The Retribution Concordance - 4.3, Voice of the DPS - Page 67

WolfBlitzer · 05/19/11, 1:36 AM

Originally Posted by saboya

And they just make up for it in the stupidest way possible. I can see it already:

Heroic Omnotron, Magmatron and Electron are up.
Electron casts "whatever its called shield that you can't hit"
Electron casts Lightning Conductor on X.
Nefarian uses Shadow Infusion on Lightning Conductor.
Everyone stack.
Ret Pally hit Magmatron.
Seals of Command hits Electron.
*BOOM*

We're back to Wrath with unavoidable AoE damage as part of our rotation, only it's much worse now.

You use SoR on Omnotron often?

Edit: Since my snark apparently wasn't perfectly clear, tooltip comparison on mmo-champ shows that the holy cleave component of Seals of Command remains tied to Seal of Righteousness, it only had its target cap removed.

Groven · 05/19/11, 1:44 AM

I believe he was talking about SoC hitting all melee targets. Even while using SoT it looks to hit all mobs in melee.

golfinguy · 05/19/11, 1:56 AM

Originally Posted by saboya

And they just make up for it in the stupidest way possible. I can see it already:

Heroic Omnotron, Magmatron and Electron are up.
Electron casts "whatever its called shield that you can't hit"
Electron casts Lightning Conductor on X.
Nefarian uses Shadow Infusion on Lightning Conductor.
Everyone stack.
Ret Pally hit Magmatron.
Seals of Command hits Electron.
*BOOM*

We're back to Wrath with unavoidable AoE damage as part of our rotation, only it's much worse now.

Hovering over the change on MMO, it works with Seal of Righteousness. Don't use that seal, don't hit all target in range from what I see.

MBar · 05/19/11, 5:05 AM

To save further confusion, this is the actual tooltip of the new version:

Seals of Command
Your Seal of Righteousness, Seal of Truth, and Seal of Justice now also deal 7% weapon damage when triggered. In addition, your Seal of Righteousness now hits all enemy targets within melee range.

So all that's happened is the Cleave Seal is now an AoE Seal with the same damage, which is much more useful.

Aviendha · 05/19/11, 7:08 AM

Which leaves to determine the number of targets necessary for SoR to become more attractive than SoT.

saboya · 05/19/11, 9:57 AM

Well, that clears it up, I was in fact considering AoE SoC would poc on SoT.

montypythizzle · 05/19/11, 5:45 PM

Looks like the Divine Storm healing increase went away from Templar's Verdict glyph from when it increased healing from DS back in Wrath.

Jonuts · 05/19/11, 9:43 PM

Originally Posted by Jorj

>Consumes all Holy Power to increase your Holy Damage by 30%
>All Holy Damage
>Holy

I think I missed the point COMPLETELY on this. I wouldn't even think of tacking on an extra 30% damage to fire damage because of inquisition, so when I read that, I assumed (that dreaded word!) that there was a reason the 30% extra CS damage from inquisition wouldn't count towards the 15% extra fire damage...

wellsdaddy · 05/20/11, 3:03 PM

It definitely looks like it wouldnt be considered a BiS. Perhaps a useful fill-in over a 346, but if you're already into heroics I doubt thats an issue. Even looking at my personal stat weights with Redcapes Spreadsheet and comparing the jumbo tron to the rep belt from hyjal produces:

Belt of Ferocious Wolf -

233str * 225 = 52,425
169mas * 101 = 17,069
149crit * 94 = 14,006

Total - 83,500

Heroic Jumbo-

286str * 225 = 64,350
97dodge = 0
64crit * 94 = 6,016
181mas * 101 = 18,281

Total - 88,647

A slight jump but I dont believe thats a huge gain over a rep belt. Looking a little more apples to apples, the belt off Maloriak in normal mode and heroic produces -

Belt of Absolute Zero - Assuming hit caps have been reached of course

233str * 225 = 52,425
159hit (as mas/crit avg) * 97.5 = 15,502.5
169crit * 94 = 15,886

Total - 83,813.5

Heroic Belt of Absolute Zero -

266str * 225 = 59,850
181hit (as mas/crit avg) * 97.5 = 17,647.5
191crit * 94 = 17,954

Total - 95,451 - By far seems to be our BiS belt for most gear sets I would think

I'd say the Jumbo Belt is at best a slight upgrade from the 359 Rep belt and Maloriak belt but is far from a BiS status. My math or figures may be slightly varied based on individual stat weights, but I believe the comparison should be pretty close based on what I understand about our stats.

Josefar · 05/20/11, 11:03 PM

I think they removed both the old bonuses from the Templars Verdict glyph and the T10 2p bonus's Divine Storm refresh.

And for BiS belt a crit/mastery or hit/mastery combo from throne of the four winds heroic is obviously superior but odds of getting it is low of course.

baneat · 05/20/11, 11:38 PM

Originally Posted by Josefar

I think they removed both the old bonuses from the Templars Verdict glyph and the T10 2p bonus's Divine Storm refresh.

And for BiS belt a crit/mastery or hit/mastery combo from throne of the four winds heroic is obviously superior but odds of getting it is low of course.

Confirmed; 2t10 for Retribution was changed to a flat damage increase equal to the average DPS gain from its use during 3.3.

ihearttrees · 05/21/11, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by baneat

Confirmed; 2t10 for Retribution was changed to a flat damage increase equal to the average DPS gain from its use during 3.3.

The change has been in place for a long time now, but I believe Josefar was talking about the "hidden bonuses". 2p T10 would still refresh the DS cooldown and the TV glyph still gave the increase in healing (both along with the current listed affects).

I haven't tested either to see if the extra bonuses apply, but I would assume, from what was said, that they are not there anymore.

Tuile · 05/23/11, 3:42 AM

Ok, I am well aware that GoSot is a big stat gain, but due to the latest gear choices i made in order to increase mastery, I have ended up with (unreforged) 1086 expertise rating; which when reforged gives about 652, getting me way over cap with the glyph. So I decided to try changing the glyph to Glyph of Crusader Strike and reforging most of the expertise still.

Since I mostly suck with calculations and couldnt find a thread/post on this among most of the pages I could actually read, I was wondering if its possible for this NOT to be a dps loss for me, I'm kinda hoping it isnt :P

The "buzzkill" items with expertise that got me to this point are, reforged sapphirium helmet, Heart of Rage (hc), Massacre Threads (hc), Floating Web, Akirus the Worm Breaker (hc).

Uthaa · 05/23/11, 6:31 AM

Even with several points of expertise over the cap GoSoT is still better than Glyph of Crusader Strike.
some way to get rid of that expertise is to switch your back with Glittering Epidermis from council (better would be the heroic one) or take the pvp back that got massive mastery on it and some extra strength. you could also change your relic to pvp or the tanking one and reforge the dodge away

dehvi · 05/24/11, 12:09 PM

I've been searchin the thread, but can't seem to find the exact answer to this anywhere; at how many points of wasted expertise should we switch GoSoT to GoCS? I believe in wrath, the number was more then 6 points of wasted expertise. Is this still true?