The answers to most of your questions are in the first page... Also, be worth your wild to do a search in the thread and notice the same topic between the ZA item and T4 has come up before.
Constantius thinks the ZA one is better, though some of us think the meta makes up for it making T4 better. Eitherway, the Cowl of the Avatar is absolutely better. And how far progressed is your guild? any guild capable of taking down Vashj is certainly capable of Teron Gorefiend which has an even better hood. [Cowl of Benevolence]
Also, your role and main job can matter. For example, if you primarily heal the tank, then Cowl of the Avatar might be worth it just to pick up/keep the 2 piece bonus .
I've been following this thread relatively closely and recently came up with a dilemma. A guild I am associated with have priests that just stacks nothing but +healing. Right now they are 2/6 in sunwell with just a Brut kill last week. This is the priest's stats
2539 +healing, 484 spirit. He usually requires innervate 3 minute into brutallus fight, and by the end, if not earlier, goes completely out of mana. This is an issue to me since I don't recall priests that I actually raid with ever had that much mana problem on Brutallus even on the first kill.
Is gemming spirit that much of a deal, or is he just not using his healing spells and cooldowns appropriately?
I uhm, can't even fathom how his spirit is that low unless he is undergeared without gems. I've gemmed most of my T6 gear with nothing but +22 healing, and I still had/have over 600 spirit.
It sounds like he's lacking just gear overall.... intellect, spirit, metagem, mp5. It does however also depends on your strategy. When we don't have Resto shamans in the raid (QQ), I end up splitting greater heals with circle of heals and that consumes a lot of my mana, I tend to get an innervate for such things. But it really depends.
I uhm, can't even fathom how his spirit is that low unless he is undergeared without gems. I've gemmed most of my T6 gear with nothing but +22 healing, and I still had/have over 600 spirit.
It sounds like he's lacking just gear overall.... intellect, spirit, metagem, mp5. It does however also depends on your strategy. When we don't have Resto shamans in the raid (QQ), I end up splitting greater heals with circle of heals and that consumes a lot of my mana, I tend to get an innervate for such things. But it really depends.
The game isn't that tightly tuned, not even Sunwell. They can probably downrank whatever they're spamming and they will be fine. If they're on tank healing, one lower rank won't even be noticeable; and if they're on meteor slashes, they should be doing fine anyway. I believe he's just spamming highest rank Gheals, or flash heals, full time; or overhealing a lot with coh. Realistically, you just can't run out of mana simply by spamming coh as necessary in 6 minutes if you are getting an innervate; not if you have the gear to heal Kalecgos.
The game isn't that tightly tuned, not even Sunwell. They can probably downrank whatever they're spamming and they will be fine. If they're on tank healing, one lower rank won't even be noticeable; and if they're on meteor slashes, they should be doing fine anyway. I believe he's just spamming highest rank Gheals, or flash heals, full time; or overhealing a lot with coh. Realistically, you just can't run out of mana simply by spamming coh as necessary in 6 minutes if you are getting an innervate; not if you have the gear to heal Kalecgos.
Yep, basically he spams GH5 nonstop, no matter the circumstance, on Brut because of the tank deaths they've had.
Since they actually killed Brut, its not a huge deal as that healing style works, but im just paranoid that tanks will die when the druid is unable to give him an innervate due to various constraints. Not to mention I don't feel it is the most efficient way of tackling this.
Maybe just suggest that he should socket some Purified (11 healing, 5 Spirit ) or Sparkling (10 Spirit) gems and switching his meta over to insightful once he has appropriate sockets to meet it. Also, what trinkets is he using, and is he using them correctly? To meet the meta he -may- have to socket 11healing 5int or 10 spell haste, being in SWP, the spellhaste is probably the better deal.
The spirit gem suggestion would be even better if he is Human, 10 Spirit gems are 12.5 Spirit gems.
And ya, my priest in t5/6 content has 800 Buffed Spirit..... so that's like.... double.....
Edit - I don't exactly mean resocketing his already socketed gear, but to either socket new pieces accordingly, or even save older pieces to resocket / mp5 oriented pieces to switch in for the fights he seems to be having trouble on.
484 spirit unbuffed is actually not uncommon, especially for non-humans. It seems more an issue of the fact that he's spamming GH5 throughout the entire fight more than anything else - I'm not sure that's sustainable without a SPriest or an innervate even if you were gemmed for spirit. The meta choice is definitely a poor one, since the IED far exceeds the Bracing Earthstorm in terms of stat value. It'd probably be pretty easy for him to switch over to the IED and regem for the bonus without taking a huge loss to his +heal.
That said, if you want to stack for throughput, you're much better off stacking haste instead. I used to stack +heal for a long time, and after having played with haste-stacking for a significant amount of time now, I wouldn't ever go back.
Yep, basically he spams GH5 nonstop, no matter the circumstance, on Brut because of the tank deaths they've had.
I don't see a reason for spamming the same rank of GH during the entire fight.
If he can live with GH5 during stomp so far, he should be able to switch to spamming GH3 (or at least 4) while stomp is not active, then go back to GH5 when stomp is active.
Greetings all It's been a while since I posted here. Before I ask my question, I just wanted to pass on my appreciation for those priests here that have been actively helping other priests for so long now.
OK my question is... I have the Ethereum Life-Staff from Solarian as my main weapon right now. Our guild is usually pretty good at bringing Bloodboil down (we have killed up to and including Illidari Council and Archimonde). Currently due to holidays our raiding isn't so active, and so I doubt I'll get the Sceptre of Purification from Archimonde for a while if at all. Would it be better for me to not bother buying the Gavel of Naaru Blessings since my best offhand is probably my Voodoo Shaker, and instead go with the Staff of Immaculate Recovery?
Or maybe both but with different enchants on each? I have been using that Heroic MGT staff with Spirit gems and enchants for a Spirit staff, but maybe eventually the Ethereum Life-Staff would be better for that once I have other decent weapons.
I would buy 15 epic gems, get them cut, sell them for 4k+ gold, and use Dark Blessing as my main hand together with Voodoo Shaker. If you don't want to farm it, you can still make the gold and keep using your staff. Gavel isn't worth it, in my opinion.
Dark Blessing doesn't really turn me on, compared to my existing one. It wasn't in the running at all.
I'm just wondering if I should bother spending my DKP on the Staff of Immaculate Recovery or keep my existing one (or look at other options like the badge mace). Currently my thoughts are fixated on Immaculate Recovery.
I didn't have the earring , so farmed for the dragon card... and it's pretty good.
Only got it last week, because i wanted max regen for Brutallus (no spriest for me *sigh* )
It was actually pretty easy and cheap to get. I got 2-8 for about 150g total from AH and guildbank and did a UBRS run with 3 (need 3 to activate table before first boss)... the Beast dropped the Ace first kill, i gave 100g to both guildies that helped me out, so 350g for the trinket and about 30min time exluding AH checks...
Not sure i would have farmed it if i had the earring, but if you have neither the card is much easier to get... and seeing it proc brings a big smile to my face...
When you said you farmed for the card....does the Ace really only drop at 0.2% from a boss in UBRS? I collected all the others, then read up on the Ace and was severely disappointed. I don't think anyone on our server goes to UBRS, and if they do, it would cost a fortune to buy this card.
I think they upped the chance, like the LBRS bosses drop all the pieces for the UBRS key now 100%.
It just took me 1 go, so or they upped the chance, or i'm the luckiest guy alive...
Just get 2ppl to help you, if you offer some gold it shouldn't be too hard.
I switched to my druid and got 2 druid guildies to help, so we stealthed past trash and only took bosses which sped up things a bit...
Dark Blessing doesn't really turn me on, compared to my existing one. It wasn't in the running at all.
I'm just wondering if I should bother spending my DKP on the Staff of Immaculate Recovery or keep my existing one (or look at other options like the badge mace). Currently my thoughts are fixated on Immaculate Recovery.
Personally I have both the staff and the badge mace. When I dont have a spriest, which is most of the time, I put on as much regen gear as is humanly possible to include the staff. On the rare occasion I'm graced with a spriest anymore I'll toss on all my haste and plus healing gear. I think what it really boils down to is your raid comp and play style. If you know that 90% of the time youll have a mana battery I'd drop the badges on the mace and keep on waiting for the scepter to drop. If you dont get a spriest I would go with the staff. Its a lot less +healing, but your raid buffs will more than make up for it.
Dark Blessing doesn't really turn me on, compared to my existing one. It wasn't in the running at all.
I'm just wondering if I should bother spending my DKP on the Staff of Immaculate Recovery or keep my existing one (or look at other options like the badge mace). Currently my thoughts are fixated on Immaculate Recovery.
Unless you care a lot about stam, the Dark Blessing is much better than the badge mace in terms of throughput and value, and if you cared about regen, you wouldn't be using the badge mace anyway.
So it really boils down to whether you want to use a MH/OH combo for higher throughput or a staff for higher regen. Without the offhand from Archimonde, it's a pretty even choice since the throughput gain is relatively low. With the offhand, however, MH/OH is definitely a much better choice than any staff available pre-KJ.
Daerilia wrote it fine for the aggro of Shield and Renew and PoM.
About the initial aggro of PoM:
Applying PoM gives you 0 aggro. (Which is not the same as none aggro!)
If you cast PoM after the pull and before anybody did anything else you will enter the aggro-table of all Mobs who "are aware of you" with 0 aggro. As would do everybody who enters combat. (F.e. a misdirecting hunter who will not get the aggro of the mobs but the mobs know that he is there.) It is like the aggro of a bodypull from a tank. But if you do it after the pull the mobs should be aware of the tank or who ever pulled. So there should be somebody with at least 0 aggro on all mobs. To pull aggro you need at least 10% more aggro than the person before. I dont know what 10% of 0 would be but 0 is not more than 0 so you should be fine.
If you are not sure if someone entered the aggro-table before you but you know someone else is on the list you can fade. It will drop your aggro BELOW 0. Since fade drops your aggro for a fixed value (the only time where fade is superior to other aggro-reducing abilities). But as long as the fight goes (and you live) you will never leave the aggro-table again.
I myself PoM before a pull and right after the first dmg occured (so the first 2 heals are PoM on the tank). All the healing-aggro from PoM is applied to the person who gets the PoM (tank). So PoM on your tank does not only decrese your healing aggro, it increses the tanking aggro of the tank _on_all_mobs_! It gives him much more aggro than it would give you since you use talents and buffs and maybe enchants to reduce your aggro and the tank uses talents or skills and maybe enchants to increse his aggro. PoM on the tank is worth something about Shield Slam - the best warrior tanking ability - in terms of aggro and has a comparable CD. Our prot-pala begs our classleader to assigne me to him everytime he tanks since he knows I use PoM on CD. He claims PoM does about 20%-25% of his aggro. (And that are reasonable numbers as was shown in some thread on this site but I'm to lazy to look it up.)
I'm new here (been reading like mad though), but I'd like to add to and encourage the PoM aggro discussion. :)
Like Turgid, I have also seen a priest pull aggro (on Archimonde) from casting a PoM after a pull, but before the tank does any aggro-increasing abilities; that is, there were only two people on Archimonde's aggro list - the priest and the tank, both with 0 aggro. Archimonde decided to kill the poor priest first, and he unfortunately was caught so offguard that he did not fade in time. Unless I've missed something or I'm misunderstanding, there appears to be no consensus yet; a couple of you are saying PoM before or after a body pull will not kill you, yet Turgid and my fellow priest have both been killed because of PoM. Is it random? Was Archimonde just as likely to pick the tank since both have 0 aggro? And by the way, the tank always body-pulls Archimonde, so there was no hunter or misdirect involved in initial aggro.
Personally I have both the staff and the badge mace. When I dont have a spriest, which is most of the time, I put on as much regen gear as is humanly possible to include the staff. On the rare occasion I'm graced with a spriest anymore I'll toss on all my haste and plus healing gear. I think what it really boils down to is your raid comp and play style. If you know that 90% of the time youll have a mana battery I'd drop the badges on the mace and keep on waiting for the scepter to drop. If you dont get a spriest I would go with the staff. Its a lot less +healing, but your raid buffs will more than make up for it.
We rarely get a SPriest in our healing group, unfortunately. So I've had to learn to cope without it pretty much all the time. So that's why I am such a slave to the Spirit. I guess I'll wait and see how it goes with Archimonde drops then.
Originally Posted by uh...ok
Unless you care a lot about stam, the Dark Blessing is much better than the badge mace in terms of throughput and value, and if you cared about regen, you wouldn't be using the badge mace anyway.
So it really boils down to whether you want to use a MH/OH combo for higher throughput or a staff for higher regen. Without the offhand from Archimonde, it's a pretty even choice since the throughput gain is relatively low. With the offhand, however, MH/OH is definitely a much better choice than any staff available pre-KJ.
Yep. Pretty much my thoughts were on Staffs with Spirit alone, so hence the idea of using a mace again without a decent off hand wasn't interesting me, nor was the Dark Blessing.
The good news is, The Staff of Immaculate Recovery dropped tonight from Bloodboil. All the healers knew I wanted it (I'm Healing Officer) and they seemingly didn't dare bid against me, or they were just being kind... I got the staff. So now I am aiming to use that as my main, with +81 on it, and will stick Spirit enchant on my old Ethereum Life-Staff to replace my MgT spirit gem stacked regen staff.
I'm new here (been reading like mad though), but I'd like to add to and encourage the PoM aggro discussion.
Like Turgid, I have also seen a priest pull aggro (on Archimonde) from casting a PoM after a pull, but before the tank does any aggro-increasing abilities; that is, there were only two people on Archimonde's aggro list - the priest and the tank, both with 0 aggro. Archimonde decided to kill the poor priest first, and he unfortunately was caught so offguard that he did not fade in time. Unless I've missed something or I'm misunderstanding, there appears to be no consensus yet; a couple of you are saying PoM before or after a body pull will not kill you, yet Turgid and my fellow priest have both been killed because of PoM. Is it random? Was Archimonde just as likely to pick the tank since both have 0 aggro? And by the way, the tank always body-pulls Archimonde, so there was no hunter or misdirect involved in initial aggro.
I'm almost certain that that has nothing to do with the PoM, and it's more likely that the priest cast a PWS and didn't want to admit it. As I've already mentioned so many times before, it is a tested fact that a single PoM cast cannot pull aggro even if your tank has done 0 threat to the boss. And if you don't believe me on this, you're definitely welcome to try it for yourself and report the results.
The only other possible explanation would be that there's some insidious bug in the system that only shows up once in a blue moon on boss pulls. Which I highly doubt would be the case.
We had two pull with a prist pulling aggro on Archimonde, too. I was the first one who did it in our raid. We came to the conclusion that it was renew not PoM that gave me the aggro and decided not to hot the tank before the pull. The other priest was not there when I pulled aggro and it was the same with him. He used renew before the pull.
I think that this nearly only occurs with Archi is because there are so seldom bodypulls with bosses.
Why wouldn't you misdirect Archimonde? You can body pull him and still misdirect him to your tank. Ideally, your tank will be running towards him and the hunter right after. The hunter should be landing a hit before Archimonde lands one on your tank and from then on your healers cannot aggro. If you're having your hunters group run mounted to the opposite side, well, one of them will be late.
Healing aggro on the pull is mostly caused by hots and pws. Archimonde targets our druid on many of our pulls and switches back to the tank once the misdirect lands. Tell your tank to bloodrage before the pull, it will help a bit too.
I'm almost certain that that has nothing to do with the PoM, and it's more likely that the priest cast a PWS and didn't want to admit it. As I've already mentioned so many times before, it is a tested fact that a single PoM cast cannot pull aggro even if your tank has done 0 threat to the boss. And if you don't believe me on this, you're definitely welcome to try it for yourself and report the results.
The only other possible explanation would be that there's some insidious bug in the system that only shows up once in a blue moon on boss pulls. Which I highly doubt would be the case.
Is it possible that testing was done long time ago and something changed in recent patches? About half a year ago I was intensively farming Karazhan and had a lot of overagro due to PoM. It was going this way: tank shoots a mob from a trash group, I apply PoM on tank, other mobs change their target to me. Had few deaths before get used to PoM before pull or fade immediately. I swear, I didn't cast anything else, nor there were any HoT ticking. It was strictly cast of PoM. May be PoM applies like 1 agro and thus get me higher than anyone else with 0?
I believe I ran the test myself within the last year or so. I'd like to say sometime back in March?
It wasn't a perfect test, but the basic idea was that I had someone body pull a mob and kite it while I cast PoM on them. I had him click off PoM while kiting (in case the mob managed to close in to get a hit off) and observed that I could not pull the mob away from him. I repeated the same experiment with Fort and actually got the same results (suggesting that casting a single Fort generates a trivial amount of threat). Repeated it once more with PWS, and quite obviously had no trouble pulling the mob away.
08/17/08, 11:21 PM
It's been a while since I posted here. Before I ask my question, I just wanted to pass on my appreciation for those priests here that have been actively helping other priests for so long now. 
Similar Threads
