Theorycraft and numbers are hard to ignore is what I mean. The "something better" is vague yes, but I mean it in that there can be a more effective gearing setup, playstyle, etc. Whether X is better than Y, for the case of my argument, is shown from the data and spreadsheets that have been assembled.
Thats just the thing, you say Theorycrafting and numbers are hard to ignore, but yet you AGREED with the Ensidia's healer interview. Theorcrafting shows that intellect is hands down a superior stat for Paladins to stack almost wrecklessly from other stats. You get more per point in Intellect as a Holy Pally then you do from any other stat. The data spells this out quite clearly. So again your comment seems flawed. If spellpower was as useful as you seem to think, then the data would clearly indicate so. In our classes case, it does not.
So I understand that you may agree with Ensidia healers that a "better" way exists, you have yet to indicate what that better way specifically involves. I know for certain little evidence would support it.
Thats just the thing, you say Theorycrafting and numbers are hard to ignore, but yet you AGREED with the Ensidia's healer interview. Theorcrafting shows that intellect is hands down a superior stat for Paladins to stack almost wrecklessly from other stats. You get more per point in Intellect as a Holy Pally then you do from any other stat. The data spells this out quite clearly. So again your comment seems flawed. If spellpower was as useful as you seem to think, then the data would clearly indicate so. In our classes case, it does not.
So I understand that you may agree with Ensidia healers that a "better" way exists, you have yet to indicate what that better way specifically involves. I know for certain little evidence would support it.
You're misinterpreting what I'm trying to say.. I -don't- agree with Ensidia. They can stack SP all they want, but the "better way" is still to stack intellect. I'll add a little bit to show what I meant.
"Still, I bet some of them are thinking there could be something that works [better than their current setup], and they'd be right."
There is something better since intellect gives us far better returns right now.
At a certain point you're going to have too much mana though, and at this point any excess is wasted. It's worth noting that skill is still quite a large variable when it comes to determining how much is too much. With cancel casting, exceptional healer communication, perfect CD rotations on tanks, DPS avoiding as much unecessary damage as possible, etc, the amount of mana that's actually needed to keep the tank (or whoever your targets are) alive is reduced considerably. If you've got 300 ping, a weak link or two in your healing line-up, a tank that's sometimes slow to hit a trinket / CD, etc then stacking int and being able to bomb the tank at 70% overheal is a very viable tactic. On the other hand, if you're working in perfect conditions, where you can glance at your raid frames and immediately see that only two groups are 'low', and instantly surmise that this means your third priest will be winding up a GH to hit the tank, and that you can therefore sneak in a couple of quick flashes instead of HLs, then the extra flexibility provided by intellect is no longer as valuable.
The point I'm trying to make is that yes, intellect is an incredible stat -- it gives longevity and almost as much throughput as traditional throughput stats but only if you're actually spending the mana. In situations where you can accurately modulate your output (and as holy paladins, these are few and far between), then SP or haste will go further towards giving you the tools that you need to keep the tank alive. For the vast majority of us though, this is not the world that we play in, and intellect will in fact deliver much more practical bang for your buck.
A latent appliance fetishist is someone who refuses to admit to his or herself that sexual gratification can only be achieved through the use of machines.
- L. Ron Hoover
To summerise the previous example of the Sacred Shield formulas:
17 Prot and 4T8: 1.02SP + 600,
No Prot + 4T8: .85SP + 500.
17 in Prot: .9SP + 600
No Prot: .75SP + 500
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
Is it me, or you're totally ignoring the relative (point-to-point) value of crit rating vs. mp5 for holy paladins? I am talking about mana regeneration of course. Quite often there are situations when you have to choose between 2 almost similar gear pieces, swapping crit for mp5 and vice versa. It would be good for people to know how exactly the stats affect their mana regen.
I have the data handy, for various mixes of HL vs. FoL and different haste levels, not sure if its ok to post a direct link out here.
Is it me, or you're totally ignoring the relative (point-to-point) value of crit rating vs. mp5 for holy paladins? I am talking about mana regeneration of course. Quite often there are situations when you have to choose between 2 almost similar gear pieces, swapping crit for mp5 and vice versa. It would be good for people to know how exactly the stats affect their mana regen.
I have the data handy, for various mixes of HL vs. FoL and different haste levels, not sure if its ok to post a direct link out here.
At a certain point you're going to have too much mana though, and at this point any excess is wasted.
That's not ENTIRELY correct. The difference between having no mana left over and having some mana left over isn't necessarily a result of having "too much" mana. It could also be the difference between needing to hit Divine Plea and not needing to hit Divine Plea. I'd rather have the extra intellect than the direct spell power and hit Divine Plea *one less time*. Only at the point where healing with maximum efficiency without Divine Plea can you safely say that you have "too much mana." I do however, agree with your later points that skill, communication, etc., can significantly reduce the need for a larger mana pool.
What I meant is: post something like
1 mp5 = about 0.5 crit rating for HL
1 mp5 = about 0.2 crit rating for HoL
in the math section, with more details of course.
You can't give a static crit value to mp5 in a realistic manner. Saying something like "1 mp5 = about 0.5 crit rating for HL" assumes that during a fight you will only cast Holy Lights non-stop for a specific amount of time which is unrealistic because you will also cast Flash of Light and Holy Shock as well as spending general cooldowns on Sacred Shield, Beacon of Light and cooldown spells. Writing down a static value on the first post would only misinform newcomers.
Using a tool like Rawr can accurately compare two items with crit or mp5 on them according to the spells you cast and the fight duration.
Is it me, or you're totally ignoring the relative (point-to-point) value of crit rating vs. mp5 for holy paladins? I am talking about mana regeneration of course. Quite often there are situations when you have to choose between 2 almost similar gear pieces, swapping crit for mp5 and vice versa. It would be good for people to know how exactly the stats affect their mana regen.
I have the data handy, for various mixes of HL vs. FoL and different haste levels, not sure if its ok to post a direct link out here.
Sadly, for healing you cannot directly compare stats like you can as a dps or a tank. A dps can say 1 hit is X dps before the hit cap or a tank can say 8 agility adds 100 effective health, but a Holy Pally cannot say 1 mp5 = 0.5 crit, because a healer is not doing the same thing all the time like a tank or dps.
Use Rawr and be happy it does the work for you, once you enter your healing situation.
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
You can't give a static crit value to mp5 in a realistic manner. Saying something like "1 mp5 = about 0.5 crit rating for HL" assumes that during a fight you will only cast Holy Lights non-stop for a specific amount of time
But yes I can, of course. That's why it reads "for HL" and "for FoL". The values are different for different spells.
Writing down a static value on the first post would only misinform newcomers.
I believe it will help them estimating upgrades and gear. Because knowing that, let's say, 15mp5 is always better than 25 crit rating is much, much easier than using Rawr.
As for the Rawr reference...yes it's a good tool. However, then why don't just reduce the whole thread to the following: list of BiS pieces for a healadin + "use Rawr to get further details and math" reference?
Then again, it's not misleading, instead it's very easy to read and use. Take the values:
For a realistic spells rotation, depending on FoL to HL ratio, the average weightened number will be somewhere in 0.4-0.5 range, which basically means 1 point of mp5 on any piece of gear should be only traded for at least 2 points of crit rating.
I believe it will help them estimating upgrades and gear. Because knowing that, let's say, 15mp5 is always better than 25 crit rating is much, much easier than using Rawr.
That's just the thing we're trying to say though, mate. X amount of MP5 is not always better than Y amount of crit rating. There are too many variables to take into account, mostly due to movement, healing decisions/assignments, and your gear.
For example, on a heavy mobility fight like Hodir, MP5 becomes arguably more valuable than crit since it returns mana while you're standing still and while you're running, while (with the exception of holy shock), crit only returns mana when you're standing still.
For another example, healing the Steelbreaker tank on hardmode Assembly requires constant Holy Light spam. This making crit an incredibly more powerful mana stat for that assignment and fight than MP5. Compare that to healing the Freya tank, or even the tank for one of the other adds on Assembly hard, which can be done using almost entirely Flash of Light, making MP5 more valuable for those assignments.
For a final example, you have to take into account the gear values in place already on the rest of your kit. 1% extra crit is more valuable to someone with 20% crit chance than it is to someone with 35% crit chance. Conversely, MP5 is equally valuable at all gear levels (arguably more valuable at higher levels since you begin to approach threshold values where MP5 is guaranteed to cover all of your mana costs, although this is currently only obtainable for flash spam).
This is nothing new. I'm simply explaining what everyone else is trying to tell you. As a healer, the only way you can say "_____ amount of Stat A is always better than _____ amount of Stat B" is if you're saying 25 Intellect is always better than 15 Intellect.
The thing you're not taking into account is that Rawr outputs those values based on the conditions you input into it. Rawr models, as best it can, variables like fight length, spell rotation, and gear. There is no fight length, spell rotation, or gear preset that gives any healer stat a static value. The values for Mimiron are drastically different than the values for Thorim.
...For a final example, you have to take into account the gear values in place already on the rest of your kit. 1% extra crit is more valuable to someone with 20% crit chance than it is to someone with 35% crit chance. Conversely, MP5 is equally valuable at all gear levels (arguably more valuable at higher levels since you begin to approach threshold values where MP5 is guaranteed to cover all of your mana costs, although this is currently only obtainable for flash spam)...
I'm not sure what you mean about more valuable but crit scales with itself, so the more crit you have the more you get out of each additional crit rating added. But maby you meant that you need regen more the less you have but then it should have applied to mp5 aswell.
But agree, you can't really set a fix number and say that x amount of crit equals y amount of mp5.
What you could do though is calculate that number for a typical fight with your current gear and your own play style and than use that number for comparison.
But then it is probably just easier and more acurate to use rawr anyways since you would have to calculate that number your self and recalculate it every time you get new items.
..constant Holy Light spam. This making crit an incredibly more powerful mana stat for that assignment and fight than MP5
My friend, as I noted above, for constant HL spam coming out from a well geared healadin in a raid buffed environment, 1 point of crit rating still worse than 1 point of mp5 (in terms of mana regen), as it equals only about 0.5-0.6 points of mp5 (@ around 450 haste and more).
1% extra crit is more valuable to someone with 20% crit chance than it is to someone with 35% crit chance
Um, no. The higher your crit is already, the more you gain (in terms of effective mana pool) from each extra 1%. Increasing returns similar to that of armor value, though using different mechanics.
There is no fight length, spell rotation, or gear preset that gives any healer stat a static value.
Absolutely true. However, you won't be jumping to rawr every now and then. Sometimes a piece drops and you have to make a choice if it's worth an upgrade or not, within a few seconds so you won't delay the raid - that's where the rough estimates really help, while still not preventing you from doing extended modelling with rawr or anything else in your free time.
I disagree with the concept of "crit becomes better if you have more crit." This is not entirely true. Crit becomes better if you have more mana, regardless of the source of that mana. Additionally, other sources of regen exhibit similar behavior, it just is not nearly as math-able as crit. If you've got alot of int, adding MP5 point by point each point increases your time-to-OOM more than the last, for example. In short, if you're spending a static amount of mana per second, decreasing the net loss of mana per second by 2 MPS will increase your time-to-OOM by an amount more than double what a decrease of 1 MPS would.
If you have 1000 mana and you spend 20 mana every second, your time-to-OOM is 50 seconds.
If you have 1000 mana and you spend 19 mana every second, your time-to-OOM is 52.63 seconds, an increase of 2.63s.
If you have 1000 mana and you spend 18 mana every second, your time-to-OOM is 55.56 seconds, an increase of 2.92s.
These are obviously sandbox numbers, but it proves the concept. Each incremental decrease of your net loss of mana is worth more than the previous, regardless of whether that decrease is from crit, int, or MP5.
As for the relative value of Crit and MP5, while I agree that values of these stats fluctuate wildly between fights I do believe it is possible to get a feel for what the various break-points are. The math I've done has shown that at 28.8 Holy Lights cast per minute over the course of the fight 10 crit rating grants as much effective MP5 as 4 MP5 would, which is a precisely even amount of item-points. Here's my math for you to check over:
HLPM (holy lights cast per minute) * 0.000218 (% of crit added by 1 crit rating) * 764.4 (mana gained from a HL crit) * 1/12 (number of MP5 ticks in a minute)
Or, fully broken down:
0.0139 * HLPM = the amount of effective MP5 each point of crit rating is worth
10 crit rating = 4 MP5 in terms of itemization points, so to solve for the breakpoint at which crit is worth more than MP5...
0.0139 * HLPM = 0.4
HLPM = 28.8
Cast 28.8 holy lights a minute and your crit rating is equal to your MP5. Cast more and crit is better, cast less and MP5 is better.
To be fair, holy shock and flash of light also factor into this equation:
HSPM (holy shocks cast per minute) * 0.000218 (% of crit added by 1 crit rating) * 474.6 (mana gained from a HS crit) * 1/12 (number of MP5 ticks in a minute)
0.0086 * HSPM = effective MP5 given by crit rating for HS
FoLPM (flashes of light cast per minute) * 0.000218 (% of crit added by 1 crit rating) * 108 (mana gained from a FoL crit) *1/12
0.001962 * FoLPM = effective MP5 given by crit rating for FoL
Lets consolidate this into one formula.
0.0139 * 1 = 0.0086 * HSPM (or, how many holy shocks per minute is equal to 1 holy light per minute)
1.616 = HSPM (1.616 holy shocks per minute is equal to 1 holy light per minute)
0.0139 * 1 = 0.001962 * FoLPM (or, how many flashes of light per minute is equal to 1 holy light per minute)
7.085 = FoLPM (7.085 flashes of light per minute is equal to 1 holy light per minute)
Big honkin' formula:
0.0139 * (HLPM + [1/1.1616 * HSPM] + [1/7.085 * FoLPM]) = effective MP5 per point of crit rating
0.0139 * (HLPM + [0.619 * HSPM] + [0.141 * FoLPM]) = effective MP5 per point of crit rating
This is the best you're going to get if you're looking for a mathematical equivalency of MP5 and crit rating.
Here's some real life numbers punched in, from myself:
Hodir Hard-mode, two weeks ago:
21.81 HLPM, 1.82 HSPM, 4.72 FoLPM, 1 crit rating is worth 0.328 MP5.
Thorim Hard-mode, two weeks ago:
21.22 HLPM, 2.26 HSPM, 5.57 FoLPM, 1 crit rating is worth 0.325 MP5.
The number 1 HPS parse for Hard-Mode Assembly of Iron on WMO that isn't skewed by JoL:
32.70 HLPM, 0.38 HSPM, 0 FoLPM, 1 crit rating is worth 0.458 MP5.
In short, the values vary, but not nearly as much as people suggest. Crit rating can waffle between 70% as good as MP5 per item point and 115% as good as MP5 per item point depending on how much you spam and what fight it is. Doing this math really affirms to me that, at the moment, MP5 and crit are equally good at restoring your mana -- I'd still go for crit over MP5 when available due to the additional throughput, but honestly it's a small benefit that I'm not all that interested in. When 3.2 hits and MP5 is buffed I plan on itemizing MP5 over crit -- doubly so if illumination is nerfed as well.
My friend, as I noted above, for constant HL spam coming out from a well geared healadin in a raid buffed environment, 1 point of crit rating still worse than 1 point of mp5 (in terms of mana regen), as it equals only about 0.5-0.6 points of mp5 (@ around 450 haste and more).
While correct, I think it leaves out the important fact that MP5 costs more in item points than crit rating. This is why an equal ilvl piece of gear that has crit instead of MP5 is generally better. Hopefully the increased amount of MP5 on gear that GC hinted at will even the stats out a little more.
1% extra crit is more valuable to someone with 20% crit chance than it is to someone with 35% crit chance.
That is entirely incorrect. It is very easy to use Rawr and see that the opposite is true. It is also explained in the first post. Crit increases you total mana pool by a percentage, and the more crit you start with the bigger of a percentage it increases it by per point.
The mana you gain from crit can be used to cast spells that crit. This is a geometric seies, so it ends up increasing you current mana pool by 1 / (1 - .6 * chance). You can refer to graph in the first post, which shows the rate of change of this equation.
That is entirely incorrect. It is very easy to use Rawr and see that the opposite is true. It is also explained in the first post. Crit increases you total mana pool by a percentage, and the more crit you start with the bigger of a percentage it increases it by per point.
The mana you gain from crit can be used to cast spells that crit. This is a geometric seies, so it ends up increasing you current mana pool by 1 / (1 - .6 * chance). You can refer to graph in the first post, which shows the rate of change of this equation.
Mathematically speaking, yes. I mistakenly gave the impression that I was referring to specific numbers and formulas. That was my bad.
What I was trying to demonstrate was the practicality of more crit. There are those certain threshold levels--"I can cast X number of holy lights per minute with Y amount of crit." If you increase Y, then you can increase X. However, that may not be the relevant variable to measure.
In a fight where you only need to cast 30 Holy Lights per minute, you only "need" a certain amount of crit to sustain it. Any less crit means you cannot sustain your quota. Any more crit means you can exceed your quota, but that is completely unnecessary if the incoming damage remains equal to 30 Holy Lights per minute. This is the threshold I'm referring to, and what I meant when I made the comment that crit is worth more to someone with poor gear than to someone with better gear. I'm not trying to argue that Crit becomes less useful the higher you raise it. Rather, I'm saying that the relative importance of Crit depends on how much healing you can actually put out--and until you reach the level where it grants the amount of casts you need to keep a tank alive in a certain time frame, it's one of the most important stats you can get. Once you reach that critical level, then it becomes just another stat to stack, like spellpower, haste, or intellect.
To demonstrate what I'm trying to depict, take off all your epics. Go back to your blue heroic set with 25% crit or whatever. Cast 10 Holy Lights and your mana expenditures will be higher than they are in your epic 25-man gear with 35% crit. Fixing those mana expenditures is very important at lower levels.
Simply put, one way of looking at every fight is that there is a certain amount of healing needed, which translates directly to a certain amount of mana needed. When you are below that level, increasing your mana is the most vital thing you can do. When you are at that level, there are other things that can be considered more important.
I may still be unclear, although I hope I'm not. Suffice it to say, I've read the thread from start to finish. I know how crit works. And you can never say X crit is always equal to Y mp5, which is what this whole debate is about.
the formulas and stuff that you present are excellent and are correct. HL and every paladin spell in general, benefits more and more (in terms of mana regen) from Illumination anc critbacks as the spell's cast time becomes less and less. And you achieve that by stacking haste through any available means.
But don't forget about two very important things out there: the general haste cap that exists in the game, and practical haste cap that you (effectively) have as a healadin, e.g. a level of haste you can practically reach without seriously sacrificing your general HPS output and/or effective mana pool.
The first cap is a hard cap and you can't do anything about it, but it's not even important yet, as you can't reach it with currently available gear. The second cap is more real, however. And in your Assembly of Iron quote (about 32 HLPM) you're getting very close to it - and as you've shown up, at that point "pure" 1 crit rating is still less than 0.5mp5. 1000 haste rating (or equivalent haste %) looks impossible so far w/o bloodlust, yet even at this level of haste 1 crit rating = 0.6mp5, way, way less than 1:1 equation (still talking about HL only here).
Yes definitely, as people mentioned, 1 crit rating point and 1 mp5 point have different costs in item points on gear. However, often it's not a matter of "that amount of crit vs. this amount of mp5" situation. Often item points are shifted to a less important stats such as stamina. That results in assigning non-equal item points to "crit rating" or "mp5" stats on 2 pieces of gear - which brings back the subject, e.g. how do compare those 2 values fast, without having to spend a couple of minuts in rawr (or your favorite spreadsheet).
Sawhich brings back the subject, e.g. how do compare those 2 values fast, without having to spend a couple of minuts in rawr (or your favorite spreadsheet).
There is no accurate way to do that, which is the whole reason people use Rawr/Spreadsheets instead of Pawn. You can take a snapshot of the value of stats for a particular gear setup and fight, but they can change drastically when your gear or fight changes so you have to be extremely careful when using it.
the formulas and stuff that you present are excellent and are correct.
Tee hee, I appreciate the support, but no. My formulas were completely incorrect, as I did not intend to present any formulas. If you read anything statistically into my statements, it is wrong. They were meant to be much more philosophical in nature, and my apologies for the confusion that's ensued from that.
If you would like a way to gauge gear choices outside of the spreadsheet, then you can use a combination of the spreadsheet and your own experience to craft your own "caps" as you like to call them. Just spend half an hour or so in Rawr trying out different specs, gears, and fights, then combine those with your experience from healing in the field. You should be able to get a good grasp of the areas that you need help in the most--are you unable to keep up with incoming damage? If not, you may not be comfortable with your current haste level and need to pad it a bit past the soft cap. Are you unable to keep up with incoming damage due to Divine Plea uptime? Intellect is always the answer, but if you only have mana problems during heavy-throughput fights like Hodir or Iron Council, then crit's probably the answer. If you tend to just slowly drain out of mana even though you're using the most efficient spell mix you can think of, MP5 may be a better route.
It doesn't take long to start getting a feel for the kinds of values you want to have according to your personal position and playstyle--be it 500 haste rating, 100 MP5, 30% crit, or whatever. Once you define those benchmarks for yourself, you can make more informed decisions about gear on the fly--"Well, I'm pretty close to my comfortable level of haste, but mana issues are pretty severe whenever I get in a heavy mobility / heavy damage scenario. I think it's worth sacrificing a few points of haste for MP5."
Mostly, choosing gear as a holy paladin is about defining what YOU need, not what any other paladin does. We can't put these benchmark levels in the OP because they're not the same for everyone. Just look at the debate that raged over Divinity vs. PoJ. Half the paladin community considers PoJ essential, and the other half considers it worthless. Neither are particularly right or wrong, it's a playstyle difference.
Those are the kinds of decisions you have to make with what you have available. There's a pretty equal case both for and against MP5's value compared to Crit. Once you get some practice both in the model and in the raid, you'll be able to determine how much each is worth to you pretty much in your head.
Often item points are shifted to a less important stats such as stamina. That results in assigning non-equal item points to "crit rating" or "mp5" stats on 2 pieces of gear - which brings back the subject, e.g. how do compare those 2 values fast, without having to spend a couple of minuts in rawr (or your favorite spreadsheet).
There's a simple way to fix this before even entering the dungeon: Look up the loot tables for the bosses in question and see what would be an upgrade! Even though the point-for-point comparison can be useful, it's typically better to simply gear for playstyle as far as healing goes, as well as shore up what needs to be worked on. Doing the research beforehand (as to what item would be an upgrade for a certain playstyle) is more effective than at-a-glance "Oh, this is better for me!"
Going with the theorycrafting is nice, and recommended if you can do it, but there are enough different ways to gear and play as a healer (not to mention enough different encounters) where trying to figure out an X=2Y mechanic just isn't going to work. Serious raiders know the fights, know what is required, and will gear appropriately.
That's not ENTIRELY correct. The difference between having no mana left over and having some mana left over isn't necessarily a result of having "too much" mana. It could also be the difference between needing to hit Divine Plea and not needing to hit Divine Plea. I'd rather have the extra intellect than the direct spell power and hit Divine Plea *one less time*. Only at the point where healing with maximum efficiency without Divine Plea can you safely say that you have "too much mana." I do however, agree with your later points that skill, communication, etc., can significantly reduce the need for a larger mana pool.
The point that I was trying to make (and I do get waffly), was essentially that this theoretical level does exist, but isn't likely to be reachable by 99.9% of the playerbase. For a playstyle which encompasses pure HL spam, that 'enough' level is going to be unrealistically high, although it still exists (20 million mana, if you'll permit the hyperbole, would be too much). For a much more conservative, 'accurate' playstyle which absolutely minimises overhealing (without unduely compromising the tank -- again something practically not really possible), that number's going to be a bit lower. To put it simply, there IS a point where you have enough mana, that point varies depending on your healing style / skill / guild's skill, and past that point SP / Haste are better options.
Does Ensidia play at a level where 25k-ish mana is enough for Algalon? I honestly couldn't even begin to speculate, but theoretically it's possible. At the very least we can say that the method is viable, even if Mack is making it harder on himself, there can be no doubt that it has the potential to work. I'm simply offering an opinion as to why, as well as perhaps trying to soften up the 'stack int nothing else lalala' idea from an unassailable mantra to perhaps just very sound advice for most people!
Regarding crit vs mp5 values, as Endo said, spreadsheets and rawr don't exist simply because their authors felt like dedicating countless hours of their lives to replicate 7 minutes of napkin math, it's because the reality is quite simply that the complexities of the game preclude broad, general statements of value for particular stats. Yes, there is some value in having a 'rule of thumb' for making quick decisions, but this is something that most holy paladins will develop within a few days or weeks of working with rawr / spreadsheets, and something which will be tailored towards their own personal playstyle. I think it's much more important to encourage critical thinking about the stats and their weighting to further people's understanding, rather than relying on generalised approximations in the OP. You already see it on the official forums -- pages upon pages of paladins arguing whether the 'proper' stat priority is int > crit > haste > mp5 or int > haste > crit > mp5 or int > mp5 > sp > haste > crit or who knows what else. Frmorrison already noted that healing is not a game of absolutes, and I'd suggest that a sound understanding of the situations in which a particular stat becomes more valuable than others is much more useful than appromixated equivalencies.
A latent appliance fetishist is someone who refuses to admit to his or herself that sexual gratification can only be achieved through the use of machines.
- L. Ron Hoover
I think somebody already pointed out that mana requirements for a straight holy spam also depend on your raid and its effective DPS. I don't think Ensidia is a good benchmark for healing statistics ashey probably have all their damage dealers playing at their maximum and thus have much less strain on the healers by virtue of shorter phases and encounters. How much mana do you think you'd need on a 5 minute thorim hard vs a 4 min Thorim hard? Ultimately, which stat you stack depends on your guild's needs as well as ability and your gearing selection will probably reflect that.
I personally would value spellpower and haste over intellect and crit to increase SS effectiveness, and make FoL a bit more viable. Currently, however, I have to stack int in order to be able to maintain a pretty prolonged HL stream with as minimal healers in the raid as possible. Otherwise my raid can't meet hard mode dps requirements.
06/15/09, 7:07 PM
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