There are no notes regarding TV damage increase (only CS tooltip). Are we sure there is actually a change? If I recall, doesn't it normally show 270% on the tooltip (glyph? 235% * 115% = 270%)? Can we get 100% confirmation from someone who can log on live, check their tooltip, log same character on PTR and check tooltip?

Ronark - partial resists were removed with Cataclysm. It should not be possible for HoL to suffer from partial resist. Just to confirm I'm understanding you properly - Mastery is (roughly) 20% of actual damage inflicted by the attack (i.e. after armour mitigation effects)?

I can post stat comparisons as DPS, I thought comparatives were more bottom-line useful for people who use stat weights on websites. What's actually calculated is DPS per stat and then I divide everything by the DPS increase of 1 Str (so Str equals a value of 1 and everything else is fractional). I'd just remove that last step in posted info.

Both formats are equally valid, I just question the stat to DPS as having additional usefulness. In short, how useful is it to be able to say 1 Str is worth X DPS for Ret and Y DPS for a DK. Are loot squabbles getting down to the compare DPS between classes state? Individual stat-based DPS shouldn't be important, whereas overall DPS may be (for guilds that min-max raid composition ruthlessly).

The DivPurp change could lead to easier manipulation of 4 piece tier bonus. A few extra open GCD in a fight and more reliable control of HP combine to consistent 1 HP for 20 sec Inq, thus allowing for a lot more overall TV as HamSlammer discussed the other day.

Glyph of CS may again rise above Glyph of Exo with the CS base damage buff. The Str/3%Crit meta should be our new joy, unless the quantity of Str is remarkably low. I expect priorities to change - Redcape and I should have info once we update our spreadsheets to the new mechanics. The Rebuke->Sacred Shield is nifty. Not a required talent, but still extremely nice for PvE (wonder if it would function on Ashbury in SFK).

Edit as it doesn't deserve a separate post:
I think all gear change discussions should wait on the PTR to finalize. First version is rarely what rolls live. In 2-ish weeks we should be able to more accurately assess gear in a most-likely-to-roll-live world. What looks good one day could be trash the next - anyone trying to gear in an anticipatory fashion should wait to late in a PTR lifecycle.

It is still underbudget compared to other trinkets available through raiding:

The strength proc is too low, but I'm still waiting for a confirmation from a GM whether this is intended or not.

Although mastery might beat crit and haste with the upcoming patch, a hit (valor point vendor) or expertise trinket will be better when you really need the stats. And then there is the opportunity to reforge (obviously to mastery) when you've reached your caps.

New version of my spreadsheet is up and linked in the OP.

OP also has the added caveat that PTR changes will not be reflected until they go live. The OP is for tracking how things currently work, not how things might wind up working next week.

Discussing item comparison with a first version of PTR changes is never wise. It's rare for the first PTR version to be what happens in live. Give it 2ish weeks to shake out. Easy examples are that CS Damage change could be revoked (or increased), %s on DivPurp and Holy Damage from Mastery could change (up or down). Small changes can have huge impacts.

But even in that case, its gap is going to be much smaller than previously; and it will easily become the best pre-raiding trinket, I think.

The mastery changes will also likely change our enchanting wishlist slightly depending on final stat weightings post patch (e.g. I'd imagine Enchant Boots - Mastery will now reign supreme)...

I prefer dps values because it makes it easier to compare stats to things that aren't easily represented as stats. For example, its easy to get a rough estimate of what the 2pc ret and prot set bonuses would be worth in dps by looking at recount data from a fight, but how much Str is that equivalent to? You need to actual dps value of Str to figure that out.

In addition, the scales values hide where the differences between your and Redcape's values come from. Is your model valuing Str higher than his? Or are you valuing combat ratings lower? Either one would result in the same set of scaled rating, but obscures where the differences really lie.

As you say, its easy to divide everything by the dps value of strength, but its impossible to go the other direction. I personally find it just as easy to plug dps values into wowhead/lootrank/etc compared to the scaled values. If the site doesn't divide by the sum of the weights like wowhead (I'll never understand why they do this and why there's no way to disable it) you can even get a number for the item with some real-world meaning and see that that minor upgrade is really only worth +10dps or whatever.

I'll honestly be pretty surprised if the PTR is still up in 2 weeks with this patch. This isn't a major content patch by any stretch of the imagination. I suspect the only reason its even up on the PTR is so that they can get a few more eyeballs on the thing to hopefully reduce the amount of hotfixing they've been doing lately. The actual changes, though, are primarily related to stuff that they've already hotfixed and need to update the client to match those changes, or things they just couldn't hotfix but want/need to get changed quickly.

If I had to guess, I'd peg the 18th as the most likely release date for this patch, but I'd be more surprised if it was delayed past that thadon if it showed up this coming Tuesday.

I do agree that these may not be the final numbers. If mastery is really that much better now then I wonder if they've over-buffed us? To that end, though, I think its important for us to be looking at the gearing implications of these changes as well as the mechanics. T11 prot chest, as well as several other tank items, now look even more attractive. The +5/10% CS bonuses from the PvP gloves and prot sets are now more valuable (though, the opportunity cost of completing the set or wearing the gloves is a bit higher now). The PTR is generally Blizzard's best guess at what they think should go live. If there are any major issues with the way things are on the PTR it would be much better to discover them and trying to bring them to Blizzard's attention sooner rather than later.

Built a testbed PTR sheet. I receive about a 10% overall DPS increase with the present changes (I did not model an increase in TV from 235% to 270% - until confirmed otherwise I think someone read a tooltip and got excited).

Priority became:
Inquisition > TV > Exo > HoW > CS > Judge > HW > Cons

In short, the only change is TV jumps up to second place above HoW and Exo. It still appears advantageous to use Zealotry and AW together - should be fairly clean. TV when engaging Zeal+AW, then cycle through HoW, CS, TV, Filler. Occasionally Exo would step in, but it either takes the filler spot or makes that sequence HoW, Exo, CS, TV.

For my gear CS Glyph slightly edges out Exo Glyph. It's possible, even probable, this isn't the case for all gear (such as weapon DPS lagging behind stats). Difference for me is about 0.2% DPS, so it's really marginal either direction and easily folds into RNG fluctuation.

Going back to a +3% crit meta looks to be about a 1% upgrade. Swapping the Crit Rating to some (presently unknown to me) value of Str should also boost the value.

Mastery maps smoothly. Slots just a shade under Expertise in value. Since it became better it also boosts Hit and Expertise a fraction (a miss/dodge means no benefit from Mastery).
In my PTRfaker sheet roughly:

Stat	Value
Str	1
Hit	.296
Exp	.190
Mastery	.184
Crit	.130
Haste	.128

Same format as presently used for apples and apples - not putting DPS per stat to avoid comparison confusion.

Haste is probably about equal with crit - its model remains less than beautiful because of the AoW and DivPurp procs. Mastery has more than doubled in value and is now about 40% ahead of Crit/Haste. It shouldn't appreciably change gemming - still one orange/purple for 20+ Str or two for 30+. Gemming for Mastery bonus or a single-gem 10 Str should still be a minor loss. Str is simply still that far ahead.

Personal assessment - Mastery is too powerful because it goes from notably behind crit/haste to notably ahead. It probably needs a smaller coefficient (1.75% to 2.25% per 1 Mastery) to balance about equal with Crit/Haste. Str blowing away all stats is bad design, but it would take vast rework to correct at this stage, Blizzard is obviously swallowing any bad taste and proceeding. Everything else should be designed to be roughly equal so juggling is more dynamic and not kneejerk "Reforge for X". Since Mastery is getting the facelift, it's the perfect time to peg it to roughly equate the other two stats.

Chippy - fair enough. DPS Increase per Stat will be put in the OP, but don't expect it reveal any root difference between the spreadsheets functionality. If it did, I'd already have dug in and corrected my flaw (or advised Redcape if I thought I saw one in his work). The difference is, at root based on scope and scale of simulation.

Finally - minor bugfix version of my spreadsheet is up with same link.

Our mastery will definitely be affected by inquistion as stated by a blue post.


While I agree ideally all the secondary stats should be similar I believe it's unrealistic to create a situation where ranking will shift depending on stats, weapon dps, weapon speed etc. The fine tuning for that will be incredible hard, particular when looking at 10 classes/30 speccs. In this case a change to the mastery % is a easy fix, but there will always be 1 secondary stat which is better than the rest and everyone should always reforge to that stat (after hit/exp).

Exemplar, with the majority of serious raiding Rets using DMC hurricane unless the proc was changed to not be 100% proc off HoW on PTR. Is that reflected in the priority rotation? I had assumed Prio would be:
Inqu>TV>HoW>Exo>CS>J>HW to keep Lightning strike damage high.

Is there any way to test if there's a cap for Mastery stacking? I ask this wondering if we could end up in a situation like Arpen classes ended-up in Wrath, where they stacked it to 100%, with the stat point value increasing the more of it you had.

As I see our new Mastery, wouldn't this be a similar case?

I spent about 20 minutes on the PTR today and the only useful information I got is that the new mastery procs definitely can't crit.

Aside from that it really feels like Holy Power generation is much lower than on live. Running a normal "rotation" of Inq>TV>Exo>CS>Judge>HW it felt like I had too many free GCDs. I want to say that Divine Purpose needs to be buffed and/or Judgement should always proc a Holy Power.