Paladin: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 91

Jackinthegreen · 07/05/09, 8:59 PM

Originally Posted by Alcapwnd

Working which way? Properly (per the tooltip) or unlimited mitigation?

When combined with Divine Shield it tends to do unlimited absorption. However, it does bug out sometimes and only do the 150% or so. It seems Blizz hasn't yet figured out a reliable way to make DiSac work given our abilities.

zZ1revenge · 07/06/09, 11:35 PM

A couple questions

What is average uldar level pally dps?(mine for some reason usualy cant break out past 3700)

and

Quite often durring boss fights i have started to notice that lots of my crusader strikes are showing immune and I was wondering the reason for this?

• Mex · 07/07/09, 3:46 AM

Originally Posted by zZ1revenge

A couple questions

What is average uldar level pally dps?(mine for some reason usualy cant break out past 3700)

and

Quite often durring boss fights i have started to notice that lots of my crusader strikes are showing immune and I was wondering the reason for this?

"Average" ret DPS in Ulduar will vary greatly depending on the fight, the raid group, and your definition of "average" gear. That said, 3.7k sounds low even for a Naxx-geared ret pally on a ret-unfriendly fight, in a 10-man caster group. Looking at your armoury, I'd advise reading through the 3.1 retribution thread here and fixing your gems and enchants (notably stop socketing for socket bonuses, get a proper meta, etc). You could also optimise your spec, and probably tighten up your rotation (although that's something that others can't assess without a WWS/WoL report). Check the thread (first post especially) for more information.

I can't think of any reason that crusader strike would ever show immune. The only explanation that comes to mind is if you're specced into vindication and use a limited scrolling combat text mod (or the default), then it will often show the immune message from vindication's attempted application, rather than crusader strike's yellow damage number.

Shakaros · 07/07/09, 11:16 AM

I just rerolled Paladin from a mage to try out healing.
As I have been using RAWR it feels natural for me to use it as paladin aswell.
However browsing these threads have not yielded any results when it comes to finding a BiS list.

I do have a distinct feeling of how such a list will look due to using RAWR, but I'd like to be completely sure.
So my question is, what is the BiS list for holy paladins? Both when it comes to mana conservation and burst healing.
I realize that such a list might differ depending on various factors.

Caylynn · 07/07/09, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by Shakaros

I just rerolled Paladin from a mage to try out healing.
As I have been using RAWR it feels natural for me to use it as paladin aswell.
However browsing these threads have not yielded any results when it comes to finding a BiS list.

I do have a distinct feeling of how such a list will look due to using RAWR, but I'd like to be completely sure.
So my question is, what is the BiS list for holy paladins? Both when it comes to mana conservation and burst healing.
I realize that such a list might differ depending on various factors.

You answered your own question: there is basically no "definitive" list, because there are many different factors to take into account. No two fights ever end up being the same when it comes to healing, and your needs as a healer may be different from another paladins' needs. That's why a tool like Rawr is so valuable for us holy paladins, because we can input various factors and determine what pieces of gear are "best" for us.

That said, I have seen BiS slots on other sites. There is one on the PlusHeal paladin forums for instance.

Kraith · 07/07/09, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by zZ1revenge

A couple questions

What is average uldar level pally dps?(mine for some reason usualy cant break out past 3700)

and

Quite often durring boss fights i have started to notice that lots of my crusader strikes are showing immune and I was wondering the reason for this?

Your Ret build is not optimal for PvE DPS.

You have taken some PvP talents over some PvE talents. If you wish to do PvE do so in a PvE build. Lose Seal of command and Divine Purpose. Pick up Imp Might, finish Swift Retribution out, lose Imp Hamm of Justice. I personly would get Toughness over Stoicism also, but that is my personal choice.

Lose some hit; you only need 263 (8%). Quit putting subpar gems in sockets to get subpar socket bonuses. Get the best enchants. You are using subpar enchants on a few items. Lose your way to 1250 in Arena and get the 120AP libram.

Posting a WWS or two will also help people see where your flaws are and help you to correct them.

AS another poster said, read the Ret thread, it appears you haven't.

As for CS being immune? Give us more info. Which boss? What exactly did the combat log say? Etc, etc.

emeril80 · 07/07/09, 10:42 PM

Apologies if this sounds stupid. The Retadin thread makes it sound like Art of War is a spell that you cast: "You can use this on yourself or others if you have spare mana/gcds", and the data over on wowhead is not really conclusive either.

I have two points in this talent, but it seems to not show up anywhere in my spellbook. Am I missing it? Or is it just a passive ability? (If it is in the spellbook, where the hell is it?)

Prinsesa · 07/07/09, 10:59 PM

What that statement means to say is that: If you need to heal (yourself or someone else), and the Art of War buff is currently active, and you have mana to spare, and you don't have a DPS ability to use the GCD on, then you can use a Flash of Light to do your heal.

This only works if the Art of War buff is on you, since it will make your Flash of Light instant-cast. Without the buff, your FOL will have to be cast and will reset your swing timer, both reducing your DPS.

SirWilliam92 · 07/07/09, 11:17 PM

***Misread the original question.***

Bennigan88 · 07/08/09, 1:04 AM

Can someone please direct me to a page or post that explains exactly how to calculate a rotation for maxium dps? Do you have to make a time chart for each rotation and calculate the dps that way? Are spells/abilities automatically prioritized based on which one does the most dps?

I tried the "search" fucntion and searched for "calculate rotation dps" and it said that I was under the 3 word requirement...

Jackinthegreen · 07/08/09, 1:11 AM

Originally Posted by Bennigan88

Can someone please direct me to a page or post that explains exactly how to calculate a rotation for maxium dps? Do you have to make a time chart for each rotation and calculate the dps that way? Are spells/abilities automatically prioritized based on which one does the most dps?

I tried the "search" fucntion and searched for "calculate rotation dps" and it said that I was under the 3 word requirement...

Read the OP in the Ret thread. It says exactly which abilities have the best bang for the buck right now. It also goes over the fact that we DON'T have a steady rotation, so it boils down to First Come, First Serve so to speak.

dryearlylth · 07/08/09, 11:07 PM

Not sure what I'm doing wrong.

I'm new to being holy, so that is part of it. I'm spamming FoL non-stop. Once the tank starts to take burst damage, I switch to Holy Light, and use Holy Shock whenever I can. I seem to be stuck around 1200 hps according to Recount.

Any hints/suggestions? Maybe it's just the Thorim fight I'm having trouble with, but tonight was really frustrating.

Edit : I realize now I didn't really say anything.

Here is the problem. I've been going with the group that has to run around and kill stuff, not stay in the arena ( At least that is what my guild calls it )

After we get up the stairs, to fight the second mini boss, things usually go wrong. Either I'm out of LoS since the tank runs ahead up the stairs / I can't move from Rune Destruction ( I think thats what it's called. Where you can't move, and anyone near you takes damage when the debuff wears out ).

I haven't had fights before, with any other fights. On the hallway leading up to Hodir last night, the other healers died, and I was the only one left, I was able to keep the raid alive. I know I'm not a complete failure, maybe it's just something about the fight I'm not understanding.

So I guess my question is... what can I do differently about this fight?

Joasuf · 07/09/09, 8:41 AM

HPS doesnt really mean anything. The only way to judge your healing ability is to ask 'is/are my target(s) still alive at the end of the fight?' If the answer is yes your doing fine if no then you need to ask why.

In the example given if the tank runs out of LoS and you cant move then its the tanks fault for moving as you can hardly be blamed for not healing someone out of range like that. The way we get around the specific issue you raised is to have a hunter misdirect the 2nd golem to the tank who stays at the bottom of the stairs finishing off the adds there. That way it speeds up the pull a bit as no one else has to move bar the hunter and no one is likely to have LoS issues.

Sansei · 07/09/09, 9:43 AM

I'm sorry to disagree, but in my opinion, the above post includes false suggestions.

Firstly, HPS means a lot "especially studied together with the spell breakdowns"
That means, your HPS would hit the sky if you judged JoL in a fight where aoe-raid-damage is high, but as a holy paladin you shouldn't b judging light when there's a ret paladin doing it, hence the importance of spell breakdowns. On the other hand, we sometimes have healers DCing, and still the tanks survive the fight at the expense of risky cooldowns, extreme mana usage from healers, etc. You can not justify a claim such as HPS not really meaning anything.

As for what you should do at thorim gauntlet, here's what works for me:
After 1st miniboss is down, I run with the tank, even a few steps in front of him until i reach the top of the stairs where I wait for a few seconds for the tank to step in and pull the boss, and I ran in after him. Rest of the DPS should be on their way up at this moment, and none must have aggro from the adds on them. Tank must be carrying the guardian dudes to the miniboss with him. You may choose to stay at the top of the stairs where you have LoS to the whole staircase and the miniboss's room, or run to the sealed gate in order to jump down fast and position yourself so you can start healing asap. It's rather straightforward from that moment on.

i hope this helps.

dryearlylth · 07/09/09, 12:23 PM

Thanks for the responses.

The first miniboss is fine. I think part of the problem also is that the tank has been bringing an acolyte and some guardians to the top of the stairs as well. I wonder why we don't just kill them before moving onto the golem. In the attempts we did last night where we didn't have an abundance of adds before the second miniboss we made it to Thorim, and always got him down to >10%. For our first night it wasn't that bad. Very frustrating that when we get to the second miniboss things fall apart.

Does anyone else thing the misdirect idea is good? That is something I don't think anyone in my guild thought of, and if it's a good idea I'll suggest it tonight.