World of Logs Analysis (Help me not suck thread) - Page 2

Ezy · 05/22/11, 6:49 AM

Originally Posted by Edendes

Sorry to the above poster -- I am too new to raiding to offer up much advice for you.

My problems:
I just started raiding not that long ago and from the WoL logs, I just do not have the throughput of everyone else in the guild.

Here is Tuesday nights raid [25 man, all normal modes]:
25 man log

I am Edendes, Holy Pally. My Armory
I received the Glaciated Helm last night, but didn't have the gems/enchants ready so I don't have it on in the snapshot.

I am having really big problems with my healing throughput. My assignments are not dying but I am consistently at least 3k below the other healers.

Examples:
Omnotron: Me: 6200, Disc Priest 7200, HPally 8670, Druid 9600, Druid 10400 [I was on the guild main tank] -- the wipe on Omnotron is when we tried to do it with someone afk at front of zone... apparently that causes a reset.
Maloriak: HPally 7000, Me 7337, Druid 7700, Disc Priest 8050, Druid 9145 [I was on add tank]
Atramedes: HPally 5066, Me 5640, Disc Priest 7415, Druid 9845, Druid 10000 [I was on the melee group consistening of 3 people]
Halfus: Me 8460, HPally 10363, Holy Priest [disc priest had to leave] 12297, Druid 12560, Druid 12940 [I was on OT]
Twins: Me 6400, Holy Priest 9800, HPally 10020, Druid 12580, Druid 12740 [I was on the melee group of 3]

Magmaw was the sloppiest kill ever -- Parasites were running rampant and I sneezed in the middle of the fight and pressed forward, falling into the freaking lava. I'm sure I won't ever hear the end of that one, so please ignore the numbers from that one.

Note: We were using ~5 healers and were short anywhere from 1-3 dps the whole evening.

No one in the heal team has said anything, but I am really disappointed in myself -- I just think I should be doing more, adding more value. It seems ridiculous that I am 3-6k lower than anyone else. Their gear might be slightly better but there isn't that big of a difference [~4 iLevel]. I am always casting either Shock / Holy Light / Divine Light. I guess part of my frustration is that I am always casting yet my #'s are still very low.

So if anyone can offer advice -- please have at it, I always want to improve and it seems that there is a lot of room for it now. We have been short on healers [running with 5] and I need to not be carried.

Thanks in advance for any assistance!

I hadn't seen this before but if you'd still like advice I can try to help a bit. (Basing entirely off of Omnotron Parse

1.) Judgement uptime, your uptime was only 77.8% with 13 casts of judgement. You should be using judgement on cooldown as it is our best source of mana, this will allow you to cast larger heals and up your HPS by quite a bit. You only had 16 Divine Light casts on that kill =(.

2.) You have zero uses of Avenging Wrath and Divine Favor, these are very strong cooldowns to use, especially paired with Guardian of Ancient Kings in certain situations.

3.) Using your Guardian of Ancient Kings, the "ideal" scenario to maximize your use of it would be to pair it with other cooldowns such as Avenging Wrath and Divine Favor, using this in a heavy raid AoE situation such as when your raid stacks together for a feud on Chimaeron, spam Divine Lights as it is your largest heal, the Guardian causes a 10% "Splash effect" to surrounding played with no target cap. This will greatly increase your HPS.

4.) On a non-HPS standpoint, you should make use of Divine Protection more, use it on situations like Incineration Security Measures on Omnotron, especially when you get into hardmode. Puts you in good practice.

--On a side note: Paladins are not a pure HPS class, if you're losing to a druid or a disc priest on meters I wouldn't worry about it. Different heal assignments allow for different players to heal more than others. Paladins are a large raid utility over pure HPS.

Velox · 06/11/11, 1:18 AM

Had a few people tell me I was taking a ton of damage compared to other paladin tanks, but my guild healers are saying otherwise. Figured I'd ask for help here to see what ya'll thought about it.

Here's my WoL parse from tonight's 10m Nefarian normal wipefest: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

And here's my armory link: Galook @ Nazgrel - Game - World of Warcraft

I'm trying to figure out why I'm taking so much damage, I've looked over other pally tanks on 10m normal Nefarian and they're only taking around 4 million damage, while I'm around 34 million damage.

Elixirs I'm using for the fight are: elixir of the master and prismatic elixir. I'm pre-potting a earthen potion to lessen some of the damage on the jump in and positioning, which I think helps quite a bit over times I didn't use it.

My defense stats are 11% dodge, 13% parry, 61% block unbuffed with ~90.76% avoidance. When my weapon enchant procs, etc and some other things I'm around 97% avoidance.

And I know I need a better weapon, but Mace of Acrid Death will not drop for me ever =/.

Here's an example of what I usually do cooldown wise:

First shadow breath from Onyxia I'll make sure I have my 3 HoPo and pop a WoG while I'm fully healed to get a nice 20kish shield. Then the next shadow breath I'll pop my Mirror of Broken Images. The 3rd I'll use Divine Guardian glyphed and a WoG heal/shield.

For the first crackle I'll pop my guardian of ancient kings, for the second I'll have my mirror and divine protection up usually so I'll pop both of those. Then maybe a ardent defender if something goes messy.

For the lava to platform transition I pop my divine shield to keep from taking that damage while I get out of the lava onto the pillar.

Svetozar · 06/11/11, 6:06 AM

Originally Posted by Velox

I'm trying to figure out why I'm taking so much damage, I've looked over other pally tanks on 10m normal Nefarian and they're only taking around 4 million damage, while I'm around 34 million damage.

You are around 34M damage taken for the 15 tries in total. If you take say 15th try
you took around 3.4M which is around the benchmark of 4M you mentioned.

Velox · 06/11/11, 1:42 PM

What was I doing in the 15th try to take so much damage though or was it just it lasted a lot longer and thus took more damage?

Minibell · 06/13/11, 9:49 PM

You took 34m damage for all 15 attempts, your damage for any attempt wasn't out of line. There are a myriad of problems, but your damage taken is not one of them. I see mechanic problems (people dying to Onyxia crackle and dying to blast novas), cooldown problems or healing problems when going over the logs and not a lot of excessive hits on you.

On point, your gear is more then capable for downing Nef 10m. Since it looks like you're kiting the mobs, I would take 2/2 pursuit of justice and 1 or 2/2 hallowed ground. Running in droping consecration right before the fireball gets there is an easy way to get initial agro on the skeletons. Without seeing a video of the fights, it's hard to tell what else is going wrong, but your damage certainly isn't the source of the failures.

As a side note you might have the druid look at the synapse springs rather than the armor flaps. The extra crit and dodge could (and would be on my druid) than the 1500 armor.

eternalwhitemoon · 07/03/11, 12:36 PM

This is not for me, but for my guildie, a prot paladin.

You see, he's just...terrible at threat. His threat is just so weak (especially AOE/add threat, but beginning threat is janky too). This presents kind of a big problem when we have a warrior and a DK in the raid--there really just aren't enough Salvs to go around.

I don't really have a huge issue with healing him, though he does seem to take a little more damage than our bear. I'm concerned about his chronic lack of decent threat. He says he reads Paladin forums and such, but I just don't see how Paladin threat could be this bad.

Rogosh @ Cho'gall - Game - World of Warcraft Here is his Armory.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis Here are our logs. This is a chronic issue, so I didn't feel it was appropriate to link just one report.

My guildies have been discussing the situation and we think it might be a rotation issue, but none of us can figure out exactly what he's doing wrong or what he should be doing.

We did notice he likes to burn DP/Inq/AW a few to several seconds before the pull, wasting time on those CDs. We already chide him about that.

Thanks in advance for anything you can provide!

Charybdis · 07/03/11, 10:36 PM

Originally Posted by eternalwhitemoon

This is not for me, but for my guildie, a prot paladin.

You see, he's just...terrible at threat. His threat is just so weak (especially AOE/add threat, but beginning threat is janky too). This presents kind of a big problem when we have a warrior and a DK in the raid--there really just aren't enough Salvs to go around.

I don't really have a huge issue with healing him, though he does seem to take a little more damage than our bear. I'm concerned about his chronic lack of decent threat. He says he reads Paladin forums and such, but I just don't see how Paladin threat could be this bad.

Rogosh @ Cho'gall - Game - World of Warcraft Here is his Armory.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis Here are our logs. This is a chronic issue, so I didn't feel it was appropriate to link just one report.

My guildies have been discussing the situation and we think it might be a rotation issue, but none of us can figure out exactly what he's doing wrong or what he should be doing.

We did notice he likes to burn DP/Inq/AW a few to several seconds before the pull, wasting time on those CDs. We already chide him about that.

Thanks in advance for anything you can provide!

First thing I'd say is take a look at Righteous Fury since it's easy to forget about as a pally. After that he should make sure he's constantly using abilities. Perhaps have him look at the prot thread then go over his rotation with him on a target dummy or something. Nowadays a tank's DPS is a decent indicator of threat, so having him work on the DPS part should help quite a bit.

Meloree · 07/04/11, 12:14 AM

Originally Posted by eternalwhitemoon

This is not for me, but for my guildie, a prot paladin.

You see, he's just...terrible at threat. His threat is just so weak (especially AOE/add threat, but beginning threat is janky too). This presents kind of a big problem when we have a warrior and a DK in the raid--there really just aren't enough Salvs to go around.

Rogosh @ Cho'gall - Game - World of Warcraft Here is his Armory.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis Here are our logs. This is a chronic issue, so I didn't feel it was appropriate to link just one report.

My guildies have been discussing the situation and we think it might be a rotation issue, but none of us can figure out exactly what he's doing wrong or what he should be doing.

It's definitely a rotation issue. I took a look at his logs and compared them to mine on a couple of fights - not for DPS, but for ability usage. His autoattack abilities (autoattack, Seal of Truth procs, and Censure ticks) comprise 36.6% of his damage done on a recent Atramedes fight. By comparison, mine were at 28%. His CS usage, especially, is low, accounting for ~20% of damage done on that parse, when it should be ~30% in general. Essentially, your prot paladin needs to learn to be pushing CS on every other button press, and not getting distracted by Grand Crusader procs. It has a follow-on effect on all his other damage.

From that Atramedes kill (6:12) compared to my most recent (4:55), I had 64 CS uses, and Rogash had 46. I had 23 ShoR hit/crits, Rogash had 20. I used WoG once, Rogash did not (just for more reference on HP opportunity cost). The times don't directly correlate, obviously, there'll be an extra air phase in there for your kill. But on a longer kill, his ability usage should have been greater than mine to some degree, regardless. I don't claim to have played perfectly on that kill, either - it was just the most recent, and I picked Atramedes primarily because it's solotanked, and therefore easy to pick numbers out of.

EDIT: Glyph of CS is more damage than Glyph of Judgement. It's minor, the real problem is in rotation. But I thought I should at least look at the armory.

adamb10 · 07/15/11, 12:33 PM

Ok time for me to bite at this. I basically got kicked from 1 guild due to performance and declined from another due to DPS. I know Im doing something wrong.

Heres a log for a ragnaros kill (ignore that it says its a wipe, it isnt): World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
Heres another for a Shannox kill: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

I'm not sure what Im doing wrong. I know my gear is properly gemmed and I use a reforge calculator to make sure I'm good on my stats. I also use CLCRet for the rotation. I'm not a clicker (for the rotation anyway). I'm really just not sure anymore. Can anyone me put my DPS where it needs to be?

Thanks.

Calefax · 07/15/11, 3:43 PM

I don't see any issue with your gear, gemming, enchanting, or reforging. That all seems good. I'm sure you know Landslide is a better choice than Avalanche, but maybe you don't want to spend the extra gold on a weapon that will presumably be replaced very soon. Your dps will suffer for it, but not enough to warrant a gkick.

One small issue I see is with your prime glyphs. If you have so much expertise that you can't make use of the seal of truth glyph, then crusader strike is a much better choice than judgment. That's a very easy thing to fix.

As for your parses, I took a good look at your Shannox parse, as that one has less funny business going on than Ragnaros. There are a few things that I noticed:

Use your cds as often as possible
Your kill was 7 mins 24 seconds, and in that time you used AW + zealotry 3 times each and goak once. In a 7:24 fight, you should be able to use AW/zealotry 4x each, and goak twice. That is quite a bit of extra damage you missed out on. Remember that it's better to use your cds as often as possible and NOT line them up with bloodlust if doing so means that you can use them an extra time.

Hit the boss more!
I compared your Shannox kill to my most recent one (World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis), and the thing that immediately stuck out was usage of exorcism. In my 6:07 kill, I had 24 casts of exorcism to your 13. At first I thought you just had bad RNG, but then I looked at your melee swings. In my kill I had 8 MORE melee swings than you did, despite my kill being 1 min 17 seconds FASTER than yours. Obviously that alone is a decent dps difference, but it's compounded by the fact that melee swings proc art of war, which is at least part of the reason why I have so many more exo casts than you. There is probably a haste disparity here between you and I, but I can't see it being significant enough to explain the numbers here.

This issue is further confirmed by our holy power gains from CS. I had 109 hp gained to your 94, again despite dpsing the boss for over a minute less. CS should pretty much always be the first button you press when it's available, unless you already have a full hp bar or you need to refresh inq.

Try not to rely on Divine Shield
I noticed you use divine shield twice during your kill. While it's great for getting you out of sticky situations, don't forget that using it comes with a 50% damage reduction while it's active. You really shouldn't have needed to use it on Shannox at all, let alone twice.

I'm not sure what you are doing that is causing you to not be dpsing for a significant amount of time, but I would say that is your #1 issue from what I see here.

adamb10 · 07/15/11, 8:35 PM

Yeah I've had bad RNG on weapons.

As for the boss I mostly stuck to the two doggies and only switched to the boss when the doggies were trapped. I dont know if thats reason for the difference. (I unfortunately cannot get WoL to show only my damage on Shannox and not the doggies or vice versa).

I did bubble when the dog that attacks random people (rageface I think?) got on me since we were sometimes having issues with dps dying on him.

I did look at CLCRet though and changed the rotation around in it. My limited theorycrafting on a test dummy showed a 1200 DPS gain with the CLCRet change. I do have other logs for Baleroc but I died @ 30% so it's not really a good boss to use.

I think I need to hit up Firelands with the change I made to CLCret and see the difference in a raid.

Thanks.

AggelosSWC · 07/19/11, 11:50 AM

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

My Armory - Aggelos @ Area 52 - Game - World of Warcraft

Here is a log of my guilds Rag kill last week. Now my problem is I am consistently down near the end of the list dps wise and it is making me sad. What am I doing wrong? At the start of fights I am normally in the top 5 during my cooldown bursts but i normally end around the 18-21k range. Most others are ending in the 23-30k range (yes I know hunters,mages,dks, etc but how cna I close the gap?)

According to stateofdps.com, ret dps is still middle of the road but the average is posted below.

Paladin - Retribution 26313 24086 1242 87 2339

So if the average dps is 26k and the median is 24k why am I only breaking the 20k barrier on most fights? Any help would be greatly appreciated!

GlacialRet · 07/21/11, 1:57 PM

I am casual raiding guild (1-2 nights a week) and my DPS is on par with others in my guild but probably not where it should be. I use this site to stay updated, use CLCRet for my rotation, use WoWreforge.com, and use AW/Zeal/IoY together (macro).

My armory Glacial @ Blade's Edge - Game - World of Warcraft
Here is our last raid log. World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

This was our guild first Nef kill and also guild first TAC kill so I haven't had access to a lot of BiS gear. I won the shoulders from Halfus (finally) this week so I still used my ilvl 353 ZA shoulders for the first two fights. Once we kill Cho'gall we plan to move on to Firelands so I want to ensure I am doing optimized DPS.

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can provide.

Fancy_pants · 07/21/11, 6:05 PM

I need some help healing in phase 2 on heroic beth'tilac. Top parses show that the majority of healing in phase 2 comes from holy radiance. Here is the current highest HPS paladin parse, selecting only phase 2: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Here is my best phase 2 parse so far: World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

His armory: Zodiacc @ Ysera - Game - World of Warcraft
My armory: Fancypants @ Stonemaul - Game - World of Warcraft

You'll notice that while our overall phase 2 HPS is close (his is just under 35000, mine is 32320), he is making more efficient use of his healing spells, relying much less on Divine Light. Here is a breakdown of our spell usage.

I'm most interested in trying to figure out how his holy radiances did about 600k more healing than mine when he cast the spell just one more time than me (7 as opposed to 6). He had one thousand more ticks than me, yet I have more haste than him.

Any comments are greatly appreciated.

aggixx · 07/24/11, 3:46 AM

Originally Posted by Fancy_pants

I'm most interested in trying to figure out how his holy radiances did about 600k more healing than mine when he cast the spell just one more time than me (7 as opposed to 6). He had one thousand more ticks than me, yet I have more haste than him.

Any comments are greatly appreciated.

Especially in a scenario like Beth'tilac with consistent long-term AoE damage, Glyph of Divine Favor should significantly increase your healing done by Holy Radiance because it affects a full 2 HRs if you active them together.