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Old 11/13/07, 1:46 PM   #781
orkyben
Von Kaiser
 
orkyben's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Agamaggan (EU)
Hey there, first post here.

Thanks for all the work your guys are putting in, and especially thanks for the spreadsheets - I've spent hours trawling over them already!

Just wanted to double check about "Weapon Expertsie" though; it seems remarkably powerful on Bellator's spreadsheet, so much so that the [Brooch of Deftness] appears to be one of the best DPS neck's avaliable in the game, despite having no Str/AP and no Crit whatsoever. Is this correct? If so, I know where 35 of my badges are going tomorrow!

Thanks again guys.

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Old 11/13/07, 1:58 PM   #782
LockApologist
Piston Honda
 
Undead Warlock
 
Mug'thol
Originally Posted by Friski View Post
Great thread, with a lot of useful information. I was curious to see if it would be possible to get [Furious Gizmatic Goggles] added into the spreadsheet? Basically because that is all I have/had available to me up to this point and I would like to see what upgrades would benefit me the most before aquiring them and finding out differently. Also if it would be possible to add that ring mentioned a few posts up, the Shapeshifters signet now that it has weapon expertise.
I asked this as well, and found that you can add your own items (although I've had mixed luck with that. seems my adding the badge stuff broke the weapon and belt selections, to the point where changing the value doesn't change the stats displayed. Then again, I also messed with the DPS displays to show for SoB, as I don't care about SoC).

To add new items:

Format -> Sheet -> Unhide

Unhide the 'DPS' sheet and add your items in.

Last edited by LockApologist : 11/13/07 at 2:03 PM.

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Old 11/13/07, 2:09 PM   #783
Friski
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Earthen Ring
Originally Posted by LockApologist View Post
I asked this as well, and found that you can add your own items (although I've had mixed luck with that. seems my adding the badge stuff broke the weapon and belt selections, to the point where changing the value doesn't change the stats displayed. Then again, I also messed with the DPS displays to show for SoB, as I don't care about SoC).

To add new items:

Format -> Sheet -> Unhide

Unhide the 'DPS' sheet and add your items in.
I tried playing with this some, and failed. I'll keep plugging away though, maybe soon my old excel skills from the past will magically come back to my remembrance. Thanks!

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Old 11/13/07, 2:42 PM   #784
koetjeka
Von Kaiser
 
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Gnome Mage
 
Tarren Mill (EU)
Hello guys,

2.3 is on the doorstep and one of the paladins in my guild is speccing retri. There is only 1 problem: his class leader doesn't allow him to sign up for raids. Not enough dps he says.

I of course want a retri pala in raid for the sake of judgement of wisdom so I want to convince the CL to get a retri pala each raid. I'm not a great paladin-theorycrafter so could anyone make me a list why we should get a retri pala instead of a dps warrior for instance?

Things I came up by myself:

-Judgement of wisdom owns for casters;
-Paladins get -30% threat, warriors only 10% in berserker stance.


I hope you can help me out.

thanks in advance!

Last edited by koetjeka : 11/13/07 at 2:57 PM.

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Old 11/13/07, 2:44 PM   #785
Celthis
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Blackhand
Originally Posted by orkyben View Post
Just wanted to double check about "Weapon Expertsie" though; it seems remarkably powerful on Bellator's spreadsheet, so much so that the [Brooch of Deftness] appears to be one of the best DPS neck's avaliable in the game, despite having no Str/AP and no Crit whatsoever. Is this correct? If so, I know where 35 of my badges are going tomorrow!
I didn't have much time to look at the spreadsheet (at work at the moment), but when I replaced the [Pendant of the Perilous] from the default gear set with [Brooch of Deftness], the listed DPS went from (1347+30) to (1336+32), a loss of 9 dps overall.

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Old 11/13/07, 2:46 PM   #786
Celthis
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Blackhand
Originally Posted by koetjeka View Post
I'm not a great paladin-theorycrafter so could anyone make me a list why we should get a retri pala instead of a dps warrior for instance?

Things I came up by myself:

-Judgement of wisdom owns for casters;
-Paladins get -30% threat, warriors only 10% in berserker stance.
Warriors get -20% threat in berserker stance. Fury warriors with Improved Berserker Stance get the same -30% threat that ret paladins do.

Last edited by Celthis : 11/13/07 at 3:00 PM. Reason: i am terrible with quotes

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Old 11/13/07, 2:53 PM   #787
Rokford
Glass Joe
 
Dwarf Paladin
 
Bleeding Hollow
Do most ret paladins attempting to maximize raid DPS use weightstones / sharpening stones? I realise there is a conflict with windfury, but will this weapon buff actually prevent windfury from sticking if/when it is available?

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Old 11/13/07, 2:57 PM   #788
Celthis
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Druid
 
Blackhand
Originally Posted by Rokford View Post
Do most ret paladins attempting to maximize raid DPS use weightstones / sharpening stones? I realise there is a conflict with windfury, but will this weapon buff actually prevent windfury from sticking if/when it is available?
Yes. If you already have a temporary weapon buff, windfury will not apply. You will have to click it off and wait for the totem to pulse again.

Last edited by Celthis : 11/13/07 at 3:10 PM.

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Old 11/13/07, 2:59 PM   #789
Prepared
Von Kaiser
 
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Human Paladin
 
<FoE>
Runetotem
Originally Posted by Rokford View Post
Do most ret paladins attempting to maximize raid DPS use weightstones / sharpening stones? I realise there is a conflict with windfury, but will this weapon buff actually prevent windfury from sticking if/when it is available?
The temporary weapon enchants do prevent totem-based weapon buffs from applying themselves. That's why you'll hear Shaman tell Rogues not to use Poisons on their main hand weapons, because they'll lose the benefit of WF.

That said, the weapon buff stones are a nice buff if you don't have access to a group with a Shaman for some reason, but be careful because you can't cancel the buffs until their duration runs out.

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Old 11/13/07, 3:03 PM   #790
Cromfel
Don Flamenco
 
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Human Paladin
 
Ravencrest (EU)
Originally Posted by Prepared View Post
That said, the weapon buff stones are a nice buff if you don't have access to a group with a Shaman for some reason, but be careful because you can't cancel the buffs until their duration runs out.
Thats actually fixed (I have no idea when). You can now cancel the weapon buffs from your buff bar.

.:. Retribution Paladin Hideout .:. http://cromfel.battlefield.fi/

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Old 11/13/07, 3:08 PM   #791
Prepared
Von Kaiser
 
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Human Paladin
 
<FoE>
Runetotem
Originally Posted by Cromfel View Post
Thats actually fixed (I have no idea when). You can now cancel the weapon buffs from your buff bar.
I swear I tried to do it last night on some Brilliant Wizard Oil on my Shaman, and it did not work. I guess I'll have to give it another shot today.

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Old 11/13/07, 3:11 PM   #792
orkyben
Von Kaiser
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Agamaggan (EU)
Originally Posted by Celthis View Post
I didn't have much time to look at the spreadsheet (at work at the moment), but when I replaced the [Pendant of the Perilous] from the default gear set with [Brooch of Deftness], the listed DPS went from (1347+30) to (1336+32), a loss of 9 dps overall.
Haha.

Ok so apparently my first post was a little retaded! >.<

Evidently the difference I experienced was due to being hit capped or not, as the [Brooch of Deftness] as a hefty chunk of hit rating on it, and I must have been below 9% hit before I equipepd it.

With that taken into account the brooch is fairly useless then?

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Old 11/13/07, 3:25 PM   #793
Sapp
Bald Bull
 
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Human Paladin
 
<NI>
Detheroc
Originally Posted by Prepared View Post
I swear I tried to do it last night on some Brilliant Wizard Oil on my Shaman, and it did not work. I guess I'll have to give it another shot today.
If you use a buff frame you might not be able to, I never can with CT-BuffMod. It only works with the ugly basic blizzard UI, in my experience.

Originally Posted by Rasputin View Post
Even with a buff frame, if it's possible to cancel the weapon buff you should be able to use a /cancelaura command to get rid of it.
Good call. I need to make a macro for that.

Last edited by Sapp : 11/13/07 at 3:37 PM.

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Old 11/13/07, 3:35 PM   #794
Rasputin
King Hippo
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Magtheridon
Originally Posted by Sapp View Post
If you use a buff frame you might not be able to, I never can with CT-BuffMod. It only works with the ugly basic blizzard UI, in my experience.
Even with a buff frame, if it's possible to cancel the weapon buff you should be able to use a /cancelaura command to get rid of it.

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Old 11/13/07, 3:36 PM   #795
Sapp
Bald Bull
 
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Human Paladin
 
<NI>
Detheroc
Originally Posted by koetjeka View Post
2.3 is on the doorstep and one of the paladins in my guild is speccing retri. There is only 1 problem: his class leader doesn't allow him to sign up for raids. Not enough dps he says.
He should actually test that in a raid, post 2.3, before saying so with certainty.

It looks like you're firmly in the middle of t5 content judging by your realm forum progression post. That's a good spot to properly test Ret for your guild; a PvP+kara geared ret paladin is functionally competing on the same line as most t5 DPS would be.

What other "off specs" is your guild receptive to? Do you have a mix of holy and shadow priests? What do your druids do? Shamans? Do you use any DPS warriors, and how many DPS warriors compared to how many rogues? Any MS blood frenzy warriors?

Any Pallytanks?

The danger comes if you're trying to get a ret to jump straight into t6 content. They really need t6 gear to compete at t6 content, maybe with a sprinkling of the upcoming season 3 pvp gear.

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