The Way of the Light: Holy in Cataclysm - Page 23

Fallenangel · 12/02/10, 10:29 AM

The average spirit you gain from Core if you use it every 3 minutes is 775. Assuming a 15s overlap with MT, it counts as (5*1926 + 15*1926*4.5) / 180 = 775.
DCT, assuming 100% uptime, has an average spirit value of (17*400*4.5 + 163*400) / 180 = 532.
Not sure how you derived a value of 426 for DCT?
As for shared cooldown that is a concern. wowhead doesn't list any shared CDs for Core which is suspicious. Combining DCT and Core or using a proc trinket like FoM gets around that issue.
MT is not far behind other mana CDs without any spirit trinkets and for a single target. Now factor in the spirit trinkets and affecting up to 5 targets, and you get a balance problem.

Nodrak · 12/02/10, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by Fallenangel

The average spirit you gain from Core if you use it every 3 minutes is 775. Assuming a 15s overlap with MT, it counts as (5*1926 + 15*1926*4.5) / 180 = 775.
DCT, assuming 100% uptime, has an average spirit value of (17*400*4.5 + 163*400) / 180 = 532.
Not sure how you derived a value of 426 for DCT?
As for shared cooldown that is a concern. wowhead doesn't list any shared CDs for Core which is suspicious. Combining DCT and Core or using a proc trinket like FoM gets around that issue.
MT is not far behind other mana CDs without any spirit trinkets and for a single target. Now factor in the spirit trinkets and affecting up to 5 targets, and you get a balance problem.

I assumed MT was 350% of X instead of X + 350%. I had factored both as I wasn't sure, but that was in the post that didn't make it. Mana tide is also only 12s as far as I know. I forgot about waiting for each MT, which does produce a boost in the average spirit, I also forgot the second mana tide for the DMC, but thats what I get for doing too many things at once.

For 12s mana tide, (8*1926 + 12*1926*4.5)/180 = 663, vs (168*400 + 12*400*4.5)/180 = 493

DMC: 400 | 493 spirit
Core: 321 | 663 spirit

On the power of Mana Tide, lets consider the boost for Core, of ~342 spirit. At 6000 Int and 3000 Spirit, this mana tide boosted the Mp5 from just the trinket by ~221.5 Mp5. However, this is 1926 spirit getting boosted by MT, when we only have 3000 spirit to start with (rough 85 numbers). This is more of a case of the trinket giving a large boost to a stat we won't be stacking. However, there are many powerful trinkets it will have to contend with, and they will not require a resto shaman. The 663 avg spirit from Core with MT gives around 430 Mp5 at that gear level. Tyrande's Favorite Doll is 350 Mp5 at all gear levels and does not need MT.

MT has always been powerful, Wrath's Divine Plea was pretty much matched in total mana return by Wrath's MTT, but the current/cata MT is kind of wonky. For example poping it gives moonkins 4.5x more Hit rating >.>

Edit again: Bah I even read that talent like 10 times since 4.0 came out and never tied it to the MTT... Math is off in this post by a bit.

Fallenangel · 12/02/10, 11:16 AM

Tide can be talented to last 16.8s - an odd figure, for sure, as it's a 40% boost from the base 12s. The general purpose resto shaman spec can accommodate this talent, so the 15s overlap between the spirit procs and MT is not the actual best case scenario.
As a simple rule of thumb, having a tide is the same as a 30% boost to spirit. This is true for static spirit on gear.

Lantern214 · 12/03/10, 10:20 PM

Let's not forget

[Tyrande's Favorite Doll] [(discovered via Archeology.)
I see this leaning towards a dps then a healer.

and

[Jar of Ancient Remedies]

Xanro · 12/06/10, 10:29 AM

Another possibility to stack spirit with MT is the T11 4 set bonus.

(4) Set: Whenever your Holy Radiance spell is active, you gain 1620 Spirit.

This is an average Spirit gain of 1620*10/30=540 spirit.
(if used on CD)

with only one MT (assuming you can use HR on cd, which is quite improbable as it is one of the strongest AE healing effects...) you could increase to an average spirit of ((1620*10*4,5)+(1620*50))/180=855 spirit

As the effect of HR lasts only 10s there should be no problem to overlap with MT.

• malthrin · 12/06/10, 3:31 PM

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