Retribution DPS Theorycraft - Page 41

Prepared · 11/06/07, 4:15 PM

Originally Posted by Agonar

@Bellator,
I know absolutly nothing about Microsoft product like Excel, office and all... but i do have Staroffice but never really played around with it. Is there any plan to make the spreadsheet work with Openoffice in the future? Or is there any way to currently make it work? I keep getting error. :/

Your OpenOffice.org

I used this development build of OpenOffice, which is able to run most of the scripts. I haven't tried it since version 8 or so, though, since Bellator said that making the spreadsheet compatible is not an option, currently.

The only big trick is that you have to delete the line with the Librams on it, and that your DPS numbers will be lower for it.

Edit: That said, I'm currently working on a platform-independent application which serves the exact same function as the spreadsheet, but requires no viewers, plugins, or otherwise... maybe even with an HTML or text output options... but since I have to dig deeper into the actual math required to determine the DPS values, etc, it's a long way out.

Not to mention, writing up all this equipment. :P

Agonar · 11/06/07, 10:44 PM

There was a new PTR Build tonight, November 6 and still no change to our base spell or talent for AP -> SD to lessen our reliance on spell dmg and fix some itemization issues.

2.3 is going LIVE on US Servers November 13 and Arena Season 3 is November 20.

Source: https://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/t...66101883&sid=1

flyingtoastr · 11/06/07, 11:55 PM

Even though it doesn't look like we'll get everything we asked for in this patch, I'd still call it an overall success. Ret gained a lot of viability from the Threat Reduction and 6 second CS. I would consider it a good start to be expanded on in the next few patches/expansion.

Breaking news from the latest PTR too. Human racials were changed again.

5 free expertise sounds excellent in my books.

Anarkii · 11/07/07, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by Cromfel

Good job, it wasnt that hard afterall was it? Throw me PM about stats you used so people can adjust them to their own. And if you have spare time feel free to do similiar for stat milestones (You can come up with your own) and weapon comparison according to ilevel.

To extend this a bit further, I developed a simple app that lets you enter your stats and compare weapons. I'm just using this as a preparation for a simulator that I am considering making later on.

The 'Buffs and Debuffs' tab is not functional yet. Right now this assumes all standard raid buffs to compare weapons. However, you need to enter the stats considering the effect of all buffs. Particularly, for Armor Penetration, enter the value of ArmP from gear along with the values from Sunder, FF and CoR.(Or just leave it at 4000 if you aren't sure)

This is pretty much a pre-alpha version that I cooked up in a couple of hours. I may put more effort on it if it's useful to anyone.

(Requires .NET runtime 2.0)

Download RetWeaponCompare

Valerys · 11/07/07, 3:40 AM

Found another bug in Bellator's sheet: JoB damage is being increased by the 4-piece T4 bonus. It should only increase JoC.

Can be fixed by editing the formula in cell C42 on the DPS Calc sheet and removing '*G23' from it.

madmardigan83 · 11/07/07, 9:19 AM

Originally Posted by flyingtoastr

Even though it doesn't look like we'll get everything we asked for in this patch, I'd still call it an overall success. Ret gained a lot of viability from the Threat Reduction and 6 second CS. I would consider it a good start to be expanded on in the next few patches/expansion.

Breaking news from the latest PTR too. Human racials were changed again.

5 free expertise sounds excellent in my books.

I too, am slightly disapointed since our "reliance" upon SD didn't decrease at all... but it does open the door to potentially new changes for future patches.

I know that in the past 5 weapon skill used to equate to +3% hit on mobs 3 levels higher than you, with the new skill of Expertise, is this still the case? If so, that would be a large benifit for raiding... I may even be able to take the 8 points in Prot and relocated them and then make up for the difference with a few +hit items.

flyingtoastr · 11/07/07, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by madmardigan83

I too, am slightly disapointed since our "reliance" upon SD didn't decrease at all... but it does open the door to potentially new changes for future patches.

I know that in the past 5 weapon skill used to equate to +3% hit on mobs 3 levels higher than you, with the new skill of Expertise, is this still the case? If so, that would be a large benifit for raiding... I may even be able to take the 8 points in Prot and relocated them and then make up for the difference with a few +hit items.

Expertise is slightly different from weapon skill, and much closer to what the original WS was.

Each point of WepEx decreases the Dodge and Parry chance of whatever you're attacking by .25%. This is really huge because not only can you reduce parried attacks (excellent for tanks), but if you can hit cap and WepEx cap (~5.6% on bosses or about 88 WepEx rating) you can theoretically have 99% of your attacks be a hit or a crit.

As for speccing out of Precision, thats personal choice, but now that it affects spell hit as well as melee hit I don't think its really worth having the extra points to drop it.

Cathmor · 11/07/07, 10:16 AM

Does receiving 5 expertise from the new human racial have any affect on how much hit rating one should stack? Am I still aiming for 8-9% hit with a two-hander against raid bosses?

Prinsesa · 11/07/07, 11:11 AM

Hit rating decreases your miss rate.

Expertise decreases the boss' parry/dodge rate (although that also indirectly leads to more hits).

So the answer is no, you should still be aiming for 9% hit.

Fiola · 11/07/07, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by madmardigan83

I too, am slightly disapointed since our "reliance" upon SD didn't decrease at all... but it does open the door to potentially new changes for future patches.

I know that in the past 5 weapon skill used to equate to +3% hit on mobs 3 levels higher than you, with the new skill of Expertise, is this still the case? If so, that would be a large benifit for raiding... I may even be able to take the 8 points in Prot and relocated them and then make up for the difference with a few +hit items.

The CS change adds to weapon damage and AP scaling.

That's lessened "reliance" on +dmg right there.

Personally, I don't see why we need the +dmg scaling removed. No Ret DPSer in this thread goes out of their way to get +dmg on their gear. If you don't even use the stat, how are you reliant on it?

If you think that it needs to be changed so that your overall damage scales better, ask for better damage scaling, not removal of the +dmg mechanic. Doing otherwise opens you up to get what you *asked for* and still be disappointed.

(See S3 v2 for an example)

Argavaine · 11/07/07, 2:00 PM

Spelldamage is not important in pve but despite the fact that this thread is about pve, there is still pvp. In pvp spelldamage is the way you can hybridize your gamestyle and it is a main source for your burst damage.

Winkl · 11/07/07, 3:02 PM

So is the +0 SD on the S3 set a concern for PVE?

I'm gonna try ret come 2.3/S3 and have been banking arena and honor points for gear. Coming from Holy spec and just picking up the scraps from raids I've assembled an "ok" ret set so far. My plans were to get the S3 bracers, belt, boots, and gloves and also the S1 shoulders and chest. I should be over 1700 Ap and 25% crit come S3.

Then the S3 stats changed. So now I'm wondering if I should just get the S2 bracers, belt, and boots instead. The trade off by my math is give up 36 Str in exchange for 86 SD. I'm thinking from what I've gathered here is that this is NOT a good trade. 36 Str > 86 SD, in other words. SD is gonna help only for CS and Cons, Exorcism, the later 2 wont find a huge place in a damage rotation anyway.

Just looking for some reassurance that my understanding is correct. PVE again mind you.

galzohar · 11/07/07, 3:48 PM

I don't see how spell damage increases your burst... Granted you get higher damage judgement, but you get much lower damage CS and autoattack because those scale much better with AP.

Sapp · 11/07/07, 4:05 PM

Season 3 items are exceptional for PvE purposes. I personally intend to wear the boots, gloves, and chestplate. My belt and bracers are a red belt and Eradication, respectively, which I picked up to make up for the hit lost with the weapon skill change.

Your understanding is incorrect. In nearly all situations, s3 items will be your best bet... even with the resilience weighing them down.

Argavaine · 11/07/07, 4:51 PM

@galzohar

Wrong, your white dmg yes but not your yellow dmg ->burst

judgements scale only with spelldmg, consecration scales only with spelldmg,

we lose 154 spelldmg and 252 armorpen by S3 and gain 82 str more -> 82 str with pvp weapon and Divine Str 46,4 dmg with CS .... 154 spelldmg 61,6 dmg with CS....I dont count armor pen it just hurts...

Even SoC does more dmg with this spelldmg 33,9 vs 32,5 and I dont talk about our healing. I am not sure if the new stats are better in pve because of all raidbuffs and constant white dmg but this is our pvp set.