The Arcane thread - Page 28

Xentropy · 01/26/09, 11:15 PM

Confirmed. I noticed the tooltip change as well and just checked and only saw a 15% increase per stack. At the moment the Arcane Blast glyph does nothing, so also uncheck that from Rawr for now (along with disabling "Allow Latency Combos") for accurate readings. This, at least with my gear and Rawr settings puts arcane dps only nominally above FFB (4700 vs 4630), and FFB is well above arcane+scorch (or fireball, but I have a DK in my raid with Razorice).

Omnia · 01/26/09, 11:21 PM

Note, after the hotfix, I still get these Rawr stats for Patchwerk (correct glyphs and appropriate gear I own, per spec):

Arcane 6529dps
Arcane 6146dps (broken glyph)
FFB 5796dps
Fireball 5698dps

Edit: Didn't take into account the AB glyph breakage

Dragonrhonin · 01/26/09, 11:28 PM

Originally Posted by Xentropy

Confirmed. I noticed the tooltip change as well and just checked and only saw a 15% increase per stack. At the moment the Arcane Blast glyph does nothing, so also uncheck that from Rawr for now (along with disabling "Allow Latency Combos") for accurate readings. This, at least with my gear and Rawr settings puts arcane dps only nominally above FFB (4700 vs 4630), and FFB is well above arcane+scorch (or fireball, but I have a DK in my raid with Razorice).

And now we play the waiting game for the live numbers to come in. Wonderful. I'm glad to know that blizzard hasn't retreated from their Knee jerk reactions.

deadlyice · 01/26/09, 11:31 PM

So clipping is hotfixed and the glyph is not adding any damage?

Just need the Arc Barrage nerf to finish off the spec, even though mage burst is not half of what the qq forum folks have presented to the developers.

Then it would be pointless to cast anything but Arc Blast and Missle Barrage, but that's not sustainable with our mana regen.

I can confirm the clipping is hotfixed, I can't tell if the glyph is broken or not.

Kyth · 01/26/09, 11:39 PM

Originally Posted by Xentropy

Rawr settings puts arcane dps only nominally above FFB (4700 vs 4630)

I have a mac so can't use Rawr (the directions on the site don't work) so asking: did you count a DK with razorice in that? Or is that "nominally ahead" with razorice?

Kavan · 01/26/09, 11:39 PM

Doing some range tests on training dummies I get with AB glyph on 53.8% increase (not extensive so there's some room for error). Tooltip says 18% on AB, that would put it at 54% on 3 stacks which is pretty close to what I saw from combat log. AM gets 45% on 3 stack. For ABar I get 53.7% increase. I'd place a working assumption that AM is not affected by AB glyph and AB and ABar gain 3% per stack.

manly · 01/26/09, 11:53 PM

I need more definitive numbers though before I update the first post. I want to be crystal clear sure of everything.

Xentropy · 01/26/09, 11:59 PM

Originally Posted by Kyth

I have a mac so can't use Rawr (the directions on the site don't work) so asking: did you count a DK with razorice in that? Or is that "nominally ahead" with razorice?

That was including Razorice. Just my personal gear with my personal raid settings. I suspect with gear built around arcane and a raid without Razorice arcane would still come out ahead (as reported by another poster), just not by as much. Whether the 5% (?) value over FFB is worth being a leech spec (requiring a lot of outside buffs to do what it does) and a lot of regemming/gearing is up to you.

Kavan · 01/27/09, 12:01 AM

Redoing the numbers with changes to glyph. Highest dps cycle is AB spam with MBAM-ABar at 3 stack, if ABar procs do MBAM-ABar immediately. This gives 5008.26 dps, 412.84 mps. Optimal pair is ABx3-ABar with MBAM-ABar at 3 stack, if ABar procs do MBAM-ABar immediately (4790.41 dps, 243.87 mps) and the highest dps cycle is also the optimal pair.

Kyth · 01/27/09, 12:03 AM

Well it's relevant because it means if you don't have razorice (I don't think it's that common, is it?) then arcane will be ahead even without "a lot of regemming/gearing."

The lack of scorch is incredibly stupid yes, but that feels like a tree design error that might get fixed in the next patch.

(all of scorch seems like a design error though -- who thought that a single class being able to provide something as big as +10% crit was a good idea without another class to fill in for it?)

Anobix · 01/27/09, 12:13 AM

Originally Posted by epiphenom

I think we just got hotfixed. As of right now for me, casting Arcane Missiles consumes the Blast debuff immediately, and at no point can you chain in a Barrage with extra damage. Anyone else experiencing the same?

Well that explains a lot of the past hour that I spent doing it on target dummies in org. I finally got the clipping down but didn't see any difference in damage. Well crapple. Either we got hotfixed or something was really wrong with my past few hundred or so casts.

♦ nathanbp · 01/27/09, 1:14 AM

Originally Posted by Kavan

Redoing the numbers with changes to glyph. Highest dps cycle is AB spam with MBAM-ABar at 3 stack, if ABar procs do MBAM-ABar immediately. This gives 5008.26 dps, 412.84 mps. Optimal pair is ABx3-ABar with MBAM-ABar at 3 stack, if ABar procs do MBAM-ABar immediately (4790.41 dps, 243.87 mps) and the highest dps cycle is also the optimal pair.

Even without the shatter combo we should be using ABar after MBAM?

Kavan · 01/27/09, 1:18 AM

Originally Posted by nathanbp

Even without the shatter combo we should be using ABar after MBAM?

It's more using ABar at 0 stacks of AB than using ABar after MBAM to put another perspective on it.

Omnia · 01/27/09, 2:13 AM

Originally Posted by Kavan

It's more using ABar at 0 stacks of AB than using ABar after MBAM to put another perspective on it.

I think he's asking why 0-stacked Abar even shows up in your suggested rotation. Are you maybe getting this result just because Rawr does not currently include the [AB3-Abar, AB3-MBAM on proc] rotation? Casting that single Abar should be a dps loss.

bombdigie · 01/27/09, 2:19 AM

Originally Posted by Kavan

It's more using ABar at 0 stacks of AB than using ABar after MBAM to put another perspective on it.

It's best not to use a rotation then it would seem. Continue to use Arcane Blast until Missle Barrage procs, at which point you use AM followed by ABr, if ABr procs MB use AM and again follow with ABr. Use AB afterwards until MB procs, if AB rank 0 procs MB continue to AB until rank 3.