Why not just give Abarr the ability to apply the 5% crit debuff with a 15 second duration. Then at least it would have some purpose aside from being a movement filler. Would an easily applied 5% crit debuff have huge pvp implications? Personaly I do not think so, but I don't pvp enough to have an idea.

I've always been fond of the idea that Netherwind Presence also grants the mage's party/raid the same buff as Wrath of Air Totem. 5% crit from either MBAM or Abt could work too, I guess.

I like the idea of ABarr applying the 5 crit debuff, but I think it should be tied into AB stacks. As in if you have 2 or more stacks it will apply the 5% and the more stacks you have the longer the debuff will last. i.e. 4 stacks = 30 second duration.

This could start to sound an awful lot like a ranged combo point system, which may or may not be a good direction for the tree.

It has nothing to do with RP, and everything to do with gameplay mechanics.

Already the best DPS spec has DoTs incorporated to boost damage and the best DPS glyph only affects a DoT spell. Already we don't play much unlike Destruction Warlocks, who may have more DoT spells in their arsenal but in reality don't use most of them in the normal PvE scenario. If both classes fill the same niche, what use is there to have them both?

Classes should feel distinct not because of RP, but because a game should offer more than one solution to a problem, if the way that Mages and Warlocks handle their roles is very much similar, then there's simply no reason to have them both included in the game.

Regarding PvP, as you've said yourself, Blizzard are more afraid of a bogyman than of a real threat. Arcane doesn't pose any threat in PvP at the moment due to its vulnerability and its lack of mana efficiency. the spec isn't used outside of a few 2v2 comps and is mostly useful in 3v3 for RMP mirrors. Furthermore, it offers less burst than Destruction does to warlocks, who now enjoy a survivability much closer to Frost Mages than to the rare Arcane ones. I simply can't see Arcane becoming a 1 shot wonder given current PoM & AP and the 3.2 resilience changes.

"The problem with buffing Arcane's damage is that so many of the changes could be used to get big Arcane Barrage + PoM "something" back to back and 'splode someone in 2 shots again (or maybe 4 shots if you get another Barrage and Fireblast)."

GC is afraid of squishy arcane mages using 4 offensive GCD to kill a target in PvP.

Ultimately, I don't care whether my shiny spells are blue, orange or purple, I care for how I make use of them for maximum damage.

At the moment, other than TTW, Frost only benefits (strong) utility from Arcane, not direct damage. Buffing arcane damage and scaling it up to that of destruction warlocks might allow arcane mages to use a few GCD with CDs to burst a target down while CC works it magic, but they will still lack the survivability which warlocks have. As a result, the only bracket in which Arcane Mages can be viable, assuming they would have this much direct damage, would be 2vs2. which is being neglected starting next season, so I don't see how that would be a problem.

Then again, I might be totally off the mark here, since I have only been playing this game at level 80 for less than 3 months.

"2. For 'burn' rotations Arcane Blast spam might be more of an option. It now takes 4 stacks to get to full nuking potential so I expect spamming will yield more impressive dps results at 72% increased damage compared to spamming on live. Having to restack will be more noticable than it is now."

I completely agree here. I will be looking forward to seeing the math behind how much dps an arcane blast rotation yields compared to having to rebuild 4 stacks.

I'm extremely shocked by these changes. People claim that arcane falls behind x% behind fire but from my experience (raiding with some of the best fire mages on my server), arcane seems superior in single target dps. Even equipped with 2pc t7.5, arcane generates ridiculous dps on +damage% ulduar encounters (7.7k dps on IC is one example!).

Someone noted that the t9.5 4set bonus scales better with fire simply because it adds crit. I don't think it scales poorly with arcane at all considering it adds crit to both arcane blast and arcane missiles (2 active spells of arc) as opposed to simply fireball (1 active spell of fire); fire mages are already hitting 70% crit rates and using pyroblast as a significant % of their spells yet 9.5 set bonus still does not benefit this spell!

Arcane Barrage is already useful in pve.

With the considerable reduction in mana expenditure, simplified rotation and increased damage component, arcane will most likely be pretty good now. I'll do calculations when I get home.

The arguments to that will be 1) the styles of arcane and fire should be different and basically copying ignite is making them too similar and 2) ABar already fulfills a role by giving you instant damage to use while mobile (which is honestly fairly often) and 2a) it was a quick arcane blast debuff dump if you needed it.

I'm still eagerly awaiting some numbers from the PTS. For quick burn fights like Vezax I think the changes have serious potential.

On the topic of possible raid utility, there is an arcane haste buff you can spell steal in nexus that gives you and your group significant haste. This could easily implemented to fill the slot of bloodlust or wrath of air totem.

If arcane is to get either wrath of air or bloodlust it's more likely to be wrath of air. Flavour you know.

The changes have already been incorporated into SimCraft. It simply casts Arcane Blast without limit until Missile Barrage procs, then uses the proc, regardless of stack size. I tried setting it to use a 4xBlast/1xMissiles rotation, but that lost a couple % DPS.

The results in simcraft's BiS T8 gear, using Fire as the comparison point:

8029: 57/3/11 (+3.3%)
7775: 20/51/0
7714: 53/18/0 (-0.8%)
7288: 0/53/18 (-6.3%)
6491: 18/0/53 (-16.5%)
6484: 18/0/52 (-16.6%, no Brain Freeze)

I'm doing another run that'll include scale factors, but it'll take a little longer. I'll post them when it's done; I know a lot of Arcane Mages are worried about crit scaling still.

So, is raid utility still a significant concern? Or is a 3.some % advantage enough to justify the lack?

Raid utility should always be a concern, as numbers like that keep changing back-and-forth as they tweak mechanics, both in future patches and expansions.

However I think Bloat in the talent tree is a bigger issue that should be addressed first. (Maybe a bit selfish, as raid utility is also important).

Just a reminder: We did not yet implement the feature/bug of AB 4-stack only affecting Arcane Blast.

I believe these changes make Spark of Hope even more powerful for Arcane Spec:

You should get the following Mana Costs:
223 - 42 = 181
181 * 2.3 = 235.3

Therefore costs are:
X-Stack: Cost with SoH (Cost w/o SoH)
0-Stack: 181 (223)
1-Stack: 416 (513)
2-Stack: 652 (803)
3-Stack: 887 (1093)
4-Stack+: 1122 (1383)

Overall its a savings of 18-19% regardless of how many stacks (42/223).

The savings were less before because Arcane Missiles cost nearly 1000 mana, making the savings from SoH about 4-5% for each AM cast. Now the cost of AM is removed so AB is pretty much your only mana costing spell.

So Spark of Hope will essentially provide you with the spirit regen, 55 crit rating (more with 2pc T9) and 19% less mana consumption as an Arcane Mage. Sounds a bit overpowered to me.

If I misrepresented the effect of the trinket, please let me know and I'll delete the post. I have it so I'll try it out on the PTR tonight and confirm.

No, you're right: Flat "reduce mana cost" stat items have often had creative (unintended?) ways to exploit the stat in the past.

Scale Factors

Green: highest value
Blue: above average value
Black: within 0.1 of average
Orange: below average value
Red: lowest value

Spec	Int	Spi	SP	Hit	Crit	Haste
Average	0.63	0.79	1.63	3.00	1.11	1.62
57/3/11	1.07	0.90	1.65	3.39	0.98	1.56
20/51/0	0.45	0.91	1.75	3.21	1.48	1.80
53/18/0	1.00	0.83	1.60	3.11	0.96	1.65
0/53/18	0.45	0.94	1.66	2.95	1.55	1.72
18/0/53	0.20	0.39	1.48	2.35	0.60	1.35

57/3/11: 2 highest, 1 above avg, 2 avg, 1 below avg, 0 lowest
20/51/0: 2 highest, 3 above avg, 0 avg, 1 below avg, 0 lowest
53/18/0: 0 highest, 2 above avg, 3 avg, 1 below avg, 0 lowest
0/53/18: 2 highest, 0 above avg, 3 avg, 1 below avg, 0 lowest
18/0/53: 0 highest, 0 above avg, 0 avg, 0 below avg, 6 lowest

Arcane wasn't significantly nerfed by 3.0.9 for PvE, though(aside from the bugfix of AM->AB "shatters"), and it was actually quite good at the beginning of Ulduar even post-nerfs. It's the scaling factors that put the nail in its coffin. And a 3.3% dps advantage in T8 analogous gear could easily be overcome by T9, the set bonuses alone are on the order of twice as powerful for Fire as Arcane. If that's the case, Blizzard might simply be looking ahead with their changes. I still feel that Missile Barrage should have its proc chance based on crits, though, and that the crit multiplier for the spec should be increased to 200%.

In all honesty, that would produce LESS pvp burst than the changes that they just introduced, because Arcane crits outside of PoM/clearcasting don't happen much in PvP, but 3-stack AB Missile Barrage that is guaranteed to proc? That is a huge amount of burst.

I've played Arcane in pvp at high(2200+) arena ratings, and typically speaking, IF you can stack Arcane Blast to 3, CC the healer(PoM sheep is better than PoM Blast a lot of the time) AND you have a Missile Barrage available, it's good fucking game. You pop Arcane Power and your missiles are critting for 4-5k, hitting for 2.5-3k, and you're dumping 15-20k damage into your target in less than 2 seconds, followed by an Arcane Barrage that's another 3k.

Of course, the process of actually getting that many stacks in arena is extremely difficult, and more often you are stuck trying to make do with 1 or 2. Having twice the chance to proc Missile Barrage and having it cost no mana is a gigantic pvp buff, this means you can use Missile Barrage as your go-to burst instead of your 'oh, well that's nice but I can't rely on it' burst. It's very good burst because it's immune to pushback and channeled(goes through pillars), and even if you get interrupted by a stun you still get several missiles off. For it to cost no mana and be available twice as often is a gigantic buff, and for the punishing mana cost of 3x stack to be significantly reduced is also a big buff.

So I dunno why they are pretending that these changes somehow "avoid" pvp buffs, they are really big pvp buffs compared to other suggestions that DON'T involve dots, including my own.

They are probably ok with buffing arcane pvp at this point, as long as they aren't buffing the amount of burst. Buffing frequency of burst is totally different from buffing its potency, it is a good way to increase overall power without significantly increasing insta-gib potential.

@Lhivera

Am I correct to assume the numbers provided represent a 'patchwerk-scenario'?

If so what happens if you throw movement into the mix?

DPS will go down, obviously. This is true for any class/spec. You can't accurately model how much because movement varies from fight to fight.

As fire, I can maintain an almost completely optimal rotation so long as fights only require short range motion (I move on global cooldowns) - mostly owing to higher crit rates (re: hot streaks) and 4pT8. An optimal arcane rotation will generate less global cooldowns, so I'm guessing that the penalty will be a bit more. Arcane still has the advantage of being able to target-switch with no ramp-up.

Also, faster casts are penalized less by target switching and movement.

There has been some assumption that arcane barrage will lose any utility at all in pve (outside of movement). I disagree. Due to the mana-cost reductions presented by the PTR changes, it may be advantageous to use ABar as the AB debuff stack clearing spell. It has (and will continue to be unless altered) better DPS than normal AM. It also has the additional advantage of proc'ing MBAM.

Due to this combination, before the calculations on reducing dynamic cycles are made, it would seem that ABar may resume as part of an "off-cycle" where there is still some mana management involved. Another common scenario is during a burn phase where MBar has not proc'd after 5+ casts and the caster must decide how long to continue AB spam before breaking the debuff.