You got the penalty for down-ranking wrong. The correct penalty is ("level where you learn the spell" + 11) / character level. So FoL 6 does have a penalty at level 70 albeit small. Someone in some paladin thread here tested it and posted the formula.

Keep regular offhands in... you never know...

2p t5: 0 mana to your group when using a judgement
4p t5: chance on critical flash of light or holy light to reduce the cast time of following holy lights by -0.50 for 10 seconds. this effect can only trigger once per minute

Incase you guys didn't see. Ouch t5 users .

Spell Hasteadin build basically destroyed with change to 4pc tier5 in 2.3.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y73...ystalforge.jpg

I don't want to get us offtopic, but this is the most ridiculous change I've ever seen. Understandably, Blizzard is probably upset that BT clearing guild paladins are still wearing T5, but why make this move? It's a personal choice based around gear and playing style. There's no reason to make this change. /sigh This basically makes all paladins move to FoL spammers with the occasional HoL when the tank gets low.

Just wanted to help back up this claim in the new thread since I posted some theorycrafting in the other one (nice thread by the way). Here's a wws that shows off how good the BT trinket can be compared to a 70 healing trinket effective healing wise: http://wowwebstats.com/vbuvjnt51r3z3?s=13020-13491&a=9 For this fight I was just prehealing with rank 11 holy light, which is the worst possible way to use this trinket to its full effectiveness, and I was pretty impressed with the results. After calculating potential crits and overheal for a 70 healing trinket, and the overheal for the talisman ticks that went off, I got 741 healing vs 3321. That means if I was wearing the scarab or prayerbook, I would have done 741 effective healing, while the talisman did 3321 effective healing. These results are kind of abnormal, 4.5 times as much effective healing, but I usually see over twice as much healing being done by the talisman.

Hope this helps some people make more informed decisions about their trinkets. Knowledge is power! :P

Excellent work, HolyHotty. I'm not that surprised though, since the ashtongue trinket doesn't further contribute to overheal but rather puts a lasting heal that can hit after someone takes damage.

I feel like this nerf to T5 is pretty much unnecessary. Other classes had fabulous set bonuses from T5 (Mage 2 piece anyone?).

It's also annoying because we've been sharding what are now clear upgrades because of T5 bonus. I'm hoping that this change is reversed.

I'm just incredibly disappointed by the change to Tier 5. Not because I considered it my endgame set (I planned to upgrade to 4pc T6 once my guild has killed Illidan), but because its absence absolutely destroys playstyle variety in holy paladins, which is really lacking from talents and abilities in the first place.

The idea that by downranking crystalforged/hasted Holy Light, a paladin would have more than 2 useful heals (and sometimes upwards of 5) is a good thing, it encouraged some thought and a mild (without overselling this...) amount of subtlety to healing on a paladin. Tier 6 is a better all around set, and for that I would upgrade to it, but it doesn't encourage anywhere near the same variety. Crystalforge isn't absolute endgame, it's situationally useful after T6 is available, so I really can't understand the need for a nerf of this kind. As was suggested early in the 2.3 notes thread, swap the proc to haste rating so there is no chance of this set sticking around at 80 and call it a day. The -.25s Holy Light is a great set bonus, and gives versatility to a healing class that is otherwise severely hurting for choices.

While this isn't killing ALL haste builds, it's certainly a big hit. Now you'll have to go 2pc T6 and slap as much haste gear in the other slots as possible.

Let me know your results after you run the numbers, I may have to rewrite like half of the main post because of this -_-