@HamSlammer: Does RV crit for 150% or 200% damage?
On a different note: A new PTR build is out:
Seal of Command now has an additional effect - When used with attacks or abilities that strike a single target, this additional Holy damage will strike up to 2 additional targets.
I'm not able to get on the PTR until much later this day because I have to download the patch due to stupidity again. However, it would be interesting to confirm if it still cleaves as mentioned earlier in this thread (i.e. in a single line with no jumping back to other targets)
And some interesting profession additions, especially for 10-man raids:
Inscription
* Runescroll of Stamina - Snowfall Ink, Resilient Parchment x 5 - Increases Stamina by 165 for all party and raid members for 1 hr.
Leatherworking
* Drums of Forgotten Kings - Heavy Borean Leather x 8, Icy Dragonscale x 8 - Gives all members of the raid or group the Blessing of Forgotten Kings, increasing total stats by 8% for 30 min.
* Drums of the Wild - Heavy Borean Leather x 4, Jormungar Scale x 20 - Gives the Gift of the Wild to all party and raid members, increasing armor by 750, all attributes by 37 and all resistances by 54 for 1 hr.
Can anybody confirm how these things work exactly? I haven't found much information on them yet:
Do they require a certain profession level to use them or are they available to anybody? Are they permanents with cooldown (e.g. Endless Potions) or consumeables (like the Drums in BC)?
The data in the MMO-C database seem to indicate that they're one-time consumeables with no profession restriction, but confirmation would be appreciated.
@HamSlammer: Does RV crit for 150% or 200% damage?
It crits for 2x damage.
Originally Posted by Angel of Wrath
I'm not able to get on the PTR until much later this day because I have to download the patch due to stupidity again. However, it would be interesting to confirm if it still cleaves as mentioned earlier in this thread (i.e. in a single line with no jumping back to other targets)
The change just makes Command procs from Divine Storm not cleave. DS will proc the initial hit, but not the additional 2 hits. It is impossible for a singular Command proc to "double-back" to a target. It cleaves in a line fashion, based on my previous testing.
@HamSlammer: Does RV crit for 150% or 200% damage?
On a different note: A new PTR build is out:
I'm not able to get on the PTR until much later this day because I have to download the patch due to stupidity again. However, it would be interesting to confirm if it still cleaves as mentioned earlier in this thread (i.e. in a single line with no jumping back to other targets)
And some interesting profession additions, especially for 10-man raids:
Can anybody confirm how these things work exactly? I haven't found much information on them yet:
Do they require a certain profession level to use them or are they available to anybody? Are they permanents with cooldown (e.g. Endless Potions) or consumeables (like the Drums in BC)?
The data in the MMO-C database seem to indicate that they're one-time consumeables with no profession restriction, but confirmation would be appreciated.
Looks like these are intended to cover for those times where you're missing the appropriate class in your 5/10man.
Power Word: Fortitude (Priests)
Blessing of Kings (Paladin)
Gift of the Wild (Druids)
All of these 3 are very potent buffs and are "unique" in the sense that only one class/spec can provide them, as opposed to pretty much all the other buffs being available by 2 or more classes/specs. It looks as blizzard is covering the gap in providing slightly lesser versions of those buffs via professions.
-> It's unlikely the profession buffs will stack with the better class ones.
There's likely also going to be a Intellect buff somewhere (a tailoring thing would be my guess). And I'm going to guess there's also going to be a lesser heroism/bloodlust somewhere too.
Can anybody confirm how these things work exactly? I haven't found much information on them yet:
Do they require a certain profession level to use them or are they available to anybody? Are they permanents with cooldown (e.g. Endless Potions) or consumeables (like the Drums in BC)?
The data in the MMO-C database seem to indicate that they're one-time consumeables with no profession restriction, but confirmation would be appreciated.
Has anyone actually put in a ticket or started a post on the offical site to see if the 4% RV rit chance is bugged or working as intended?
If it is 4%, how much does this lower the damage being shown in spreadsheets and rawr for the 2pc bonus?
Although GM's rarely know much about game mechanics, they do have a list of known bugs. Could anyone try making a GM ticket for this and see what the response is? (my realm is in extended maintenance)
If I load my ret BiS list (9527 dps, using DMC:G and death's choice), not taking RV in the talents lowers the DPS to 8638.
So RV with 48% crit equals 889 DPS. With 5% crit, this would be 630 DPS.
So 2pc t9 is about 30 dps upgrade.
If we use the assumption that RV crits for double at a rate of 1/10th normal crit (as opposed to a flat rate), in my current gear the 2 piece bonus is worth about 20DPS or 0.2% total DPS. In high tier 9 level gear it goes to 28 DPS and about 0.3% total DPS.
If it crits for double at normal crit rate then in my current it's worth 358DPS or 4.2% total DPS and in T9 it is worth 484DPS 5.6% total DPS.
Assuming a flat 4% would be worth slightly less (as raid buffed we're often closer to 50%, or 5% for RVsuckage).
Previous comparisons at 3-3.5% was assuming crit at 150% damage (spell vs. melee), knowing it's 200% improves it if and only if it has the correct crit rate. 4-5% crit rate on an ability that only occurs when special attacks crit is pathetic.
In short, at the current rate 2-piece bonus is crap. It appears that you lose more breaking T8 4-piece than you gain with T9 2-piece. Hope for a fix or plan to stick with 4 T8 until 4-piece T9.
Rock: "We're sub-standard DPS. Nerf Paper, Scissors are fine."
Paper: "OMG, WTF, Scissors!"
Scissors: "Rock is OP and Paper are QQers. We need PvP buffs."
With this "bug" (boy do I hope it's a bug...), has anyone posted yet on the official forums? I'm not actually sure if blizzard is aware of it, but it certainly seems like something that would be hotfixable.
At an estimated 20 dps value, it's probably the most pathetic bonus in DPS history.
Formally Xyrm/Zurm, the Ret Pally. Now playing my rogue, Zyrm, more casually with RL friends.
With this "bug" (boy do I hope it's a bug...), has anyone posted yet on the official forums? I'm not actually sure if blizzard is aware of it, but it certainly seems like something that would be hotfixable.
At an estimated 20 dps value, it's probably the most pathetic bonus in DPS history.
How about the ret T6 4 piece? If you used it you lost DPS. They have to go along way to get another negative DPS set bonus.
I decided to test the 2 piece t9 bonus by buying the 10 man shoulders and gloves. The proc rate appears to be incredibly low or, not even proccing at all.
How about the ret T6 4 piece? If you used it you lost DPS. They have to go along way to get another negative DPS set bonus.
It was a dps increase once HoW was made instant in 3.0. In addition, the set bonus was great in PvP even with the cast time.
Now that someone posted a screenshot, it would be good to post it in the official bug forums and damage dealing forums.
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
Does that screenshot show the crit rate? I don't even see it there.
The crit rate is 4% (does not change). The screenshot only had 150ish tics, so that doesn't prove the 4% rate, but it does prove the set bonus is not using your melee crit rate.
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
I decided to test the 2 piece t9 bonus by buying the 10 man shoulders and gloves. The proc rate appears to be incredibly low or, not even proccing at all.
Let's hope this is a bug.
Did you simply fail to read the posts above yours? C'mon.
And to the others asking, yes, I posted a [Bug] Thread on the Damage Dealing Forums -and- the Bug Report Forums, we'll see if they actually do anything about it, or even bother to respond.
Using a low level weapon to minimise weapon damage range, removed libram + trinkets for constant ap during testing.
Character sheet weapon range = 1011 - 1019, 1015 average
With HV @ 5, SoV proc average non-crit = 385
385 / 1015 = 37.9%, as one would expect with 5/5 seals of the pure.
As soon as another paladin puts a single stack of HV up on the dummy, proc drops down to average of 77.
77 / 1015 = 7.6%, as one would expect with 5/5 seals of the pure and a 1 stack of HV.
With my 5 stack and the other paladin's 2 stack, proc is 154.
154 / 1015 = 15.2%, as one would expect with 5/5 seals of the pure and a 2 stack of HV.
The effects are that paladin tanks will see less threat than they should until all ret paladins in their raid have got 5 stacks of HV on the mob being tanked, but perhaps more severe, if a prot paladin's tanking adds on an encounter but happens to hit the boss with hammer of the righteous from time to time and leave a HV stack on the boss of less than 5, they're gimping the retpaladin's damage quite a bit until the lower HV stack falls off. I know I'm guilty of doing this on Ignis and XT-hard if I'm tanking adds, and no doubt it probably happens on Yogg p3 and Lord Jaraxus.
This was done with 39.2% paperdoll Melee Crit chance along with almost 100% uptime for Heart of the Crusader on both level 80 dummies. There was no other debuffs present on the dummies for the entirety of this test. I only had my owning buffs; Seal of Vengeance, Might, Devotion Aura, and Sense Undead.
I just got the tier 9 two set bonus and from what I've seen so far it does not mean your RV has a chance equal to your melee critrate to crit.
After doing Auriaya and XT-002 with about 100 ticks each, only 3-4% was a critical strike.
I later tried it on a target dummy and only 4 out of 52 ticks critted.
Don't know if this already has been covered but if it is supposed to be this way then the set bonus sucks beyond oblivion.
*Did another test just now, 84 ticks, 4 crits.
Edit; Seems like I'm beaten to it, but at least i can confirm it.
Looks like these are intended to cover for those times where you're missing the appropriate class in your 5/10man.
Power Word: Fortitude (Priests)
Blessing of Kings (Paladin)
Gift of the Wild (Druids)
All of these 3 are very potent buffs and are "unique" in the sense that only one class/spec can provide them, as opposed to pretty much all the other buffs being available by 2 or more classes/specs. It looks as blizzard is covering the gap in providing slightly lesser versions of those buffs via professions.
-> It's unlikely the profession buffs will stack with the better class ones.
There's likely also going to be a Intellect buff somewhere (a tailoring thing would be my guess). And I'm going to guess there's also going to be a lesser heroism/bloodlust somewhere too.
I went to blizzcon they stated that they are working on a heroism/bloodlust type consumable item, where you could do a less powerful bloodlust without needing a shaman. I think the logic is more towards letting groups feel they dont' need a paladin, druid, priest, and shaman to do a 10 man/25 man instance. Directly hurts Rets and paladins as kings is a very unique blessings and 8% stats vs 10% stats is somewhat marginal.
It's like they are now outscorcing out jobs to scrolls and consumables. And it will only force people to bring more "things" rather than a diverse raid.
I was doing the math in the latest version of Rawr and despite having a few pieces of Valorous T8.0 that I use for my 4 set bonus, it doesn't seem that the new 10man ilevel 232 gear pulls forward. I hope that this question doesn't come across wrong, but I was just curious as to what items you are planning to buy with your badges. I just don't see any item that will be a huge upgrade for me, without dropping the 4 piece. This is my idea...
1) New libram (got already)
2) New str/hit ring (also got already)
3) Crusader orbs for bracers? I'm thinking that I'll save for the Boe bracers, despite them not yet dropped on my server. (at 28 now)
4) save the remaining for 245 T9 idols.
Any thoughts? I'm not asking you to look at my character, more just discuss what your plans are for your badges.
I was doing the math in the latest version of Rawr and despite having a few pieces of Valorous T8.0 that I use for my 4 set bonus, it doesn't seem that the new 10man ilevel 232 gear pulls forward.
Assuming you had the 4 piece T8, that means one slot can be T9. The helm is an easy upgrade (just more stats). With the 2 piece not working properly, I guess that limits upgrades.
I am not sure crusader orbs are buy-able yet, I recall that was supposed to be in the Onynia patch.
Millions of words are written annually purporting to tell how to beat the races, whereas the best possible advice on the subject is found in the three monosyllables: 'Do not try.'
After determining that SoV procs will always use the smallest HV stack on a mob to calculate their damage, I decided to see if the same was true with damage from JoV, and it turns out to be the opposite case.
If paladin A has a 5 stack, and paladin B has a 1 stack, the SoV proc damage for both paladins will be calculated as if they both have a 1 stack, while the JoV damage for both paladins will be calculated as if they both have a 5 stack.
The testing was as follows:
I first tested what my judgement of vengeance was hitting for when I was hitting the dummy myself:
1,028 / 686 = 49.9% so that's all working as expected, 10% extra per stack.
Another paladin kept a 1 stack of HV on the same dummy whilst I kept a 5 stack up, and my judgements still hit for 1,028 damage, unlike with the SoV proc case.
I then didn't attack the dummy at all, and the other paladin kept a 5 stack up. My judgements still hit for the 5 stack value of 1,028 damage. Then I put a 1 stack of my own up with the other paladin keeping 5 stack, and still my judgements hit for 1,028 damage. The other paladin then put a 4 stack up, and I put a 2 stack up, and my judgements hit for 960 damage.
After determining that SoV procs will always use the smallest HV stack on a mob to calculate their damage, I decided to see if the same was true with damage from JoV, and it turns out to be the opposite case.
If paladin A has a 5 stack, and paladin B has a 1 stack, the SoV proc damage for both paladins will be calculated as if they both have a 1 stack, while the JoV damage for both paladins will be calculated as if they both have a 5 stack.
The testing was as follows:
I first tested what my judgement of vengeance was hitting for when I was hitting the dummy myself:
1,028 / 686 = 49.9% so that's all working as expected, 10% extra per stack.
Another paladin kept a 1 stack of HV on the same dummy whilst I kept a 5 stack up, and my judgements still hit for 1,028 damage, unlike with the SoV proc case.
I then didn't attack the dummy at all, and the other paladin kept a 5 stack up. My judgements still hit for the 5 stack value of 1,028 damage. Then I put a 1 stack of my own up with the other paladin keeping 5 stack, and still my judgements hit for 1,028 damage. The other paladin then put a 4 stack up, and I put a 2 stack up, and my judgements hit for 960 damage.
Arikah and I posted aboout these very "strange" effects of Sov a few weeks ago, and more of the community is actually testing to see why the range of the not only the seal but the judgement is so wide. Also as too how it is interacting when there is a prot paladin tanking compared to a dk or warrior, etc.
On another note I'd like to point out that we are not the only class who seems to have an issue with proc rates when it comes to our two piece t9- 9.5 set bonus. Rogues are refusing to break there 4 t8-t8.5 piece bonus becuas3 it seems there T9 is at an even lower rate than ours(2% last I checked).
What is our two piece t9 based on? Is it a proc rate like our libram and trinket? and if so, is tier 9 realistically a complete waste of time, and an utter dps lose?
08/26/09, 3:00 AM
Similar Threads
