Underground Kosmonavts killed 10man Algalon and had a new STR neck drop.

They got Strength of the Heavens (Neck - Melee.DPS) - +66 Strength, +72 Stamina, +42 Crit Rating, +36 Haste Rating, Yellow Socket (+4 Hit Bonus)

I added this into Rawr and it now ranks as the second best neck in game behind Pendulum of Infinity if you are hit and expertise capped. Looks like many of us have an upgrade to get over Favor of the Dragon Queen now

The best explanation for the discrepancy is we have different Rawr settings or you have 3 professions being used (on the sets I have listed, Inscription is checked so the optimizer would assume 3 professions). All items in the sets have linked use the 3.1.2 stats and socket bonuses.

I am ignoring Pendulum for Plate-only sets because I would think guilds would restrict agility necks for classes that benefit the most from those stats. Blizzard only said they wanted to change Leather items, not Mail. Regardless, I don't see the Leather itemization change until the next expansion.

Sure, I will add another set. The new Agalon-10 neck made making the set easy (only 18 dps below Pendulum).

Ignoring Human (3 exp with Sword/Mace and free PvP trinket) and the fact there is no ilevel 239 Mace, here are the comparisons:

BE BiS All 6626
BE BiS Plate 6520

Dwarf BiS All 6667
Dwarf BiS Plate 6547

I don't feel that the difference is enough to make an issue about, when the difference between Blood and Command was 200-400 dps.

I'm a bit surprised that it seems to be almost 'common knowledge' now that FoFF (Fury of the Five Flights) is not a good trinket for Ulduar. I've only done up to Mimiron, so can't comment on the rest of the fights, but for most of the fights it should be fine. Certainly as good as it was for Naxx anyway. Quickly skimming through the bosses in Ulduar...

Flame Leviathan - N/A
Razorscale - will drop off between waves of adds. On the plus side, with Divine Storm hitting 4 targets often, it will stack up quickly again at least.
Ignis - will drop off if player is put in the Slag Pot.
XT002 - shouldn't drop off.
Kologarn - may drop off when gripped. Divine Storm will be hitting 2-3 targets (or more if you attack adds), so it should stack quickly again.
Iron Council - may drop off between bosses depending how far apart they are tanked. Will probably drop off on Stormcaller (if you do him last) when he flies into the air.
Auriaya - shouldn't drop off.
Hodir - shouldn't drop off.
Thorim - shouldn't drop off.
Freya - shouldn't drop off.
Mimiron - will drop off between phases

Compare this to Naxx however...

Anub'rekhan - may drop off on Locust Swarm.
Faerlina - shouldn't drop off.
Maexxna - will drop off if player is web wrapped.
Noth - will drop off when he teleports and between waves of adds.
Heigan - will drop off on 'dance' phases.
Loatheb - shouldn't drop off.
Razuvious - shouldn't drop off.
Gothikk - will drop off when he teleports, and between waves of adds.
Four Horsemen - will drop off when switching targets.
Patchwerk - shouldn't drop off.
Grobbulus - may drop off when injected.
Gluth - shouldn't drop off.
Thaddius - will drop off between phases.
Sapphiron - will drop off during air phases.
Kel'Thuzad - may drop off if Mind Controlled and CCed.

It's been a while since I've done Naxx, so I may be a bit off with some of the comments there.

The worst fights for FoFF in Ulduar is Razorscale and Mimiron - the rest of them should be quite manageable. In Naxx, there seem to be a lot more fights where you will lose your stacking buff.

So I think people are either under-estimating how good FoFF is now, or they were over-estimating how good it was for Naxx. Unless I'm missing something else, in which case, apologies.

Im not sure if Exorcism can keep the duration on but that would eliminate alot of stack droppings.

Exorcism doesn't, but Hammer of Wrath does.

Gentelmen's Club just got a nice plate belt off of 10 man Algalon.


Starfall Girdle
1321 Armor
82 strength
96 stamina
Red Socket
Yellow socket
+6 str socket bonus
40 Crit
56 Expertise

Seems pretty nice, still does not look better than the Soul-devouring sinch sadly. Still slightly better than belt of the titans however, just dude to the strength to stam difference.

The BiS Alliance, BiS Plate Human, and BiS Hard Plate Human all load into Rawr 2.2.5 with Chuchu's Tiny Box of Horrors for me.

That was the one I "borrowed" ItemID of to make Dark Matter, sure it doesn't have those stats? If they don't you just need to input them: 222AP and a 612 Crit rating proc/10sec duration/15% proc chance on PhysicalHit/45sec ICD.

Something to note with that piece is that with the upcoming change to JC, the 6 str yellow socket bonus allows you to avoid using an [Enchanted Tear] to activate [Relentless Earthsiege Diamond]. Drop an [Inscribed Monarch Topaz] into the Starfall Girdle and a [Sovereign Twilight Opal] gem in your [Conqueror's Aegis Legplates], and if my napkin math is right, you come out ahead compared to using the tear.

When an item doesn't exist in either the Armory or Wowhead, I have to create it based an existing item. Someone else picked the Box of Horrors so I did as well.

Manually edit the Horrors and under custom proc, use a 50 second ICD (not 45), 15% proc rate on physical hit.

Soul-devouring is clearly better and Titans appears to be stronger in some setups. This shouldn't change any sets because Soul is still better for the hard mode sets.

+6 to all stats is a stronger gem than 8 str/12 stam.

Not even remotely close. SoB was a 10-20% DPS increase over SoC. None of the current faction advantages (1% hit, or expertise talents) is even in the same ballpark.

Compared to FOTFF or any of the proc attack power trinkets such as mirror, blood, wrathstone etc. Dark Matter's proc is especially poor. People put forth an argument for stacked trinkets reset for FOTFF when the same thing can actually hurt the other trinkets such as Blood, mirror, and wrathstone more than FOTFF (ICD on procs coupled with pulling off bosses)

I find Dark Matter to be a poor choice of a trinket because of the Crit proc. Not only do you risk having to pull off the boss and not making use of the crit buff you gain, but you also run the risk of not critting any more than you normally would or not even critting at all.

If anything Dark Matter is the worse RNG trinket in the game. The only saving grace to it is it's static attack power but If you are building a set which does not need the hit from Blood of the Old God and you are considering using this trinket I would highly recommend using Wrathstone instead for a controllable proc and Less RNG

You have Human checked and had 100% bloodlust uptime. The correct dps of your set was around 6400.

I disagree. Sure the ICD could go off, and then you have to run from fire, but the same thing could happen with Mirror and Berserking. When doing a list, you have to assume some things (in this case, that the target doesn't move).

Also the trinket could proc, and then you never crit while it is up. That is why spreadsheets/Rawr are used, they take into account the RNG of something not working. If you don't like more RNG, don't use Dark Matter.

i believe there is an mistake - soul devouring cinch is an leather item and boots of living scale is mail. so it isn't plate only anymore.

Actually there is no mistake. The mail boots are craftable for everyone and the belt is from 10-man Yogg-Saron (hard), where you don't have to follow 25-man loot rules.

Isn't the reason we traditionally use ICDs like 50sec (even though it is 45) because we calculate ~5secs for our swings to proc it because it's not 100% proc chance? But with Rawr we have the opportunity to input the 15% chance on physical hit into the table, hence removing the "need" to set it to 50.

Correct me if i am wrong but i put this through rawr, it comes to 332 hit rating, which is a mile over the cap which is 263, and also only 120 expertise rating coming out at 6,298 dps. Seems that something isn't right on that list.

i didn't said that the boots or the waist is crap. but i assume when in the headline is standing Plate only, that in the equip ist only plate and not any other typ of armor. if i am equiping leather and mail then i couldn't say plate only

For that set, you could swap to the crafted Plate boots and loss between 5-10 dps. I may change the belt to the Plate version from Agalon-10, they are nearly the same.

The point of Plate Only was there to mean only strength based items dropped in a 25-man (unless the agility/ap item isn't wanted by other classes) from bosses, so crafted items don't fail under the same rules.

It may be less confusing to stop calling it "Plate Only", and call it something like "Plate Priority", especially if you're going to leave off agi/crit necklaces/rings which actually have nothing to do with armor class. When I hear "Plate Only", I assume that you're referring to only using actual Plate gear. As much as we like to say "armor means nothing in PVE", there are several fights in Ulduar where plate armor has occasionally saved my ass when I pull aggro on adds.

If I was organizing the thread, I'd much rather see lists that were truly Plate Only (and with all necklaces/rings/cloaks in play), to get an idea of how much DPS I would really gain by wearing leather and gimping my armor/stamina. Obviously I'm not though, so whatever way you choose to do it is still interesting. But you may want to address the semantics of "Plate Only", since it seems like there's as much discussion in this thread about what you meant by that, as there is actual discussion of the lists/gear themselves.

Even though I was one of the first to suggest a plate only set, I think the varying opinions and situations of people are making this out of countrol. Perhaps it's really best just to have a single BIS set (with race specific changes). People can use Rawr/spreadsheets on their own should situations change... the optimizer in rawr is fantastic for this, because you can select only items that are available to you.

While you or I can figure out lists, there are many more that rather someone else do the work for them. I have seen this thread linked at the official forums, so there is some desire for it. In addition, I saw some raid leaders say they looked at BiS list thread here to know what items were the best (for loot councils).

The optimizer works really well for people to make lists based off what they have/will have.


I may have forgotten to update that list or upload the current file. I just uploaded it again (and added the new Agalon belt).