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Old 05/13/12, 2:44 AM   #106
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
Tested SS on PTR now. Mastery 49.5%, sp 12.2k, 16%crit
PoH w/o SS heal for 14.6k and make aegis for 6.5k. Its 17,7k average with 84% chance
Crit will heal for 30k and make aegis for 26k. Its 9k average with 16% chance.
Totally I expect to get 17.7+9=26.7k average. Thats a number I expect to get from SS.
But.
When I trigger SS up, my PoH make a 32.6k absorb. And I think formula here is different.

And for example, if target has 3grace stacks and Power Torrent proc, you can make 115k(GH)+87k(FH)+51k(Heal)+62k(PWS)+45k(PoH)=360k absorb on ONE target. Impale? Wtf is impale? =)
This is insane

P.S. Inner Focus doesnt work with SS

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Old 05/13/12, 5:22 AM   #107
Havoc12
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Silvermoon (EU)
New hunter pet ability:

Water Strider

Still Water New: Infuses all party and raid members within vision with still water, increasing their spell power by 10% and their critical strike chance by 5% for 60 min. Instant.
Crit buff is back it seems.

Servers are down. When they are back I will go and see what the exact formula is for the scaling.

Based on what GC said I expect that the formula is

Base*(1+mastery)*(1+crit). So SS will scale a lot more with mastery and crit than your normal heals.

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Old 05/13/12, 9:27 AM   #108
Havoc12
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Silvermoon (EU)
Lvl 88 values for Gheal (without grace), so its going be much smaller than level 85

Base 47149
Spirit shell 66372
crit 7.92
mastery 27.41
haste 7.18

1.0792*1.2741*47149 = 64 830

66372/64830 = 1.02379 is the missing factor

The lvl 85 version of my char

base = 45977
Spirit Shell = 76214
crit = 6.69
Mastery = 36.86
Haste = 16.66

1.0669*1.3686*45977 = 67 134

76214/67134 = 1.13525 is the missing factor.

Now lets try something different.

Crit averaged heal = base*[1+(1+0.6*(1+mastery))*crit]

For the level 88 version --> Crit averaged heal = 54 045.6

Apply mastery directly to that and you get 54 045.6*1.2741 = 68860 we expect 66372

66372/68860 = 0.96386871914

For the level 85 version --> Crit averaged heal = 51 578.6

apply mastery directly: 51 578.6*1.3686 = 70 590.5 we expect 76214

76214/70590.5 = 1.079663694123

So this isn't it either but its closer. It appears though that high mastery produces more a deviation, so mastery is double dipping somewhere. I will try a few more things later on.

Incidentally for PoH @ lvl 88 I get a 25813 spirit shell without grace and 33577 with grace. So PoH spirit shell benefits from grace just like normal PoH does, whereas in the previous form of spirit shell it ignored grace.

My gut feeling is that the amount of the absorb with some form of crit scaling is calculated first and then mastery is directly applied to it.

Last edited by Havoc12 : 05/13/12 at 9:48 AM.

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Old 05/13/12, 4:59 PM   #109
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
I discovered exact formula for SS
For Direct Heals:
SS_Absorb=AvgHeal*(1+Crit)*(1+Mastery)*(1+0,3*Crit)
For PoH:
SS_Absorb=AvgHeal*(1+Crit)*(1+Mastery)*1.3

Last edited by Szeretlek : 05/13/12 at 5:09 PM.

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Old 05/13/12, 5:29 PM   #110
Havoc12
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Silvermoon (EU)
Originally Posted by Szeretlek View Post
I discovered exact formula for SS
For Direct Heals:
SS_Absorb=AvgHeal*(1+Crit)*(1+Mastery)*(1+0,3*Crit)
For PoH:
SS_Absorb=AvgHeal*(1+Crit)*(1+Mastery)*1.3
This works for my level 88 values, but not for my lvl 85 values.

1.0669*1.3686*45977 = 67134


67134*(1+0.3*0.0669) = 68481.4, but the value I actually get is 76214.

I am going to use reforging to change my crit and mastery and plot all the values so we can work out exactly how they all vary.

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Old 05/13/12, 9:18 PM   #111
Havoc12
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Silvermoon (EU)
Level 85: Mastery 36.86 -- Base heal (greater Heal) 45977

Crit 6.69 --> 76214
Crit 8.71 --> 77988
Crit 10.11 --> 79230
Crit 11.05 --> 80071


Plotting SS-gheal absorb vs SS gives us a straight line with equation: y = 88430x + 70293

A straight line probably means that equation AvgHeal*(1+Crit)*(1+Mastery)*(1+0,3*Crit) is not correct, as that would give a function which is 2nd order in Crit and the plot would not be a straight line.


Looking at mastery

0.438 79603
0.3686 76214
0.339 74568
0.3152 73240
0.2997 71946

Does not appear to be linear

Line of best fit is polynomial with n=2: y = -97223x^2 + 126220x + 42957.

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Old 05/14/12, 1:42 AM   #112
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
Ok, I will provide the way, how you can calculate it properly to be sure, that formula is 100% legit.
Take off weapon, cloak and trinket that can proc with Lightweave, Power Torrent or something.
Look at your tooltip of any of heals. For example FH:

Then look at your stats:

Make some calculations
SS=29348 (AvgHeal from tooltip) *(1+0.1609) (Crit) *(1+0.3785) (Mastery) *(1+0.3*0.1609) (Aegis Part) =
29348*1.1609*1.3785*(1+0.3*0.1609)=49233

Then turn on SS and cast that heal once.


Voila

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Old 05/14/12, 7:42 AM   #113
Havoc12
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Silvermoon (EU)
Hmmm, this is very odd. The values I posted from my level 85 priest are not with power torrent or grace and the formula does not work for them....

Level 85: Mastery 36.86 -- Base heal (greater Heal) 45977

Crit 6.69 --> 76214
Crit 8.71 --> 77988
Crit 10.11 --> 79230
Crit 11.05 --> 80071


Crit 6.69 --> 45977*(1+0.0669)*(1+0.3686)*(1+0.3*0.0669) = 68481.12026 --> Expect 76214

Crit 8.71 --> 45977*(1+0.0871)*(1+0.3686)*(1+0.3*0.0871) = 70192.2310 --> Expect 77988

Crit 10.11 --> 45977*(1+0.1011)*(1+0.3686)*(1+0.3*0.1011) = 71387.18778 --> expect 79230

Also I get a straight line, but when I vary mastery I don't. When I get home I will go repeat this with my level 88 priest, to see if its the same.
========

Edit: If I plot the values from your formula I get

y = 84954x + 62796
R² = 1

So the crit range I am testing is not large enough to make the plot deviate significantly from linearity.

However we have an easy way to test the formula. The y intercept should be base*(1+mastery). So 45977*(1+0.3686) = 62924.1222

This does not match intercept from lvl 85 values. There may be some anomaly that I missed with my level 85 priest.

The 1st derivative with crit of your formula is base*(1.3+0.6crit)(1+mastery). For 0.1011 crit this is 85618.33611

From plotting my values I expect 89468.

So neither the slope nor the intercept match. However if there is some anomaly giving me a fixed boost to the absorb everywhere, both the intercept and the slope should deviate by the same factor.

89468/85618.33611 = 1.044963078

70293/62924.1222 = 1.11710736

So that is not true either. That means the anomaly is not because there is some fixed constant factor affecting the results. Its clearly following a different formula.

Last edited by Havoc12 : 05/14/12 at 8:48 AM.

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Old 05/14/12, 9:44 AM   #114
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
Its clearly following a different formula.
Noway. I tested it with various crit and mastery rating via reforge haste to something. And always have results with ±1 precision.
I dont know why its so different for you and me. We need 3rd person to check that all.

Just checked it with various stats for GH (always checked for FH before) and formula above is right for GH too. So definitely you make mistake somewhere. All we need - to find it.

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Old 05/14/12, 12:54 PM   #115
Havoc12
King Hippo
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Silvermoon (EU)
Checked again. I am getting 76-80k Gheal absorbs on my level 85 priest based on crit. For my level 88 priest it works as your formula suggests.

Here is an image

The formula could work well fortuitously if the relationship between mastery and crit is close to an integer, but more likely something is bugged on my level 85 priest. I am going to go and try with reforging with the 88 priest to see if I have the same problem.

Edit: Hmmm I just noticed something. This is the melee tab.... I may have been looking at the melee tab for crit and mastery on the 85 priest..... I will check it

LOL crit is 20.04%, with that the value base*(1+crit)*(1+mastery)*(1+0.3*crit) comes to 80 075.22736016747

Last edited by Havoc12 : 05/14/12 at 5:00 PM.

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Old 05/24/12, 9:00 AM   #116
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
Spirit Shell was changed in last build. Now, when you trigger it up, you dont lose ability to heal and generate Aegis (bug?), but all heals additionaly stack buff "Spirit Shell" on their target. Which stacks to 60% of your max hp!!!

Now it is more overpowered then ever before. I think heal part will be removed, because Disc Priest just have tremendous amount of heal for 15sec every 60sec. But you cant stack 400k absorb on one target (but who really thought that was not broken mechanic?)
Formula seems unchanged.

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Old 05/24/12, 9:20 AM   #117
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
And regen formula changed too.
OOC_Regen=2000+Spirit*1,1286987
IC_Regen=2000+Spirit*1,1286987*%Meditation

That means, that if you are naked, you have 2056 mp5 IC_Regen as Disc (199 Spirit), and if you are geared like a king, you have 2791 mp5 as Disc (2805 Spirit). Plus Rapture ofc. But anyway, Blizzard just can make Meditation for Disc 0% because difference between 2056 and 2791 not so big -_-

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Old 05/28/12, 2:04 PM   #118
Perkeyone
Von Kaiser
 
Human Priest
 
Emerald Dream
Given the addition of penance into the list of spells that work with atonement, and the buff to the damage dealt by penance, what is the optimal usage of the spells holy fire, smite, and penance? Penance and holy fire are both on 10 second cooldowns. Holy fire can be made instant via a glyph. The dot left behind by holy fire lasts 7 seconds and, when glyphed, increases smite damage 20 percent.

At first glance, It seems like the best usage would be...
Holy Fire > Smite (with holyfire debuff) > Penance > Smite

And as an opener, it might be a good idea to penance first and then holy fire just to build up evangelism stacks quickly.
What do you guys think?

Also on a side note, greater heal seems to have been buffed greatly on beta. With archangel, my trinket, etc, I can crit heal for roughly my full hp ~140k, which is at least 30% more than I can recall doing on live. Perhaps I am mistaken.

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Old 05/28/12, 3:15 PM   #119
Szeretlek
Piston Honda
 
Troll Priest
 
Термоштепсель (EU)
Also on a side note, greater heal seems to have been buffed greatly on beta. With archangel, my trinket, etc, I can crit heal for roughly my full hp ~140k, which is at least 30% more than I can recall doing on live. Perhaps I am mistaken.
All heals was buffed by ~40% long ago.

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Old 06/05/12, 10:51 AM   #120
Polopretress
Von Kaiser
 
Gnome Priest
 
Suramar (EU)
At first glance, It seems like the best usage would be...
Holy Fire > Smite (with holyfire debuff) > Penance > Smite

And as an opener, it might be a good idea to penance first and then holy fire just to build up evangelism stacks quickly.
What do you guys think?
I think penance/holy fire/smite ... is better for stacking/manacost/easier gameplay/efficiency of smite dps.

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