No, the primary benefit of Focus Magic is its raid DPS contribution. Think of it this way: you are giving a static 100% crit to someone, but you aren't guaranteed 100% for your own. If you give it to someone whose rotation involves a spell that has a 100% crit rate every 10 seconds (8 sec CD, 2 sec cast), it dilutes the benefit of 3% crit. Yes, it does practically guarantee then that your own crit will be 100%, but, for instance, a frostfire mage scales immensely better than an Elemental Shaman from crit and doesn't have a 100% crit spell.
I'm not saying that an elem shaman won't benefit from increased crit, but I am saying that there are classes that benefit more and scale more. Obviously, as you say, if you don't have someone else in your raid (destro warlock even now, since aff is apparently dead), you wouldn't pass up giving them Focus Magic. That clearly wasn't what I was implying.
As far as the wait item from Algalon goes -- it's nice, and it may be an upgrade (probably), but it is heavily saturated with stamina/intellect, and it picks up spirit. Now, spirit isn't bad, but Sash of Ancient Power really is a godly itemized item. We'll see though how it works for the different specs and how much it's actually contributing.
It seems pretty simple, we should get some data on other classes to see THEIR benefit to 3% crit. Figure out the up-time they will give you. Do some quick math and you have a rdps priority. Maybe I'll take to some friends from other classes and do this.
It seems pretty simple, we should get some data on other classes to see THEIR benefit to 3% crit. Figure out the up-time they will give you. Do some quick math and you have a rdps priority. Maybe I'll take to some friends from other classes and do this.
It seems pretty simple, we should get some data on other classes to see THEIR benefit to 3% crit. Figure out the up-time they will give you. Do some quick math and you have a rdps priority. Maybe I'll take to some friends from other classes and do this.
Any nuking class who is going all out should give you at the very least 95% uptime with current gear levels. Healers usually don't provide good uptimes, because they don't stack crit on gear as heavily as we do, don't have have massive crit percentage talents and glyphs, lack 8% crit debuffs and simply aren't built around button cramming throughput like we are.
There are definately times and places where AoE Spam Healing gives excellent uptime, but those are the rarer moments.
For the benefit of 3% to other classes, check DPS Scale Factors in Simcraft for crit rating. It lists the absolute DPS gain per 1 point of ratings. Not sure if Boomkin actually use Wrath Spam cycles, so I put them in parantheses.
I have a question, with the upcoming change to jewelcrafting, at certain gear levels, does the relentless earthseige gem become the better choice than chaotic? In essence is dropping 21 crit rating for the one less blue gem worth it.
I have a question, with the upcoming change to jewelcrafting, at certain gear levels, does the relentless earthseige gem become the better choice than chaotic? In essence is dropping 21 crit rating for the one less blue gem worth it.
No...just no.
+21crit vs +10dam & -8spirit is what you are basically saying. Just think about it, that isn't even a debatable difference.
Healers usually don't provide good uptimes, because they don't stack crit on gear as heavily as we do, don't have have massive crit percentage talents and glyphs, lack 8% crit debuffs and simply aren't built around button cramming throughput like we are.
I have almost 33% unbuffed crit, some from gear and 14% from talents. I'm not sure if this counts as stacking crit or not. I have fairly high INT, which grants crit (and I gain another 104 INT from flasking). With our smaller toolboxes (compared to priests and druids), paladin and shaman healers are built around gcd throughput, and our talents that return mana or increase healing on crit are core to our classes.
I'm not saying you should give your valuable crit buff to a resto shaman or holy paladin. If your healing team is keeping the raid alive, they don't need the buff and increasing raid dps will be of more benefit to beat an enrage timer or hard mode gear check. I would like to point out the flaws in your assumptions though.
Yeap... I just went through typing up something really long TWICE only to realize I was somehow logged out when posting it again, yay. Was just going to throw some numbers/input out on the possible mage change for 3.2 "Empowered Fire: In addition to its existing effects, this talent now also grants a 33/67/100% chance to regain 1% of base mana each time the Ignite talent deals damage."
Lets assume you have a 50% crit chance and have enough haste to get 4 fireball casts off before living bomb blows up, and one cast that living bomb blows up during.(Living Bomb>Fireball>Fireball>Fireball>Fireball>Fireball (Living Bomb blows up during this cast)). Within that set amount of time 13~ seconds or so, you're getting off 9 spell hits (3 Living Bomb dot ticks, 1 Living Bomb blow up, and 5 Fireballs). Cycle through the rotation one more time and you're at 26~ seconds for 18 spell casts, 9 of which were critical hits. Assume you got 5 hotstreak procs (.25% per out of 9 crits = 4.5 procs, plus a 4 piece proc of .25%), giving you a total of 23 spell casts in 30 seconds, 11 of which are crits, giving you 22 total ignite dot ticks (without any ignite munching). For an Undead you have a total of 5673 base mana, meaning you gain 56.73 mana back per ignite tick you get (1%). Which gives you 22(ignite ticks)*56.73(base mana)/30(time)=41.602(mp/5). Mind you the amount you gain from this change will vary depending on your race, critical strike chance, critical strikes over the fight, ignite munching, and haste.
All mages, regardless of race, have 3268 base mana. Go look at your character sheet, hover over intellect, and subtract the "Increases Mana by X" value from your current mana for proof. Since spell costs are based on a percentage of base mana, if different races had different base mana pools, it would be very difficult for Blizzard to balance race/class combinations.
You also just said you should get 22 ticks of ignite over a 30 second period. This obviously ignores the fact ignite doesn't tick for 2 seconds after application, as well as the fact reapplications reset that timer right back to 2 seconds. Then your math gave a mana per second value and called it mana per FIVE seconds.
Zaldinar did the calculations correctly (actually via simulator) over in the Frostfire thread HERE.
Ok, I was just on the PTR and since MMO or WoR hasn't posted anything on professions I'll post what I do know to help other Theorycrafters figure out what is the best 2 professions come 3.2
1) JC - Ok here is the biggest change in the professions. Dragon Eyes as we all know is losing it's prismatic effect. In it's place: 34 SP/Agility/Strength, etc. 20 MP5. 51 Stam 43 SPell Pen, 39 Spell Power, 68 Attack Power.
2) Tailoring - the Lightweave has been bumped to 295 SP proc.
3) Leatherworking - Fur Lining - AP = 130 AP, Fur Lining - Spell Power = 76, and Fur Lining Stamina = 102
4) Enchanting - Ring = Assault - 40 AP; Greater Spell power - 23 SP; Stamina = 30 Stam
6) Epic Gems - The Red gems now give 23 SP/Strength/Agility etc. The Blue stam gives 30 stamina. The splits (SP/Spirit) give 10 and 13.
It looks like Alchemy is going to be easier to get epic gems than Prospecting given that it only requires 3 rare gems to transmute 1 epic gem, and currently on the PTR there is NO cooldown for the transmute.
I did not look at engineering, and I can look that up if anyone asks.
In case people are wondering, the new epic gem patterns cost 5 JC tokens to learn each pattern. Plus the patterns can only be learned by 450+ JCers. At 72 total new patterns, that is a years worth of tokens.
Engineering has actually been significantly buffed such that it's about equivalent to the other professions instead of a serious step down. Two biggest raid changes first, and a third useful for raids but to a more limited degree:
1) The old singular raid advantage, the glove haste enchant, has been extended to a 12 second duration from 10. Still 340 haste, still 1 minute cooldown. The change in uptime moves it from the old 56.667 avg haste to 68 avg haste.
2) The parachute cloak enchants now add 27 spellpower, making it the same item value as 23 haste, but spellpower being more valuable per point this is a buff (much as the tailors trading haste for spellpower on their cloaks is).
3) The rocket boot enchant has been extended to 5 second duration (same old long cooldown though), and most importantly now come with Icewalker built in (12 hit 12 crit). Basically gives engineers a cheap and easy self-Icewalker with a speed boost perk.
A few other changes, but nothing that makes much of a difference in a raid.
The first two changes combine to basically mean instead of "paying" 28 spellpower to gain 56.667 haste today, engineers will in 3.2 "pay" 1 spellpower (+27 on cloak, -28 on gloves) to gain 45 haste (-23 on cloak, +68 on gloves). A significant improvement, to say the least.
Folks will still have to figure out the exact benefits of every other profession to decide which are best, but engineering looks like it'll at least be with the pack instead of lagging a significant jump behind now. (It still gains its value in haste, rather than most other professions gaining the same value in spellpower instead, and others, such as Jewelcrafting and Blacksmithing, being able to tailor theirs on an individual level. So I suspect it will still be at the bottom of the pack from a dps-benefit standpoint, but from an item value standpoint, it is solid.)
Edit:
Well doing some quick math, Tailoring is still probably going to be considered on top, followed by Jewelcrafting, with Engineering below, but not as far below as before. In order of dps value: * Tailoring - 73.75 spellpower, -23 haste - (Assumes 1/4 uptime for lightweave proc, 295 spellpower for 15s out of 60s) * Jewelcrafting - 48 spellpower - (3x 39sp instead of 3x 23sp) * Alchemy - 47 spellpower - (172sp flask w/ mixology vs 125 baseline) * Blacksmithing - 46 spellpower - (2x 23sp epic gems in extra sockets) * Enchanting - 46 spellpower - (23sp x 2 rings) * Inscription - 46 spellpower - (70sp vs 24sp on epic Sons inscription) * Leatherworking - 46 spellpower - (76sp fur lining - 30sp enchant) * Engineering - 45 haste, -1 spellpower - (+27sp -23haste on cloak, -28sp +68haste on gloves -- also gets a burst of speed basically once per boss fight when using Icewalker instead of runspeed, which could come in minor handy for raiding) * Skinning - 40 crit * Mining - 60 stamina * Herbalism - 3600 healing over 5 seconds
Edit: Thanks for the correction to Leatherworking. Fixed above.
Edit: Added Alchemy data based on two posts below. Thank you.
Last edited by Xentropy : 06/24/09 at 5:55 PM.
Reason: Adding full profession list of value vs baseline
The Leatherworking profession buff is applied to wrists, not gloves. In that case, the highest wrist enchant is +30 spellpower, and thus Leatherworking is a 46 spellpower gain over no profession, not 48.
* Alchemy - Unknown - (We need to know how much Flask of the Frost Wyrm is increased to by Mixology now, I would suspect 171 spellpower for +46 overall given the other profession values)
I just checked with my Elixer Alchemy Feral druid (who I also transfered to the PTR). The 125 Flask of Frost Wyrm (125 normal SP) gave me 172 Spell power.
Lightweave Embroidery is 45s icd and around 50% proc chance judging from our raid logs it's uptime is around 1/3 rather then 1/4.
Your proc rate/ICD is correct. The uptime, should be 15/(45+2*avg_cast_time). Simplifying that to a 2.5 second cast (fireball alone) would work out to 30% uptime. The uptime would go up very slightly, but not a material amount, in practice since non-fireball spells would be factored in (32% uptime is the cap, using 1sec GCD as avg_cast_time).
This works out to 88.5 (270*0.3) damage on average from Lightweave Embroidery.
Although tailoring didn't really need a buff it got one anyways, awesome. From all of this Jc/tailoring still looks to be top. Although Engineering was improved a bit, the cloak enchant does little because lightweave is much better than it. Listed some mmo links for possible new boe/bop robes/bracers in 3.2. Assuming those bracers are bop it will push Tailoring further ahead of the other proffesions until better bracers come out.
Robes - http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...32_10026_2.jpg http://static.mmo-champion.com/mmoc/...32_10026_1.jpg
Although tailoring didn't really need a buff it got one anyways, awesome.
Blizzard has made it a theme that on-equip procs, when averaged out, are better than static effects. The ' TC benefit' of tailoring follows perfectly in line with this pattern.
Those robes and bracers are all BoE, and will probably remain so, since Blizzard confirmed they changed their minds about it being a good idea to have BoP high end gear as there was in TBC.
You have a good point about engineering having a reduced value if taken *with* tailoring. My list was the benefit of each profession on its own vs. no professions at all. Some professions may not stack well with others.
I wonder how you would value the Nitro Boost speed overall performance. It could be very helpful in fights with a lot of movement to reach a buff area (Hodir / Vezax) or move to the next Tentacle on Yogg.
It would end up beeing around 3 sec "earned" every 3 minutes on that kind of fight.
I could see it being beneficial for many of the current Ulduar fights, not so much for some of them. I think that they could actually be more of a burden during some point on the Hodir fight if used incorrectly because those portals have a very tiny 'hit' box so to speak, your chances of over shooting them would be high.
I was playing around with several gear combination for a 19/52 TTW/Fire spec and looking at the relative stat values I see crit is rated higher than haste. That while I read everywhere that haste > crit for a fire spec. I checked all the raid buffs and put the fight length to 480 seconds.
In the gear setup I was playing around with I had the following stats (right from Rawr):
2761 spd
447 hit (capped even without SP/Boomkin)
914 crit rating (50.20%)
423 haste rating
Your proc rate/ICD is correct. The uptime, should be 15/(45+2*avg_cast_time). Simplifying that to a 2.5 second cast (fireball alone) would work out to 30% uptime. The uptime would go up very slightly, but not a material amount, in practice since non-fireball spells would be factored in (32% uptime is the cap, using 1sec GCD as avg_cast_time).
This works out to 88.5 (270*0.3) damage on average from Lightweave Embroidery.
You forgot one thing, you get the first proc for free, without paying wait time. So, in a 1-minute fight, you have 30s uptime (okay, maybe in a 70s fight). In a 2-minute fight, you have 45s uptime, that 3/8, 38%. Of course, if the internal cooldown ends just when the fight ends, you have the ~32% uptime cap, but since fights have a random length the uptime will be higher.
Also, Lightweave procs very reliably (50% chance), so that it'll synch with an early heroism and that you can time/delay your cooldowns when you're just a few seconds away from the ICD (never wait on unreliable CDs or when you risk delaying too much). That all increases the value of Lightweave and of any other procs/clikcies by quite a lot.
You forgot one thing, you get the first proc for free, without paying wait time. So, in a 1-minute fight, you have 30s uptime (okay, maybe in a 70s fight). In a 2-minute fight, you have 45s uptime, that 3/8, 38%. Of course, if the internal cooldown ends just when the fight ends, you have the ~32% uptime cap, but since fights have a random length the uptime will be higher.
Yes...but on the average fight length you do get 30% uptime. By that I mean, if you calculated an average of the uptime value at every possible fight length you would get 30%.
I'll come up with a table showing uptime percent at a given fight length, but right now I am in the middle of raid
Yes...but on the average fight length you do get 30% uptime. By that I mean, if you calculated an average of the uptime value at every possible fight length you would get 30%.
I'll come up with a table showing uptime percent at a given fight length, but right now I am in the middle of raid
That is not correct. Average is higher than 30% for any fight length, it only approaches that as fight goes to infinity.
That is not correct. Average is higher than 30% for any fight length, it only approaches that as fight goes to infinity.
You are quite right. I made an error when calculating for specific fight lengths (I used 10sec duration instead of 15sec).
However, there are some fight durations (of non-infinte) that will produce less than 30% uptime. Basically, anything Integer*(45+2*Cast_Time)+5.
Also, the convergence to 30% doesn't take that long.
Here is a graphical representation of fight duration vs. percent-uptime (based on 45sec ICD, 50% proc chance, 2.5sec cast time
06/11/09, 9:50 AM
