The Holy Paladin Guide for WotLK - Page 12

Endoscient · 11/12/08, 10:04 AM

I was just talking about just the ration between FoL and HL, that doesn't mean you don't cast Holy Shock.

Holy Shock is much worse HPM then Holy Light, and not that much more HPS then Flash of Light. So you should only use it when you need the benefits of an instant cast heal. When you do though, it is a very nice spell.

Roknroll · 11/12/08, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by Endoscient

I was just talking about just the ration between FoL and HL, that doesn't mean you don't cast Holy Shock.

Holy Shock is much worse HPM then Holy Light, and not that much more HPS then Flash of Light. So you should only use it when you need the benefits of an instant cast hea. When you do though, it is a very nice spell.

My main use of Holy Shock is with Beacon of Light on the main tank or an off-tank. When I'm assigned to healing a tank it's usually pretty risky to break off of them to heal another raid member. Even when the tank has Beacon on them, there's a good chance that the raid member will get healed up before you finish your cast. That means a wasted heal in the raid and a missed heal on the MT. Breaking off to cast Holy Shock on a raid member almost guarantees that the heal will be effective on the raid member, and also on the MT. On HS crits, i'll also try to cast my instant FoL on a raid member since it'll usually also equal a FoL on the MT through beacon.

Endoscient · 11/12/08, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by Roknroll

My main use of Holy Shock is with Beacon of Light on the main tank or an off-tank. When I'm assigned to healing a tank it's usually pretty risky to break off of them to heal another raid member. Even when the tank has Beacon on them, there's a good chance that the raid member will get healed up before you finish your cast. That means a wasted heal in the raid and a missed heal on the MT. Breaking off to cast Holy Shock on a raid member almost guarantees that the heal will be effective on the raid member, and also on the MT. On HS crits, i'll also try to cast my instant FoL on a raid member since it'll usually also equal a FoL on the MT through beacon.

I don't think the situation you describing is really a good use of Holy Shock. Since essentially you are just "sniping" heals from other healers to improve your own standing on the meters. If you know they are going to get healed anyway in less then 1.2 seconds, just stay on the tank.

A better use in that situation is to put BoL on someone else who will be taking a lot of damage (like a different tank) and heal your tank normally. Holy Shock is better saved for when someone could die before a cast time heal gets off, or when you have to move. It is a waste of mana otherwise, since it is 1/2 the hpm of FoL and 6/10 the hpm of HL.

Roknroll · 11/12/08, 1:13 PM

In our 2-tank situations, yes, I'll put beacon on one tank and heal the other. I think you'll be right in WotLK, but for now mana hasn't been an issue haling post 3.0 for me. Also with the way Circle of Healing works, sniping a heal off the raid means that CoH will bypass that member and apply the heal elsewhere. When CoH gets nerfed down a bit where priests won't be using it nearly as much the heal sniping won't be as beneficial.

Endoscient · 11/12/08, 1:37 PM

The new version of Rawr (2.1) for WotLK and level 80 is coming out tonight at 7est (posting this now since I won't be around when it does get released). For those who don't know, Rawr is a theorycrafting program where you load in your gear/buffs and it ranks it compared to other items. You can learn more and download the latest at Codeplex - Rawr.

Example of a level 80 paladin with full Blues (except for Libram) and full raid buffs.

The Healadin module is mostly updated and accurate for level 80, and will display all the stats about your spells. Let me explain how it works. First it calculates how much time/mana is used on BoL, SS, JotP, and HS based on the parameters you give it. Then with the remaining mana & fight time it calculates the maximum amount of Holy Lights you can do while still having enough mana to always be casting at least Flash of Light. So any extra mana you gain means you can cast more Holy Lights over Flash of Light. It ranks each gear setup based on the total amount healed.

New Features

Support for JotP, it will display how much effective haste (after using GCDs to keep it up) it gives you.
Support for BoL, you enter in uptime and effectiveness of the buff (what percent of your heals will proc BoL).
Support for SS, for now just assumes you are keeping 100% uptime on one target. The next version will have more options for number of targets and uptime.
Support for HS, you set the effective cooldown of HS by a percent. So if you enter a 20% it means it will cast it ever 30 seconds (6 / 0.2).
Support for almost all Glyphs.
Mana Pool & Mana Usage breakdown graphs. Graphs that will show your mana pool broken up by source, and how much is used on each spell.
Level 80 support. Updated all consumables, buffs, debuffs and enchants for their level 80 versions.
Ability to load all known WotLK items from Wowhead.

Known Issues

When imported from Wowhead Tier 7 items will not know they are part of a set. To fix this edit each item and under set name add "Redemption Regalia".

To Do List

Add support for Glyph of Flash of Light.
Option to model keeping 100% Judgement debuff uptime.
Better modeling for IoL/LG.
Support proc effects for all relevant level 80 trinkets.
Give some measurement for burst healing capability.

Endoscient · 11/17/08, 5:52 PM

This thread got unlocked after the forum structure is change. I will keep the main post updated with current theorycraft for an easy place for people to read up on it. So try to keep the discussion here limited to stuff about this thread, and discuss other things in new threads.

Zerodym · 11/18/08, 6:26 AM

Primary stat now in WotLK at lvl 80 for pve? I see the plate gear of reputation with a mix of crit and haste, almost no mp5 in them. What stat are you going to start stacking now? (Crit>Int or Int>Crit)>Spower>Haste>mp5? Since we have divine plea for mana regen and judgement of the pure for haste, dont know what to do with those stats.

Joanna · 11/18/08, 9:23 AM

The early levellers in our guild ventured into Naxx-10, and I played around some with Sacred Shield. In truth I'm not actually aware of it doing anything. I don't seem to gain a +Crit aura when the shielded person takes damage, the amount absorbed is buried away in the depths of the combat log, and I didn't perceive any difference at all in terms of healing needed whether it was up or not. Is there something I'm missing here, because it really does seem like a dud. On the plus side, JoL, HS and IoL'd FoL make for ridiculously easy Loatheb.

Corronach · 11/18/08, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by Joanna

The early levellers in our guild ventured into Naxx-10, and I played around some with Sacred Shield. In truth I'm not actually aware of it doing anything. I don't seem to gain a +Crit aura when the shielded person takes damage, the amount absorbed is buried away in the depths of the combat log, and I didn't perceive any difference at all in terms of healing needed whether it was up or not. Is there something I'm missing here, because it really does seem like a dud. On the plus side, JoL, HS and IoL'd FoL make for ridiculously easy Loatheb.

The crit part of sacred shield will rarely be up, because it's linked to the minimal absorbtion offered by each shield. It negates more damage per mana than any of our heals could restore so it's worth keeping up but you're right that it isn't a noticeable spell just a cooldown to keep up. You'll also see better returns as you gear up since a large component is proportional to your spellpower.

alcaras · 11/18/08, 12:42 PM

Another macro question.

I usually target the tank, focus the boss, and mouseover heal everyone else.

I'd like to set up a macro that allows me to Judgement of Wisdom my focus (the boss) without switching my target.

Currently the best I have is this:

/cast [target=focus] Judgement of Wisdom
/targetlastfriend

But that macro switches my target to the boss before switching it back (with /targetlastfriend).

Example:
I have Tank targetted. I have Boss focused.
I hit my macro.
I judge the boss -- WoW now switches my target to the Boss. <-- I don't want it to target switch.
/targetlastfriend kicks in -- WoW now switches my target back to the Tank.

Curiously this macro does not exhibit this target switching:

/cast [target=focus] Holy Shock

Is there something special/broken with Judgements that cause them to target switch when cast? I understand it turns on autoattack, but when I'm 30+ yards away from a boss, I can't autoattack.

Ideally I'd like something like this, for an all-in-one Judgement macro independent of what my target and focus actually are, but I figured I'd ask the simpler question of how to prevent target switching first.

#showtooltip
/cast [target=focus,exists,harm] Judgement of Wisdom
/cast [target=focustarget,exists,harm] Judgement of Wisdom
/cast [target=target,exists,harm] Judgement of Wisdom
/cast [target=targettarget,exists,harm] Judgement of Wisdom
/targetlastfriend

But that macro still exhibits the undesirable target switching on judgement behavior.

• zeidrich · 11/18/08, 1:08 PM

Originally Posted by alcaras

Asks: Can I judge a secondary target without switching target to it?

The answer to that is no, unfortunately. Because of the way that Judgement triggers auto-attack, you will always switch to the target you are judging. There is no way around that. You have to switch back to your old target either manually or with a macro like you originally posted.

Malleus · 11/18/08, 6:15 PM

Thing is, I've tried using that macro and it doesn't work either; targetlastfriend is not switching me back. Any possible explanation for why this should be?

drmadison · 11/18/08, 6:26 PM

What about a slightly modified version of the macro...

Have the tank targeted and use something like

/focus
/cast [target=focustarget] Judgement of Wisdom
/target focus
/clearfocus

Requires the tank to be targetting the boss of course...

I've just noticed "/target focus" as working better than "/targetlastfriend" for some reason...maybe it's just me though.
I'm wondering if it has something to do with judgement's changing your target, but it being delayed by latency (does it wait for the server to tell you you're now autoattacking the boss?). I haven't had a chance to test this in any way shape or form however.

If that's the case, something like

/focus
/target focustarget
/cast Judgement of Wisdom
/target focus
/clearfocus

This way you're forcibly changing your own target instead of waiting for the game to change your target start autoattacking etc?

Silmeria · 11/19/08, 11:11 AM

Originally Posted by Malleus

Thing is, I've tried using that macro and it doesn't work either; targetlastfriend is not switching me back. Any possible explanation for why this should be?

You have to hit the macro twice in succession I believe, it's a bit clunky.

Originally Posted by drmadison

What about a slightly modified version of the macro...

Unfortunately, your methods pretty block the usage of a focus frame for other uses. I am not sure what brings more value to the table: having your tank targeted all the time, or being able to use a focus frame. I prefer the latter personally, but it's really a personal judgment.

It's really a complete limitation of the API and Judgements here that's going to block the behavior you want. Likely, the best alternative is likely to simply change the requirement or philosophy. I personally use the judge-my-focus target in raids and then simply choose to reset my target to whomever during the judgement GCD (a whopping 1-second). I also primarily use clique-style healing as well.

Kazekan · 11/19/08, 11:32 AM

Or, you could just use mouseover macros, and not ever need to keep your tank targeted...

Boss can stay targeted at all times, you can have a seperate focus target, and you can still heal the tank (and other people), without having to actually select them. All 3 issues solved.