-3 warriors, 2-3 rogues and 2-3 dk,s but thata not just cause they are good dps on adds but their boss dmg aswell.

From a mage pov it's clearly the original ffb specc thats doing the most dmg on adds. We usually run with 2 mages with that spec and we are topping add dmg. Popping icyveins and getting a PI from a disc priest is awsome dmg.
Im dotting the adds as they come in and starting to use blizz when they Are in position. We tank them 2 and 2, right and left of anub, so close that the blizzard is getting all adds + boss.

I can probably get ahold off the wol reports for the fight if it's wanted.

 

Beasterbrown

Personally I use the regular frostfire spec (copied from Premonition mages I armoried awhile back actually). I'm sure they also thought hard about this. With 3 mages in the guild all specced the same way, I figured it must be the best way to go. Our first kill was this week and we didnt even have a warlock to put up imp SB. The 5% crit debuff didnt seem to be a big deal, however I have not tried it with one of us frost (doubt anyone has really hehe) to see the difference.

I do have a followup question though. The rotation I use for this fight is living bomb the ads on the way in, cast 1 or 2 frostfirebolts on Anub and refresh his living bomb if need be, then blizzard, usually 3 times. One of the other mages in my guild seems to think that casting flamestrike R9 and R8, then using blizzard usually 2 times, is the way to go, instead of me just using blizzard 3 times. On our meters
( World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis ) ,

you can see I did more dps and damage than the other mage that was using flamestrike; Is there any evidence that using flamestrike is better?

Oh, and we are using 1 tank strat so the range on flamestrike is not an issue.

 

Zerstorung

Teth did in fact beat you on Burrower damage, but you severely out performed the other mages on Anub damage.

 

elluminea

Most of the top parses on WMO do not include any flamestrike damage, so evidence is actually to the contrary. Some do, they're still competitive. I know I threw some in my rotation cuz I'm the orb popper, I'd put down 2 ranks after living bomb so it would be ticking while I was out of range getting a patch briefly.

 

tubawizard

We have been trying the achivement for Iron Council 25-man Hardmode in my guild. In this encounter it is possible to spellsteal the shield from Runemaster Molgeim:

Shield of Runes - Spell - World of Warcraft

I wasn' t aware of this in the first place. Is it worth trying to steal it, because I have read that it seems difficult to get it? Do have people experienced problems with this and what are the results?
Especially Arcane mages could benefit alot with the Incanter's absorption talent.

 

Hinalovr

It IS possible to spell steal it but most people don't on 25 HM. The reason is the fact that it either a) gets purged or b) dps burns through it too fast to spellsteal it. DPS is really not much of an issue until Steelbreaker anyway so spellstealing that buff isn't that much of an issue. Nor is standing in runes necessary. It does speed up the fight but otherwise normal dps is good enough.

 

Aul

While spellstealing Molgeim's shield won't make or break the fight, it does increase your damage output if specced into Incanter's Absorption. As long as you're not spending seconds trying to spellsteal it you'll see a net gain in damage output. On top of that you'll reduce the need for healing on both you and the tank, as Molgeim won't get his 50% damage increase, which helps out your healers.
The only situation where it would be a DPS loss to interrupt your rotation and try and spellsteal, would be if you're consistently unsure if you can spellsteal the shield before the DPS burns through it. That's something you need to look at at a per-raid basis however.

 

zimzamzoom

Hello,

Quick question - would using dampen magic on the raid be able to almost completely nullify the lowest leeching swarm tick (250 dmg for leeching swarm; 240 nullified by untalented dampen) in Anub phase 3?

 

Masnie

As far as I know both leeching swarm and penetrating cold are not affected by dampen/amplify magic, so you could amplify the whole raid to increse the healing by healing stream totems.

 

Whitemagee

Do you got any logs or other info that can confirm this?



And for the anub hc fight, from what ive seen just doing one LB on each add when they come in and then going over to blizzard when they Are in is the most dps. If you throw an extra bolt at anub when the adds spawn and then put up the LB's they should go off a couple off seconds after they are positioned and the blizz should hit everything. Ill pull out some logs when i get off this wooden chair im sitting on at school atm.

 

Sipwell

We are trying Anub'Arak 25m Heroic now, anyone has an idea what the best spec is? I think FFB since you get the best AOE this way? Sorry if this has allready been asked.

 

dr0nzer

I've been running a slightly modified FFB spec for this fight, taking more talents in frost for stronger AoE damage, check my armory, it's my second spec.


EDIT: found the answer to my question.

 

epoh

Well it would certainly fit with what we already know about Amp magic - it doesn't seem to effect any AOE dmg from bosses.

 

dr0nzer

But Amplify Magic on this during this encounter can be somewhat fatal to those that get targetted with Penetrating Cold, i'm not sure if it is actually worth having it on especially considering the already low levels of health during this phase.

 

Whitemagee

was what i was thinking to.



and for the logs i said id pull out, ppl can check these out:
Note this is with the regular ffb spec.

Damage on adds.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Spell classification.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Total damage.
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

 

Flameenix

How about using Amplify Magic on the off-tank during Anub hc 25? Their damage seems to be almost entirely melee with the exception of Penetrating Cold.

The only way I could imagine Amplify Magic on the raid to be viable would be if each raid member also had a /cancelaura Amplify Magic macro once they're hit with Penetrating Cold in p3 (could be used within a Frost pot macro).

 

Zerstorung

Amp Magic is a wash. You dont need to increase the healing done by totems or VE, you should be getting enough healing to survive the swarm. Amp magic will up healing but also PC.