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Old 11/23/08, 11:31 AM   #46
Musclebound
Von Kaiser
 
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Orc Warrior
 
Mal'Ganis
Originally Posted by Merovengian View Post
Libram
[Venture Co. Libram of Retribution] - Venture Coin (30)

Why does everyone keep putting this libram up as the 'best in slot' item.... its retarded.

Assuming a normal Judge/cs/ds rotation, 5-7 seconds of the crit bonus is wasted in ability cooldown.


[Libram of Furious Blows]
[Libram of Furious Blows]

This seems much more streamlined for soloing or grouping. The only advantage i see from the Venture Co libram would be if you started opening with DS, which:

1. Wastes the free healing you get if youre running blood.
2. Can get you killed in an instance on a multi mob pull with a slow reacting tank.
3. Just feels wrong.
Consider that the Venture Co. libram has more up-time and a greater critical bonus. No, you wouldn't open with Divine Storm, but once you have used it the bonus lasts slightly longer and there is only two seconds where it isn't up between casts (ideally). Also if you think about it, the Furious Blows libram doesn't allow for the Judgement spell itself to benefit from the crit bonus since the Judgement is what activates it. Assuming you have Fanaticism, the Venture Co. Libram maximizes your chance of landing Righteous Vengeance.

All in all, Librams are pretty lackluster in this expansion, but in some ways they always have been. Hybrids lose out on their ranged slots. I'm not entirely sure myself which one is clearly better, but at the moment I see more potential gain from the venture Co. Libram of Retribution.

Last edited by Musclebound : 11/23/08 at 11:36 AM.

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Old 11/23/08, 5:23 PM   #47
Nefarium
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Zenedar (EU)
I think it's important to make the distinction between solo and instances/raids.

For soloing, the [Libram of Furious Blows] wins because Divine Storm is usually a finisher, if you even use it at all. Of course discounting elites you encounter in the levelling process.

For the remaining cases, [Venture Co. Libram of Retribution] wins because mobs usually stays alive long enough for even a second Divine Storm, thus justifying the shift in crit bonus.


So I'd say you both are correct.
Pick up the [Venture Co. Libram of Retribution] while levelling in Grizzy Hills, and switch to it when you're going into instances.

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Old 11/23/08, 8:38 PM   #48
Original Look
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Draenei Paladin
 
Dentarg (EU)
Originally Posted by Hythloday View Post
Nice list, but for trinkets, [Darkmoon Card: Greatness] is almost certainly best-in-slot (90 strength equip and then an averaged 100 strength proc). In fact given how good strength is for us I can't see replacing that for a long long time.
As far as I can see the Greatness card is +90 Agility, not strength?

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Old 11/24/08, 2:47 AM   #49
Chmur
Von Kaiser
 
Dwarf Paladin
 
Shadowsong (EU)
Originally Posted by Original Look View Post
As far as I can see the Greatness card is +90 Agility, not strength?
This trinket actually comes in 4 versions, for each stat mentioned in the "proc" tooltip. So there is 90STR base and 300STR on proc version of this, which makes it very good trinket for us indeed.

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Old 11/24/08, 5:03 AM   #50
Rukiia
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Nordrassil (EU)
[Fury of the Five Flights] Drops from heroic Sartharion. In theory it becomes a passive 320 AP, rather nifty.

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Old 11/24/08, 8:43 AM   #51
Redcape
King Hippo
 
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Dwarf Paladin
 
Vek'nilash
Originally Posted by Rukiia View Post
[Fury of the Five Flights] Drops from heroic Sartharion. In theory it becomes a passive 320 AP, rather nifty.
This trinket is potentially very good, but situational. The stacking time is not insignificant and 10 seconds is not long. On a tanknspank with no downtime it seems very strong, but on any fight with breaks or downtime it is going to be weak. Certainly a good item to collect, but you would want something more reliable to swap in for it. The ideal would be a clicky trinket, because those are amazing on fights with breaks and movement, sort of the opposite of this card.

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Old 11/24/08, 10:25 AM   #52
Rukiia
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Orc Warrior
 
Nordrassil (EU)
Has anyone done the math on what would be already "ideal" raiding gear (trinkets aside.) Whilst i know its still early days, the majority of drops are now known. I am currently doing them math the see what i can come up with. Are people planing to go with a four t7 and one random piece? How to get or get close to the hit cap with still keeping a strong amount of strength is interesting when it comes to gear selection; due to there being so many variations of items per slot.

Last edited by Rukiia : 11/25/08 at 8:11 AM. Reason: spelling

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Old 11/24/08, 11:37 AM   #53
 frmorrison
Protector
 
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Ashstrike
Human Paladin
 
No WoW Account
Originally Posted by Original Look View Post
As far as I can see the Greatness card is +90 Agility, not strength?
In Beta, only one card was made while collecting the item information. On live, no one has made a different card and uploaded the item info. There certainly is a strength version.


The only way to get Nobles cards made is to get a Scribe to make a card and then hope the RNG gives you the right cards.


Edit: To answer the below question, you get to pick one of four cards with a completed Noble Deck.

Last edited by frmorrison : 11/24/08 at 1:27 PM.

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Old 11/24/08, 1:01 PM   #54
Original Look
Von Kaiser
 
Draenei Paladin
 
Dentarg (EU)
Originally Posted by Chmur View Post
This trinket actually comes in 4 versions, for each stat mentioned in the "proc" tooltip. So there is 90STR base and 300STR on proc version of this, which makes it very good trinket for us indeed.
All 4 versions obtained from handing in the Nobles Deck? Is there any word as to whether you can chose which of the 4 you receive on live, or is it random?

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Old 11/24/08, 1:26 PM   #55
 Zurm
The Ultimate in /facepalm Technology
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Arthas
Originally Posted by Original Look View Post
All 4 versions obtained from handing in the Nobles Deck? Is there any word as to whether you can chose which of the 4 you receive on live, or is it random?
You chose it when you turn the deck in, just like you would chose any other quest reward.

Now on to a need for assistance from you guys. It's about that time to update Rawr.Ret to level 80 specs, but I need base stats for every race. Redcape, does your spreadsheet already have these? If not, could a few of you tell me your base stats unbuffed, untalented, and ungeared via PMs?

Back, semi-casual, and proud of it.

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Old 11/24/08, 4:38 PM   #56
MarshallX
Glass Joe
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Turalyon
Originally Posted by Zurm View Post
You chose it when you turn the deck in, just like you would chose any other quest reward.
Have we verified this is still the case?

Edit: Regardless, getting the deck is pretty ridiculus as a scribe. The mats are insane for the price of herbs right now its a random chance to get 1 card out of 4 decks of 10 cards each. That's 1/4 chance to get the deck you need and 1/40 chance of being the card you need, for upwards of 100g worth of mats.

Last edited by MarshallX : 11/24/08 at 4:48 PM.

Everything cleaves. And their cleaves cleave. And those cleaves thunderclap. These thunderclaps deathcoil.

So, no melee.

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Old 11/25/08, 2:55 AM   #57
Chmur
Von Kaiser
 
Dwarf Paladin
 
Shadowsong (EU)
Originally Posted by MarshallX View Post
Have we verified this is still the case?

Edit: Regardless, getting the deck is pretty ridiculus as a scribe. The mats are insane for the price of herbs right now its a random chance to get 1 card out of 4 decks of 10 cards each. That's 1/4 chance to get the deck you need and 1/40 chance of being the card you need, for upwards of 100g worth of mats.
Getting one card for hour of gathering, in worst case selling it for 300g to friends or AH. That is not that bad for hour of work, really. Already have 4 cards out of Nobles deck, so will report soon how the rewards work if the luck still sticks to me.

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Old 11/25/08, 4:08 AM   #58
Rukiia
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Orc Warrior
 
Nordrassil (EU)
With regards to enchants, will [Formula: Enchant 2H Weapon - Massacre] be superior to [Formula: Enchant Weapon - Berserking] ? I am gonna assume that the passive 110 AP is better but i am not 100% on it, or maybe one of the TBC enchants is currently top? Maybe those were nerfed like Crusader was when TBC hit.

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Old 11/25/08, 4:24 AM   #59
moby3012
Glass Joe
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Gorgonnash (EU)
Originally Posted by Rukiia View Post
With regards to enchants, will [Formula: Enchant 2H Weapon - Massacre] be superior to [Formula: Enchant Weapon - Berserking] ? I am gonna assume that the passive 110 AP is better but i am not 100% on it, or maybe one of the TBC enchants is currently top? Maybe those were nerfed like Crusader was when TBC hit.
I unfortunately can not answer your question but contribute something, that could help evaluate this enchant. It can proc out of every attack you do and seems to have a very high procc chance but I assume it has an hidden cooldown of ~40s.

A procc gives you a total of +400 AP (and with SoL +120 SP) and lowers your armor by -25% for 10 seconds.

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Old 11/25/08, 4:35 AM   #60
Arthaal
Don Flamenco
 
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Blood Elf Paladin
 
Deathwing
So by your numbers:

10s uptime at 400AP (120SP) with a 40s cooldown and high proc chance, wouldn't we simply model it as a passive 100AP at best (400AP * 10s/40s)? If someone comes up with firmer numbers we might get a slight edge, but so far doesn't look very impressive.

Percent modifiers R'US

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