I have to say, I switched from FFB to Arcane in the last week. I had my first raid as it Tuesday, and my dps improved DRAMATICALLY. It was a godsend to someone like me with a not-so-hot computer who has difficulty maintaining the "dots" of FFB due to low frame rates and mediocre latency (not to mention the server lag that's plauged Sargeras since 3.0). I parsed 4800 DPS on Maexxna (0 aoe from me), 5300 on Gluth (17% of that was AOE), and in general my numbers simply shot way up. I know a lot of people have state of the art computers - but a lot of us don't, as well.

It was the first time I really had FUN playing her since the expansion. I really felt like I was playing my alt-lock recently, and it was incredibly frustrating maintaining such a dot oriented rotation. Playing arcane (even though I certainly wasn't perfect) felt a lot more flexible and more like the mage class to me.

The only thing I really dislike is the fact that Arcane Blast debuff is now cleanse-able again. Which our healers are taking advantage of, much to the dismay of my DPS. Why they have done this, I don't know, but I hate it!

Correct me if I'm wrong, but according to the stat weightings for arcane on simcraft wouldn't it be ideal to always gem for spellpower regardless of socket bonuses?

I can't say whether arcane vs frostfire is easier or harder in the abstract.

It's just that I've worked with the deep fire rotation (hot streak+living bomb+scorch+main nuke) for several months and it's closer to the BC scorch+fireball rotation that I had before. It's not just the rotation in abstract, it's all the keybindings, macros and integration with other stuff.

Unlearning that and learning a new dynamic (what looks like simpler rotation, but needing to manage mana) doesn't seem to me to be something I should be doing unless I'm either comfortable with all the fights I'm in or have maxed out my learning curve on what I'm doing and am bored.

Also I'm often the only mage, so going deep arcane is a raid loss if I don't bring the scorch debuff.

For these reasons I'm far more likely to experiment with arc/fire than deep arcane at the moment. I'd have switched over already except that the only fights we're really struggling with at all have burst aoe phases that I can do better with frostfire. My single target dps isn't as important to raid success as burning the sparks in malyph1, the melee adds in malyph2 or Sarth+3d adds fast at the moment. (in frostfire I can fit in a firestarter build at cost of some mana efficiency. I can't do that in deep fire or arcane without losing single target dps)

If we were struggling with Patchwerk and Thaddeus type fights, I'd probably be looking a lot harder at deep arcane or arc/fire. If fast trash clears were important for some reason, I'd be deep frost.

I also really hope dual spec makes it in at some point. It takes the risk out of trying a new spec - if you try it and you suck, midraid you can flip to the other spec.

Okay so, I've got the exact same settings you've listed for rawr, and the same version.

Still, I've got 6.3k dps as FFB, with the following subsitutions:
Rod of the Fallen Monarch > Gemmed Wand of the Nerubians
Valorous Frostfire Circlet > Gothik's Cowl
Azure Cloth Bindings > Unsullied Cuffs/Bindings of the Expansive Mind
Gown of the Spellweave > Valorous Frostfire Robe

Questions: Did you set a TPS limit? I haven't set one because you didn't say anything about it.
Can Focus Magic Rate be altered to 1 for FFB, provided there is an Arcane/Fireball mage in the raid who puts the actual buff on you?(still, I have the exact same rate you have on the main page)

I didn't use the optimizer, just loaded my guy off the armory and picked up some upgrades.

Edit for stats:
Spellpower - 2510
Crit Rating - 597/ 50.04%
Haste Rating - 477/ 1.239 speed
Hit Rating - 310/ 17.82%

I could be wrong, but I can hardly imagine an "optimal gear" that's 0.82% above hit cap...

I fail at rawr usage.

Nice to see updated numbers from version 2.19 for FFB and FB specs,
Could someone please post the optimal gear set for arcane (57/3/11) using 2.19? Profs are Inscription and Jewelcrafting

My post from pre-nerf/bugfix updated to 2.1.9. There has been some arguing about it, but nobody has posted any "rawr-proven" suggestions

For me it shows about 40 more dps from this combo:
Cowl Of Vanity + Valorous Chest + Valorous Leggings (with 32sp gem)
Compared to:
Valorous Helm + The Sanctum chest (with 32sp gem) + Valorous Leggins (without 32sp gem)

Valorous Chest shows around 310 dps with 19sp + 9sp/8 haste gems.
The Sanctum gives me 303 with 19sp + 32 sp

What am i missing here? It doesnt affect hit rating or anything.


Edit: Used my calculator instead, the combo with The Sanctum gives 24 more haste at the cost of 1 sp, 2 crit rating and 2 intellect.
Proves you are right but it's very close.

I played around in rawr for awhile and could not get a higher dps setup than the one Korrigan is suggesting for fights of reasonable length (5-6 mins). Therefore I believe the setup he posted is the optimal 57/3/11 setup.

There is nothing to proove, I've done the same gear setup and nothing else is better. Until new gear comes out or blizzard changes anything related to mages that is what all arcane mages should strive for... I'm 10/16 already.

As far as professions go, Enchanting your rings and then dropping enchanting for either Alchemy or Blacksmithing is the way to go. I prefer Alchemy because you can make a lot of money as well as save a lot of money on flasks. You can use that money for the next time you go back into enchanting for the next uber set of rings and then back to Alchemy.

This won't work anymore. Your ring enchants will display as inactive.

Also, the best profession combo would be alchemy and JC. JC because you can bypass blue gemslots and meta requirements + the 3 good gems, and alchemy both because of better flask effect, but also because of crazy alchemist potion. It's a healing pot, mana pot and dps pot all rolled into one cheap package. (especially for arcane when you can use both the mana and dps pot effectively)

Here is my input on the optimal arcane set, very similar to Korrigan's except the wand/boots and different buffs fitting a more realistic raid (who uses disc priests in raids). Also a shorter duration more fitting current content with a few exceptions of course.


Rawr version: 2.1.9
Race: Human
Latency: 0.05
Enabled: Heroism, Potion of Wild Magic, Potion of Speed (no snare, no scorch)
Heroism Control: Optimal
Innervate and Mana Tide Totem are set to 0.
Enabled: Mana Potion, Mana Gem
Snared Time: 1
Focus Magic Rate: .2
Duration: 210
Enabled: Incremental Optimizations
Glyphs: Glyph of Molten Armor, Glyph of Arcane Power, Glyph of Arcane Blast, Glyph of Mage Armor (having mage armor and molten armor available allows rawr to pick the optimal armor to use)

Buffs:
Improved Moonkin Form
Arcane Intellect
Vampiric Touch
Mana Spring Totem (Restorative Totems)
Blessing of Wisdom (Improved Blessing of Wisdom)
Focus Magic
Wrath of Air Totem
Mark of the Wild (Improved Mark of the Wild)
Blessing of Kings (Improved Blessing of Kings)
Molten Armor/Mage armor
Heroic Presence
Heart of the Crusader
Judgement of Wisdom
Improved Scorch
Ebon Plaguebringer
Misery
Flask of the Frost Wyrm
Spell Power Food

Spec: 57/3/11 Arcane
Dps: 6122

[Valorous Frostfire Circlet]
[Wyrmrest Necklace of Power]
[Valorous Frostfire Shoulderpads]
[Pennant Cloak]
[The Sanctum's Flowing Vestments]
[Unsullied Cuffs]
[Valorous Frostfire Gloves]
[Leash of Heedless Magic]
[Valorous Frostfire Leggings]
[Arcanic Tramplers]
[Signet of Manifested Pain], [Band of Channeled Magic]
[Embrace of the Spider], [Illustration of the Dragon Soul]
[The Turning Tide]
[Surplus Limb], [Gemmed Wand of the Nerubians]

one option: changing legs/gloves for about -22 dps and gain ~70mp5 ooc
[Gloves of Token Respect]
[Leggings of the Wanton Spellcaster]

edit: enchanting/tailor (used my mage as a model)

Rawr calculates damage based off mp5, spirit, mana, etc.

So it is a -22 dps taking into account the 70mp5.

What is your length of fight in which you get -22 dps? Also check rawr again and find out what length of fight will change it to a net 0 dps loss/gain.

I understand this, but Rawr does not take into consideration fights that require mana usage outside of single target dps. That is why I put that in there.

5-6 mins is reasonable length? Only a few boss fights are that long. Remember that the shorter the fight duration the higher Arcane DPS is. My guild drops nearly all bosses in 3mins or under. So for me right now Arcane is best. During learning phases of Ulduar I can see fights going MUCH longer and I'd switch to FFB or FB for those (dual specs by then hopefully).

Remember that when you're talking about ideal gear for yourself that everyone else in your guild by then would likely also have their ideal gear. This means your guild would be RAPING content and nearly all boss fights would be under 3mins.

No that is incorrect. Rawr does take into consideration all types of fights and creates the optimum rotation for the amount of time in the fight.

Again, change the length of the fight in rawr and see what happens.

Didn't you get the memo? People grade cars looking exclusively at the max speed the car can get at on a straight line. On a sunny day, a fresh new road, and preferably with strong wind pushing in your direction.

<insert long rant about intangibles>

Can someone please post optimal gear for 18/53/0? proffs is enchanting/jewelcrafting, mm ye very nice illustration+dying curse over dying curse+embrace, takes a long time to get illustration up to 200

I understand if you dont look at ALL the posts in this thread, but your question is already answered in the FIRST post.

/nvm

Have any of you found any discrepancies between RAWR and Theory Craft-o-Matic ? I am finding that the two don't completely agree. It is possible that I am making an input error between the two, though I have double checked my work.
Theorycraft-o-Matic is providing me the following stat valuations:
DPS Stat DPS Worth
1 Spell Power 1.44
1 Crit Rating 1.11
1 Haste Rating 1.22

Where as Rawr is providing the following valuations:
1 Spell Power 1.44
1 Crit Rating 1.24
1 Haste Rating 1.21

This does change my gear choices considerably.

A. Have any of you found any discrepancies between the two?
B. If you were to choose between the two programs, which would you trust more?

Regardless both programs are extreemly useful and a great help.

Decurse/blinking: lower the dps time setting
Mana drains: set mana drain and drain frequency
Periodic AOE (I assume you mean boss AOE for pushback): set interrupt frequency
Add rushes (I assume you mean time spent AOEing adds by the player): set AOE target level, number of targets and duration (% of fight spent AOEing)
Healthstone/Health pot: disable mana potion, mana gem, speed potion, wild magic potion

And yes, every fight is going to have some degree of variance. For example, if instructor Raz targets you with his knifey thing (that's the technical term) every single time he uses it, you're going to suffer more damage loss to pushback than average. But you can no better predict completely random occurances than rawr can.

Furthermore, if you decide you need more mana regen or resist gear or whatever for a given fight due to conditions, it's going to help you select the pieces to swap that will have the lowest impact on your DPS bottom line.

--

As for Illini, rawr and TCOM are two very different beasts. Rawr is an LP optimizer, and I believe TCOM is essentially an equation solver. Rawr will handle such cases as periodic raid buffs (FM for example), heroism at various points, stacked cooldowns, mana/speed/wild magic pots and the like, and I do not believe TCOM does this.

That said, that's a pretty big discrepancy between crit rating value. Here's what I get just loading my profile and turning basically all raid buffs on. It seems tcom is universally valuing crit lower than rawr does.

Frostfire
TCOM Crit value
With CSD: 1.16
Without CSD: 1.1
Difference: 0.06

Rawr Crit value
With CSD: 1.27
Without CSD: 1.19
Difference: 0.08

Fireball
TCOM Crit value
With CSD: 0.99
Without CSD: 0.94
Difference: 0.05

Rawr Crit value
With CSD: 1.10
Without CSD: 1.03
Difference: 0.07