Priest: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 123

Celsius · 01/15/10, 12:57 PM

Originally Posted by tedv

I'm going to have to flat out disagree. 8% movement speed is enormously important a small fraction of the time. All other boot enchantments are marginally important a small fraction of the time. I cannot in good conscience call that "a bit of icing" or label the difference "negligible". Every fight in ToC and ICC has some portion you will have to run somewhere, and a number of them make you run quite frequently. The effect of 12 crit rating is literally insignificant in a way that 8% run speed could never be. Getting out of fire 8% faster is really important.

If there was a 63 spell power enchant for boots, I would still take 8% run speed, and I don't think I'd side with spell power by default until the gains were truly ridiculous-- on the order of 200+. But even if they had such a boot enchant, I would just switch to the run speed metagem, or at least keep two pairs of boots, one with each enchantment. Why trade something you can't get from many other sources (run speed) for something you can (healing throughput)?

For the record, I do agree with you that Tuskarrs is indeed always the best choice our of the three I labeled as viable.

However, I do need to nitpick on this:

Originally Posted by tedv

8% movement speed is enormously important a small fraction of the time. All other boot enchantments are marginally important a small fraction of the time.

The first statement is correct, and that's why - again - Tuskarr is my enchant of choice. The second, however, is not. If you'd agree to rephrase it as "All other boot enchantments are marginally important all of the time", I would agree with the comparison. The effect of 18 spirit or 12 crit is always there, and always provides a tiny tidbit of throughput and regen.

Seandewolfe · 01/17/10, 2:21 AM

I ran into an interesting issue in ICC 25, as while healing as a disc priest, despite having a bigger mana pool than ever before, I started running lower on mana than ever before. It's almost like ICC is harder or something.
Anyway, this leads to a trinket issue, as I finally (mostly out of spite) got the Illustration of the Dragon Soul - Item - World of Warcraft. I had been running Althor's Abacus - Item - World of Warcraft and Talisman of Resurgence - Item - World of Warcraft.

Using some math, happily pilfered from Healing priest trinkets for 3.3 � BobTurkey’s WoW Blog, I actually determined that the Illustration of the Dragon Soul might be a discipline upgrade, despite the 213 gear level instead of 245. The question is whether you'd value the clear throughput over the mana regen and timely big heals of the Talisman of Resurgence. The Abacus, we can agree, is a no brainer equip.

The math being:
Throughput stat weight

Discipline Holy

MP5 1.0000 1.0000

Spirit 0.4273 1.0516

Intellect 1.1551 0.8162

Spell power 2.0000 2.0000

Crit rating 1.1315 0.7397

Stamina 0.2000 0.2000

Haste rating 0.6309 0.6096

Mana regen stat weights

Discipline Holy

MP5 1.0000 1.0000

Spirit 0.4273 0.6474

Intellect 1.0022 0.8059

Spell power 0.6000 0.6000

Crit rating 0.6918 0.7058

Stamina 0.2000 0.2000

Haste rating 0.0000 0.0000

This leads to scores of 400 Throughput (6th BiS) and 120 Mana Regen (19th BiS) for the Illustration of the Dragon Soul, and 339 Throughput (10th BiS) and 157 Mana Regen (10th BiS) for the Talisman of Resurgence.

The question is, is gaining the throughput a worthwile sacrifice of mana regen in an increasingly difficult raid environment, with some longer fights that are much more mana intensive?

As for me, I'm just happy that bastard Sartharion finally dropped that freaking trinket for me. Now, if only I can find a ridiculous amount of hit gear, I'll put the Illustration on instead of my Shard of the Crystal Heart - Item - World of Warcraft while in shadow spec, but that's another post.

Frmercury · 01/17/10, 4:43 AM

If you're having oom issues switching from a mixed trinket to a pure throughput one should be a no brainer not to do it.

Leejah · 01/17/10, 12:09 PM

I'm thinking about re-gemming my char.
For that reason I calculated some possibilities.

1st:
It is only possible to scale your casts down to 1,0 seconds isn't it?

2nd:
Is it still best for a ilvl 258/264 geared Priest to put int gems in the gear?
The manareg formula has a squareroute of int in it, so the more int you have the worse is the scaling?

I really hardly have manaproblems. Is it then better for a holy priest to put haste and spellpower gems in?
And how much haste is desirable?
Raidbuffed I geht about 33% haste, thats about 1,13 seconds for a flash heal. Should I keep up haste until I am at the cap or should I better go for other stats (in that fact I would prefer spellpower)

For bosses I need more mana, I just could replace a spellpower trinket with a int trinket.
But what should I do about haste and spellpower.
And is it exept all what I wrote still best to put int gems in?

Jyll · 01/17/10, 5:21 PM

Originally Posted by Leejah

I'm thinking about re-gemming my char.
For that reason I calculated some possibilities.

1st:
It is only possible to scale your casts down to 1,0 seconds isn't it?

2nd:
Is it still best for a ilvl 258/264 geared Priest to put int gems in the gear?
The manareg formula has a squareroute of int in it, so the more int you have the worse is the scaling?

I really hardly have manaproblems. Is it then better for a holy priest to put haste and spellpower gems in?
And how much haste is desirable?
Raidbuffed I geht about 33% haste, thats about 1,13 seconds for a flash heal. Should I keep up haste until I am at the cap or should I better go for other stats (in that fact I would prefer spellpower)

For bosses I need more mana, I just could replace a spellpower trinket with a int trinket.
But what should I do about haste and spellpower.
And is it exept all what I wrote still best to put int gems in?

First, it is possible to get your flash heal under one second, but it's wasted itemization, since the global cooldown hard cap is 1.0 seconds.

If you're not having mana issues at all, then yes, it's time to start gemming for throughput (spellpower, haste, crit) instead of regen. If you're having more mana issues the deeper into ICC you venture, then I wouldn't regem my int for haste or spellpower, but as you upgrade, socket throughput gems/use throughput enchants.

The amount of haste you want is subjective. Is the haste figure you've given raid-buffed with totems? Do you raid with a Frost DK? If the 33% you gave is unbuffed, I'd favor spellpower over haste, as haste buffs from your raid will likely bring your flash heal close to the GCD.

Miarose · 01/18/10, 2:29 AM

Originally Posted by Seandewolfe

I ran into an interesting issue in ICC 25, as while healing as a disc priest, despite having a bigger mana pool than ever before, I started running lower on mana than ever before. It's almost like ICC is harder or something.
The question is, is gaining the throughput a worthwile sacrifice of mana regen in an increasingly difficult raid
*snip*

Your post is confusing. You say you are having mana issues, yet you want to switch to a pure spellpower trinket?

By following Bob Turkeys stat weights you are left with only a few options. Simply put: throughput, Abacus and Solace, heroic versions obviously better. Mana regen: Solace, both heroic and normal versions. However, I do not believe mana is such a large issue in the current content. If you're looking for a full int trinket to pair with your spellpower one don't discount Pandora's Plea over the Talisman. I'd rather lose a few int and gain an on equip ICD spellpower gain.

As a disc priest, the gain of throughput will Always be worth it, but you need the mana to be able to sustain it, or all that spellpower goes to waste while you sit there oom.

Kashir · 01/18/10, 5:15 PM

For what it's worth, if you're truly concerned about mana regen; Spark of Hope or Meteorite Crystal are the best regen trinkets in the game by a rather large margin (obviously Spark of Hope is much easier to obtain!).

A conservative estimate for Spark of Hope (3 casts / 5 seconds) puts it somewhere on the order of 120 mp5 from the proc + ~50 mp5 from the Spirit, or ~170 mp5. Best case scenario (highly unrealistic 5 casts / 5 seconds) gives the trinket ~250 mp5.

It's been a while since I did the figures, but I remember Meteorite Crystal being roughly equivalent.

Unless you consider the Talisman on-use to be valuable, it's significantly outclassed by Spark of Hope.

BondExtreme · 01/18/10, 10:11 PM

I am very confused as to what I should do with my trinkets now as a disc priest raid healer.

As of now I use Solace of the Fallen (Ilv 245) and Talisman of Resurgence (Ilv 245)

I am strongly thinking of replacing talisman with the new Ilv 264 trinket Purified Lunar Dust. This is where I am just getting lost here.. My mana will drop from 26,938 to I believe somewhere around 24,500. But also it is nice I will be getting that mana regen but the loss of tons of mana like that just won't make me look like a disc priest imo. Heh or I am just looking too much into it. So please give me what you guys think about all this. It is very appreciated. Thank you

Senres · 01/18/10, 10:28 PM

Do you have mana problems as Disc? If not, drop [Talisman of Resurgence] for [Purified Lunar Dust]. That's a huge amount of spellpower. As a Disc raid healer spellpower is going to increase the absorption on your shields and that is huge. That extra 2,400 mana isn't doing anything for you if you end the fight with at least a couple thousand mana (2,400 + mana returns from Replenishment, Fiend, etc.).

FWIW I am running as Disc (raid or tank healer depending on composition) in ICC 10/25 and have been very happy with Solace + Purified Lunar Dust.

Kashir · 01/18/10, 11:52 PM

Originally Posted by BondExtreme

To be honest sometimes I do... I have the crappy 232 staff, Illumination.... I lost a CRAP LOAD of spirit when I got this.. However the mana problems are not significant.. Fully buffed in raids I do pretty well on mana but there are some fights where I need to pop both Hymn of Hope and Runic Mana potion... I just joined a raiding guild so hopefully this way I can get a newer staff quickly with the spirit I need..

So are you having mana troubles?

If no, feel free to pick up the Purified Lunar Dust for a large SP boost.

If yes, don't.

I'm really not sure what kind of response you wanted. We can't tell you whether you're having mana troubles or not.

Senres · 01/18/10, 11:59 PM

If you use Hymn of Hope, Shadowfiend, and a mana potion on a fight and don't run out of mana trying to heal then you are not having mana problems.

kindacolon · 01/19/10, 6:52 AM

I've looked around here and a few other forums for a definitive answer, but can't seem to find one. When doing a double potion trick, I see most people recommend a potion of speed for shadow priests right before the boss fight and again some time during. Wowhead comments (as unreliable as they are) seem to state that the potion of wild magic +crit effect is sticky to SW:P. My question is which is better? Assuming the crit effect is sticky, it would seem that Wild Magic would be much better to use right before and a Potion of Speed during. Is this not the case?

Frmercury · 01/19/10, 7:36 AM

Speed x2 > Wild Magic + Speed

The rolled Crit on SW:P is quite small as SW:P accounts for less than 10% of the average fight's damage. Just looking at it in pure PP values:

Haste: 500 * .92 = 460
vs
Wild: 200 *1 + 200 * .83 = 366

With Speed Pot on pull you should be able to get two full VT and DP in under the effects, not to mention 1 1/3 extra MF ticks minimum.

Sanara · 01/23/10, 8:57 PM

I was looking at the best in slot gear for Shadow priests and noticed that the T10 gear is rarely in the top 10 alot of times if anywhere near the best. Are the Tier Bonuses worth spending the frost emblems to get them, or should they be spent on non-tier frost emblem items that nearly always are better? I probably won't be getting the T10+token items anytime soon. I'm looking at the BIS list from shadowpriest.com • View topic - Best Raiding Gear 3.3 Edition

Frmercury · 01/24/10, 3:42 AM

If you click on the BiS setups in the first post, you will see they all use 4pc T10, because yes, it is that good.