Elitist Jerks
Register
Blogs
Forums


Go Back   Elitist Jerks » Class Mechanics » Paladins

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 02/15/10, 11:41 AM   #526
cremor
Piston Honda
 
Human Paladin
 
Blackmoore (EU)
Originally Posted by Kvaern View Post
It's not broken, I believe it will always choose the highest DPS rotation from the rotation list. The stats tab shows you which on that is.

You can force a lower DPS rotation by deleting the others.
I know how the rotation option works - or better, how it should work.
But in 2.3.9 it's not working like it did in 2.3.8.

Multiple rotations always show the first one in the stats tab.
Only one rotation always shows the same DPS, even if I completely mess it up with Exo - Cons - ...

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/15/10, 5:37 PM   #527
Heppypoo
Von Kaiser
 
Heppypoo's Avatar
 
Human Paladin
 
Sargeras
Engineering nitro boosts arent showing up in the enchant area, I have checked all filters and what not, and still not showing up, anyone have this issue?

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/16/10, 4:24 AM   #528
Neraya
Banned
 
Human Paladin
 
Khadgar (EU)
Originally Posted by Heppypoo View Post
Engineering nitro boosts arent showing up in the enchant area, I have checked all filters and what not, and still not showing up, anyone have this issue?
Nitro Bootse are currently actively being filtered out by the Rawr.Ret code, so no matter how much you fiddel with the settings, they'll never show up.

The gory details:
Crit is being marked as a 'maybe' stat. Meaning the item will only be considered if it does not have any of the unwanted stats (mp5 sp, defense, dodge, parry, block blockvalue) and it either has no special effect, or it has a wanted special effect.
The 'run speed' is a special effect, but run speed isn't currently a 'wanted' stat. so it's falling out because of not having a desired special effect.

The above filtering is really intended for filtering out stuff like trinkets with static crit and a proc/onuse spellpower/mp5 effect, as well as filter out tanking items. Which is why somewhat unexpected, strength isn't a wanted stat but a maybe stat also. If it was a 'wanted' stat, all tanking items would be proposed also.


I'm not sure why endoscient coded this entire function the way it's being done right now, Doing it another way seems obvious, but... probably too obvious. Nitro Boosts should definately pass through as a desired enchant, so the fact it's not happening now is an error. It's on the list to get fixed.

An obvious approach to item/enchant filtering would seems to be to allow any items with a stat (static or proc/onuse) that will increase DPS, but remove any items that have stats that obviously mark the item as non-melee dps (static of proc/onuse) mp5, spi, sp, defense, dodge, parry, block or blockvalue.

Easier, but maybe not entirely desired either. It's something that'll probably need a few iterations of testing to get it 'right'.

Last edited by Neraya : 02/16/10 at 4:55 AM.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/16/10, 4:40 AM   #529
Neraya
Banned
 
Human Paladin
 
Khadgar (EU)
Originally Posted by cremor View Post
I know how the rotation option works - or better, how it should work.
But in 2.3.9 it's not working like it did in 2.3.8.

Multiple rotations always show the first one in the stats tab.
Only one rotation always shows the same DPS, even if I completely mess it up with Exo - Cons - ...
As to how it should work now:
ADDING extra rotations may not have any immediately apparent effect. This merely instructs the DPS calculation to try this extra rotation. The rotation that ends up with the most DPS wins and should be suggested on the main form.
This is something Endoscient put in for 2.3.8. The feature is fairly new, so it may still have some issues.
If it's causing problems, then the workaround would be to remove all extra rotations and work with just 1 (as per pre 2.3.8).

DPS definately does change if you alter the rotation in 2.3.8. Can't test this in 2.3.9 until I get home.
Orlangur made changes for 2.3.9 in the rotation simulator and how it integrates into the calculations. It's possible something got broken here. To be continued when I get home...

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/16/10, 5:54 AM   #530
cremor
Piston Honda
 
Human Paladin
 
Blackmoore (EU)
Yes, like I said: I know that it should work that way and it also worked that way in older versions (btw., multiple rotations were added in 2.3.2, not in 2.3.8).
But it doesn't work in 2.3.9.

Should I enter an issue on codeplex or is it ok here on the forums?

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/16/10, 7:53 AM   #531
Neraya
Banned
 
Human Paladin
 
Khadgar (EU)
Originally Posted by cremor View Post
Should I enter an issue on codeplex or is it ok here on the forums?
I'll be looking into it regardless :-)

But yes, if you have done some proper testing to verify it's indeed a bug and not some setting causing this, filing a formal issue on codeplex is ideally the way to go.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/16/10, 11:23 AM   #532
cremor
Piston Honda
 
Human Paladin
 
Blackmoore (EU)
Done:
Rawr - View Issue #16373: [Ret][2.3.9] Rotation options not working

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/17/10, 11:26 AM   #533
pompus
Glass Joe
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Ner'zhul
I'm using the latest version 2.39 of rawr and for some reason it is not showing the new LK weapons or the new ashen verdict strength ring. How do I get these into the system so I can check them out? And I know the agi/ap ring is better, I would like to see how much though. Thanks

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/17/10, 3:30 PM   #534
Kinmaul
Piston Honda
 
Kinmaul's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Illidan
Here's how I got them to show up in mine.

Tools->Load Possible Upgrades from Armory
Tools->Load Possible Upgrades from Wowhead

After running both of those I had all the Lich King weapons and heroic loot that was missing from my item cache. Also the Ashen Verdict Agi ring will always be more dps than the Str version regardless of what gear you are using. We won't be swapping to the Str ring until Blizzard removes ap from agi items in patch 4.0

United States Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/20/10, 10:31 PM   #535
Alcapwnd
Von Kaiser
 
Draenei Paladin
 
Proudmoore
Since updating to 2.3.9 Rawr no longer shows the correct hit value for my character. It shows a hit rating of 197 while I actually have 227 ingame. I have triple checked all the gear and buffs to make sure all the gems match those of the ingame character. I'm not sure whats changed but it's effecting all of Rawr's gear recommendations.

EDIT: Rawr reverted back to the old stats for Malevolent Girdle.

Last edited by Alcapwnd : 02/20/10 at 11:11 PM.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/21/10, 1:56 AM   #536
gilda
Glass Joe
 
Draenei Mage
 
Area 52
Oddly Rawr is showing Herkmul War Trinket as higher dps than Whispering Fang Skull, is this correct, how can the haste be a better stat than the crit, not sure i follow this, or is this a bug?

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/21/10, 7:08 PM   #537
Malleus
King Hippo
 
Human Paladin
 
Bronze Dragonflight (EU)
Originally Posted by gilda View Post
Oddly Rawr is showing Herkmul War Trinket as higher dps than Whispering Fang Skull, is this correct, how can the haste be a better stat than the crit, not sure i follow this, or is this a bug?
It's dependent on the rest of your gear. If you have 2pc T10, Bryntroll or Tiny Abom, haste will give you more bonus attacks and DS refreshes. If you also have 4pc T10, it will give you more Seal procs and accelerate your DOT stacking. At the same time, crit will lose some value when you break the 2pc T9 bonus.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/22/10, 4:15 AM   #538
Neraya
Banned
 
Human Paladin
 
Khadgar (EU)
Originally Posted by Alcapwnd View Post
Since updating to 2.3.9 Rawr no longer shows the correct hit value for my character. It shows a hit rating of 197 while I actually have 227 ingame.
This is caused by the default item cache in the rawr zip. Several items have been changed recently and the default item cache is still using old values. The new rawr should come with an updated/refreshed item cache. The solution after installing 2.3.9 is to update the item cache from Wow or the Armory.



Originally Posted by Malleus View Post
It's dependent on the rest of your gear. If you have 2pc T10, Bryntroll or Tiny Abom, haste will give you more bonus attacks and DS refreshes. If you also have 4pc T10, it will give you more Seal procs and accelerate your DOT stacking. At the same time, crit will lose some value when you break the 2pc T9 bonus.
All worthy points. Also note that in 2.3.9 rawr.retribution was changed so hasted spell GCD (rather than the 1.5 static value) was used in the rotation for Exo/Cons. This means haste got a bump in 2.3.8 to 2.3.9.

Changes in 2.3.9 also made an existing bug more prominent when you have multiple rotations defined. This can also cause some stats to be rated differently. For 2.3.9 it's recommended you remove all but 1 defined rotation. Quit Rawr, delete the rotation cache file (Rawr/Data/RetRotations.xml), restart rawr. This issue is already fixed, waiting for 2.3.10 release.

If you click the 'Slot:' menu (top left of the right side charts panel), you will find a menu item called "relative stat values". That will show you a relative valuation of stats for your gear. In T10 gear, you should find crit and haste being fairly similarly valued, depending on gear, crit might be better or haste might be.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Old 02/22/10, 5:14 AM   #539
Pdawg
Von Kaiser
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Tichondrius
In 2.3.10 I'm seeing an increase of 700 DPS, which is much higher than I would expect from just the improvement to spell GCD. I noticed that my "Crit Chance" in the Stats tab has risen almost 10%. Is this a bug?

Also, is 2.3.10 taking into account the even lower spell GCD during bloodlust and potion of speed?

Online
Reply With Quote
Old 02/22/10, 6:00 AM   #540
Glutton
King Hippo
 
Glutton's Avatar
 
Blood Elf Paladin
 
Kalecgos
Since you're taking into account spell haste in rotations, I would suggest that Wrath of Air Totem (5% spell haste) be added as a buff option.

Is a proper TAJ trigger on your to-do list? The lack of this is probably the largest reason for any inaccuracies of Rawr with respect to Exemplar or Redscape's spreadsheets.

Edit:
I am also observing an anomalous crit increase in 2.3.10. Rawr reports 63.42% on a level 83 target, while a spreadsheet like Exemplar's reports 55.44%. When I decrease the target's level, Rawr's reported crit rate decreases (the opposite would be expected as crit depression goes to zero).

Last edited by Glutton : 02/22/10 at 6:10 AM.

Offline
Reply With Quote
Reply

Go Back   Elitist Jerks » Class Mechanics » Paladins

Thread Tools

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Rawr (v2.3.23 released on 9/12) Astrylian Public Discussion 2725 12/10/12 2:32 PM
[Elemental] Rawr Module Development Trolando Shamans 153 04/20/10 5:37 AM
Rawr Healadin Model Endoscient Paladins 252 10/08/09 7:45 PM