JotW is corrupted by his aura, reducing your healing by 90%.

Edit: Too slow. :-(

For General Vezax hardmode (were doing 10 man atm, and downing him weekly) I spec deep into the prot tree for Touched by The Light. I also made our other holy pally do the same. I do quite a bit of tweaking when I have to respec for him.

This is my spec currently for Vezax http://talent.mmo-champion.com/?pala...0&version=9947

I'm spec'd into Blessed Hands because our warlock was having threat issues, not to mention the hand of sac comes in handy during surge of darkness as well (we use a DK tank so that he doesnt have to move during Surge of Darkness). Although I'd probably spec into imp lay on hands for an "oh shit" button when you run oom if you do that is. Though if your dps does their jobs properly, you probably won't run oom, I'm generally left with about 2-3k mana at the end of the fight.

During the learning phase though it's really helpful to have a lock or any type of druid. As you can essentially suicide and res up with 2-5k mana. With our raid setup we had a lock, boomchicken, and a resto shammy, so all three healers we basically set up to die if needed to get some mana when we ran oom.


These items are also super helpful with this specific talent setup. [Deadly Gladiator's Libram of Justice], [Furious Gladiator's Ornamented Gloves], [Glyph of Flash of Light], [Glyph of Seal of Wisdom], and the last glyph I guess would be optional.

I also would recommend any sp trinkets you may have. For me, I have [Pandora's Plea] which is incredibly amazing on this fight (amazing all around! <3), and [Darkmoon Card: Greatness]

This build is setup around only using flash of light at 291 mana cost and getting insane heals out of it. With me and what I have (gear wise) my normal flash's will heal for around 5k-7k, and my crits will heal for around 8-11k. Not to mention when pandora's proc's even higher. I'm pretty careful not to over heal and waste mana on this fight, I usually don't heal at all unless the MT drops below 75% health.

As for beacon... and other deep talents in the holy tree, not necessary at all with this spec. You should have no problem when the Aminus(sp?) comes out in phase 2. Generally around that time I have 18+k mana, and I pretty much go flash of light crazy.

This has yet to let me down, we haven't done Vezax on 25 man hardmode, however I intend to use the same build here.

Good luck to ya!

I think [Spark of Hope] is vastly superior to any other trinket. It gives you 15.9% more FoLs to cast. Pandora's Plea gives you 2070 mana, 7 FoLs and some change. So unless you cast less than 47 FoLs (that comes out to 13 677 mana) in that fight, Spark of Hope will be better. That is, of course, not counting the +spell power proc and the 30 spell power you get from the intellect. It is definitely better than the greatness card, since the extra intellect from the proc is wasted if you can't use divine plea during it, so I would be running with Pandora's Plea and Spark of Hope.

1. I started using the 51/20/0 spec to try "something" different. Most of the other paladins were 53/0/18 and I had been running 51/5/15.
2. I find it useful on quite a few fights. It does get hard at times as far as timing issues go, but I would attribute part of that to my DBM not being up to date so I don't know how close some abilities are to being used.
3. Yes, for the most part you want to DS every time you DiSac. In two different situations I've pretty much been killed instantly by it. Once was when DS was still on CD and I tried to use it; the other was when I hit the wrong binding (was trying to Aura Mastery and hit DiSac instead).
3. Tympanic tantrum, final phase of Razorscale, Flame Jets on Ignis, Ground Tremor on Freya. Any time you find the raid can take large amounts of damage mainly.

Also, as mentioned previously, you can use BoP + DiSac when your raid is taking physical damage (Tantrums, etc) and get the same effect as if you were using Divine Shield. This means you can get two DiSacs into a rotation, DS + DiSac, BoP + DiSac, DS + DiSac. Combined with another Paladin, you can have DiSac up for pretty much every raid AoE damage situation.

Just a word of caution, if you try and BoP + DiSac the trantum on hardmode XT theres a high chance you'll get nuked by the nature damage from a spark, tested it afew times on 25man and the results weren't pretty!

Hmm, assuming you absorb the damage incoming from tantrum through BoP, the damage from the spark should not be instantly fatal if you heal yourself through it. I often just beacon the tank and heal myself during that little bit and unless people are getting hit with gravity bomb/void zone in the ground, it does not seem that bad. At any rate, DiSac maxes out at 150% of your health so a few self heals should be sufficient to live through it.

For this fight in general I could see using spark of hope, however I would never use that trinket or roll on it just for this fight alone.

For someone with a 30k plus mana pool... mana should never be issues. My mana is 33k Raid buffed now. I rarely find myself running oom, even the hard modes are a joke. Obviously I cant use divine plea during Vezax when greatness procs, the point of using this trinket is the +90 intellect. I honestly don't need anymore crit from SotD, as I'm already 41% holy non raid buffed.

But yeah, before I had the greatness card I was using [item]Forethought Talisman[\item] which was also rather nice. Anything to boost my sp for the fight greatly helped with the talent build.

Not really, I got a 20k DiSac tick, combined with the normal damage you take from the spark, that was enough to kill me.

I wouldn't suggest using HoP DiSac on XT hard mode (it's stupidly easy anyway).

Including perhaps [Spark of Hope], I'd probably keep a few other items to switch to just for General Vezax. [Insightful Earthsiege Diamond]'s mana proc will not work, so using either [Beaming Earthsiege Diamond] or [Ember Skyflare Diamond] as your meta in a switch helm would be best. I'd personally go for the Ember given its better stats for the General fight.

Celestria has already mentioned other excellent switch options that aren't too hard to get with a bit of PvP. [Furious Gladiator's Libram of Justice] is superior to Deadly, so go for the 1950 rating if you want to get it. Sadly our usual [Glyph of Divinity] won't give mana during the fight. I guess [Glyph of Holy Light] for when you do cast it?

meh, I still wouldn't cast holy light, it's just not necessary with the prot talent spec. Also 1950 is quite a rough rating to get, thus I suggested the Deadly Libram. Which is only 1250 ^_^


Edit: I always use (not just this fight but overall) [Ember Skyflare Diamond] as the 2% intellect turns out to be more than +21, and I'm never really hurting for the extra mana you get from [Insightful Earthsiege Diamond]

Tested now on Thrym: 2590sp and DG, 3230 absorbs (http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/2...1209124042.jpg). Quite a lot more than 1.2 * (0.75 * sp + 500).

Short question:
I was away for some weeks and returned to WoW just now. I noticed that haste has been changed and I get higher % of haste for the same haste rating. Is it only goes for melee haste or spell haste rating as well?
If it's for spell haste then what is the required haste rating to get soft-capped?

A quick look at the OP gives the answer:

"So with all of them you only need 20.6% haste from gear to get haste soft capped (50%, for 1sec GCDs). 100 Spell Haste at 80 will give you 3% haste. "

You need about 687 Haste rating from your gear to cap your GCD at 1 second. If you get more, only your HL cast time will be lowered further.

They increased the return of melee haste you get from haste rating in one of the recent patches, but this did not affect spell haste.

Since there was talk of learning from ensidia members, I wanted to paste this in case someone missed it. It's from worldofming.

Now, I think stacking spellpower is just silly. If you have no mana problems, you should go for haste and not spellpower, since haste increases the chance of your heal landing in time and it also makes you a better raid healer when if needed.

And haste gives much more HPS per itemization point (till cap at least) than SP. And makes you more mobile. When you need effectiveness - go int, when you need HPS - go haste. Yellow is our primary gem color.

Sacred Shield is one of those abilities whose worthiness depends almost entirely on your gear. When you first enter Ulduar with 2k Spellpower and 4PT7, your 2k absorbs off every other hit are pitiful and insignificant. By the time you gear up with 4pt8, a prot subspec, and perhaps Spellpower stacking, you can jump it to 3-4k absorbed off every hit. Consider this also means your tanks are better geared and taking less and less damage.

When a tank takes two hits for 20k and Sacred Shield knocks 2k off one of them, you're looking at Sacred Shield absorbing 5% of incoming damage.

When a tank takes two hits for 19k and Sacred Shield knocks 3.5k off both of them, you're looking at Sacred Shield upwards of 18% of incoming damage.

So, haste is obviously a better throughput stat. But Spellpower is a throughput and mitigation stat. And it's not like Spellpower is a horribly bad throughput stat either. It's quite good, better than crit or int in terms of raw HPS. The fact that it is not *quite* as much of an HPS increase as haste is offset by the fact that it turns Sacred Shield into a spell that actually matters.

EDIT: The new data we're seeing on Sacred Shield absorb suggests an 85% spellpower coefficient, up from our previously believed 75%.

Regarding Mek's comment towards stacking spell power gems versus int gems, he is a Shaman, who has talents that make Lesser Healing Wave cast at 1 second or less. Mek heals using Riptide (instant), then LHW, so haste would be a worse choice than Int. Also Riptide has a HoT, so spell power affects that.

I always felt mp5 and int was more useful than spell power for Paladins, because you didn't need to cast Plea as much.

Note from the one set of data presented, SS is using 0.85 for its formula, at least when you have the SS talent.

I love all these posts. But i was wondering. Are there any "base" healadin talent trees?
Also.. healing AoE damage SUCKS!!! anyone come up with a solution for this problem yet?

I've noticed that its kinda hard to not let anyone drop at least once during an instance/raid

I am trying to maximize the ability to SoW proc during Ulduar bosses, as i am having some mana trouble after about 3 min of straight HL spam (until my gear is better). I typically try to limit the amount of DP, with exceptions below, and use AW+DP at the end of fight to get in a few HoW strikes. I am using mana pots, Sapphire Owl, and Divine Illumination to keep from going OOM. Raid buffed i am at ~27k mana. Most of my experience comes from the first 6 bosses, with Kologorn giving me the most trouble.

Razorscale:
HL spam through air phase leaves me close to OOM by the time she(?) lands. I pop DP and run into melee range to SoW proc until air phase again. I am close to full mana by the time air phase returns.

XT:
This is the easiest fight to SoW proc on. I simply stand in melee range the whole fight, cast DP during heart exposure.

Kologorn:
I tried standing in melee range of the body to get SoW procs last night, but kept getting stunned or spell locked. I ended up standing away from the boss, by the door. In this fight, the raid AoE damage makes me very reluctant to use DP, especially when a healer gets caught in the arm.

Auriaya:
I am in melee range the whole fight for this, and haven't needed DP.

These are the only fights i have had time to attempt.

Yes, the first post has some talents listed. Also try talentchic.com
As you know, Paladin AoE healing is limited (Beacon and glyph of HL). Ghostcrawler is considering adding an AoE heal, but only time will tell what he decides.

One of the better ways to help AoE heal is get glyph of Holy Shock.

I'd recommend you ease up on the HL spam actually, or find a way to be more efficient and more based more on what's actually needed than straight spam (you shouldn't need to spam in most cases if your raid is avoiding AOE as much as they can.) Almost all of the raid damage on Razorscale for instance (it's a she by the way) can be avoided by people staying out of the fires and by a specific person knowing the aerial aggro trick.

Kolo didn't seem to be too bad on the PUG I was in. If in a spam healing situation (or any other time I feel I need it really) though and I'm lom or oom, I pop my sp trinket, divine illumination, AW, and DP together. From my experience I can actually recover more mana during heavy healing that way since divine illumination cuts your cost by 50%, effectively giving you 10% of the base mana cost on crits.