I believe Righteous Vengeance procs motes, so that's why crits seem to generate more motes.

As Don pointed out Drums of Speed does not stack with itself, but it does stack with Aspect of the Pack.

I picked up engineering and it is a noticable dps increase over BS, but the perk of Battle Chicken Squawk doesn't seem to work.
I tried it a few times, and got 15 Chicken Fury and 0 Squawks, but the Squawk buff did show up in WoL, so that implies to doesn't stack with WF.

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis


I tried it solo outside other buffs, and it worked properly there.

Hotfix maybe? I know that we have had windfury and battle squawk at the same time, but to be honest I have noticed that I haven't gotten many battle squawk buffs in the last two days of raiding.

Yeah, it was definitely hot fixed. 34 attempts of LK heroic and every single one of the chicken casts was the self-enrage.

If you didn't have WF or Icy Talons, the pet would be useful, it can still do the buff.
I guess the extra damage from the pet isn't horrible (ranged from 600 to 1000) damage. All but two bosses have parry haste off (just Deathwhisper and the ice Dragon can parry), so worrying about the chicken attacks causing parry haste is a non-issue. I am not sure that Might affects Guardian pets.

The chicken can be buffed, but I wouldn't expect much of a DPS increase - with a lvl 84 chicken and BoM, the standard damage against a boss doll increased from 1-2 damage to 3-4 damage. I didn't compare the damage unbuffed with Chicken Fury on, but with BoM it was around 65. Buffing won't get you much milage out of the chicken.

On another note:
Are there any useful macros for grenades we could use?

I don't think having a macro would be ideal. Since bombs are affected by Avenging Wrath, using them with wings up is intuitively the best thing to do. If you break down fight length, when adds come out, and other things...you'd be running around with a few macros for different fights and that just seems silly to me. Having a separate bind and tracking them yourself saves more space and gives you more options.

Since Saronite bombs require you to target the area where you want it to hit, you cannot make a macro to use them automatically.

However, you can train Goblin Engineering to get a instant cast no targeting Global Thermal Sapper Charge that does double the Saronite bomb (but has self damage and a 6 min cooldown). So you could make a macro /castsequence reset=300 Global Thermal Sapper Charge, Saronite Bomb, Saronite Bomb, Saronite Bomb, Saronite Bomb

Since you keep the Battle chicken after swapping (not that the chicken is that useful, but is fun to use. You cannot keep the X-ray specs), I will likely pay the 150g to swap to Goblin (2k self damage isn't bad).
In addition you get the Goblin Bomb Dispenser trinket, which summons a bomb pet that blows up for at least 600 damage (damage scales with Engineering level).

Just for clarification, the Global Thermal Sapper Charge has a 5 minute cooldown (you put 300 seconds correctly though). Also, that macro will only cast each item once in a span of 5 minutes. The correct macro would be something like this:

Furthermore, the bombs hit harder than I expected. As you can see from my damage done here on Festergut last night, they hit harder than the 1k and 2k I read earlier in this thread for the saronite bomb and Global thermal charge. Now I just need to remember to keep hitting that macro to keep using the bombs on CD.

Also as clarification, the Global Thermal Sapper Charge is NOT a floor-targeted mechanic, it's a radius around your character. The saronite bombs, however, are a fairly large 8-10yd radius explosion, so they are easy enough to target (I pretty much blindly clicked at some points and still hit the boss).

Glutton gave me info to model the bombs in my spreadsheet. According to him they appear to scale with Crusade, Curse of Elements/Ebon Plague, Sanct Ret, and ICC Aura. Reduced by partial resists occur, of course.

That means no aura the bomb averages nearly 1500 a hit (instead of 1325) and Sapper bout 2825 (instead of 2500). The aura in ICC will cause it to continue to scale.

Using Sapper with AW and Bombs the other 4 minutes (with AW where they coincide) it's around 36 DPS from bombs. Doesn't vary much with shorter/longer fights (Sapper up again, or you lose a non-AW bomb, etc). Again with the warning that players with latency/clickers or other difficulties could actually lose attacks during the target/throw of the Saronite (which, as Zurm said, should be able to done almost wildly). If you lose an entire attack over the course of the fight it could be more than an individual bomb - stress on If and Could.

Now that they've seemed to nerf the Battle Squawk would the Arcanite Dragonling or another trinket pet be better to pop before the beginning of the fight? If the Battle Chicken is still stronger you'd at least be able to pop the Arcanite Dragonling when the Battle Chicken is on cooldown. I was going to try to test this but it seems that you need to either farm a low drop rate or be lucky with your Wormhole to buy the pattern.

Also I'm leveling a caster alt. Would he be able to use Saronite Bombs the same way melee does? I doubt it but I thought better safe than sorry so I'm asking.

Thanks for the answers. I like to get the most out of what I have :P

The dragons are even worse than the Battle Chicken, since they are level capped at a lower level. The battle chicken at least levels up with skill so it at least can hit the boss even if it is a for small amounts of damage.

Casters can use bombs just like Ret uses them (bombs have a 45 yard range), just use the bomb during the spell GCD from casting an instant cast spell.

Hi I have never been able to get rawr or spreadsheets to work ever, but i was wondering how the priority of different spells changes depending on number of mobs you expect to hit (using Seal of Command). I never really worried about it before but rotation is a bit more important now with LK 25 valk phase. Is there a different priority if ur attacking 2 3 or 4+ mobs.
Thanks

I merely made an "action usable" Power Aura and use it sometimes, most of the time I can see the proc light up my DS on my action bars but for other fights where I cannot just stand there and stare at my bars I turn on the Power Aura for it. I've been considering using CLCret for that sole reason.

Furthermore CLCRet recognizes the Procc and implements it correctly in your rotation. When I must use a lower DPS Skill like Cons or Exo I allways press both keys and my key for DS a bit faster than the key from the lower priority ability which works greatly for myself.

BTT: Did anyone check if you can cleave the Vile Spirits with your bombs in LK P3?

I wasn't able to use Saronite Bombs on Vile Spirits while they were still in the air tonight.

Me neither, though when I jumped and used the Global Sapper charge I did see two hits on MSBT (arthas + ?) so I assume that means I clipped one.

I have a question concerning Professor Putricide Hard Mode. My guild exhausted its' attempts this past reset, and our main issue seems to be when the Oozes and Gases spawn we aren't killing them fast enough. I've watched Xyrm's video and he uses SoV throughout, but it seems his guild has no issues killing the gases quickly. I've also looked at some parses from some other top Ret's on WMO, and they all seem to use SoV throughout the entire fight.

My question: if I were to glyph for SoR to maximize my quick burst on these add spawns, I would presumably increase my burst damage to the oozes, but my sustained to Putricide will go down before P3 starts. I've found seal twisting trying to go from SoV to SoR/SoC makes me go Oom fairly quickly on this fight. What amount of DPS loss am I likely to lose by using a glyphed SoR throughout P1 and P2 instead of SoV? I realize my Damage to PP will be lower than if I were using SoV, but by how much? I want to know if it is 'worth it' to use SoR to help kill the adds quicker. Am I way off base thinking this way to help get the adds down quicker?

If you swap to SoR will an add die faster than about 12 seconds (call it 14 seconds if you glyph SoR)?
Yes - then it is at least marginally superior for that timeperiod.
No - SoV would be superior at all times.

For extent of DPS loss on Putricide, use the tools: Rawr or spreadsheets.

As Exemplar pointed out, the adds often lived for ~15+ seconds. According to Rawr, SoV vs SoR breakpoint is 10.66 seconds in my gear, so SoV wins. I too have found that swapping seals constantly is not realistic.

Ultimately Professor Putricide is just not a good fight for Retribution paladins. If your guild is extremely coordinated and people are dead-on about add positioning, you can get away with not even letting SoV drop on Putricide and seeing 9.5k+ dps. Unfortunately that isn't the case in my guild, and as you saw in the video it is often the case that I lose my stack due to ooze positions (although one stack drop was my fault because I got myself knocked in the wrong direction).

That being said, ooze killing really falls more on the shoulders of arcane mages and hunters who are fantastic at target swaps. If you watch my video carefully, you can see that on the gas clouds (orange oozes) our ranged DPS are able to DPS the second it becomes targetable, and often the mob is at 50% before the melee can touch it (after it picks a target and casts gaseous bloat).

An updated version of my spreadsheet is available - links are available in the OP.

Major updates:
ICC Buff modeling
Shadowmourne proc modeling (with toggleable cancelaura)
Engineering bombs modeled (under Consumables)
Bugfixes and item updates (mostly Blizz socket corrections).