Just quibbling, but it's a 10 second Penance cycle now.

Penance - Spell - World of Warcraft + [Glyph of Penance]

back-to-back use would be a much better way to go with it. I use power aura's addon to track all of my procs. The set bonus they have now looks good on paper but with the math done above it would be pretty much worthless.

You forgot Aspiration.

Today was not my day. You're absolutely right, he was right, and I'm wrong. Don't know what I was thinking.

EU got their feedback thread today, figured I'd mention it since it's not been getting a lot of attention:
EU Healing T10 Feedback

Fingers crossed we got something that's not completely useless.

Updated bonuses published.

* 2 piece bonus - Your Flash Heal critical strikes cause the target to heal for 25% of the healed amount over 9 sec.
* 4 piece bonus - Your Circle of Healing and Penance spells have a 20% chance to cause your next Flash Heal cast within 6 sec to reset the cooldown on your Circle of Healing and Penance spells.


New two piece is now viable for disc but soso for holy. The 4 piece is still kinda strange and the proc rate is probably still somewhat to low as I doubt we will get much more that 2 ppm as disc and holy still doesn't want to be casting flash in a raid healing situation.

Quite obviously, for Holy nothing changes, the bonuses are still utterly useless. Atleast I don't have to pay 1200 dkp for my tierpieces like I did for 258 yesterday...

This strikes me as the real problem with it. 25% of a flash crit is pretty small beans anyway, but split up into a hot will make it about as important as healing stream, unless it has an incredibly short duration.

Well it says "over 9 seconds" and since they "always" use the same mechanics as they already have, it's extremely likely that it will tick every 3 seconds.

Well, the real question (at least for Disc) will be what happens to multiple Flash Heal crits. Will the later crits override, or will they stack and start rolling (like Blessed Resilience).

I doubt they would let it tick every 3 sec after fixing FoL healing over time for paladins. It will most likely tick once per second or consecutive FH crits wouldn't let it tick once.

As ever with these kinds of questions it depends on the encounter design, your healing designation, and your playstyle. In general Haste gives better throughput than Crit but it also hurts your HPM and it's very easy to get yourself GCD capped when BT is up. I've taken to nearly always using BT up on GH instead of FH which solves this problem nicely and let's me carry on stacking Haste since I have absolutely no mana problems and I prefer the flexibility and predictable output that it offers over Crit.

But you do want to keep your Crit up becuse DA and Inspiration are nice. I don't think I'd want to let mine drop much from what it is now (509 haste & 29% Holy Crit). Your profile links to a Hunter so can't offer anything more specific for you.

Crit and haste are both very bad for disc. Stack spell power. If you have to pick and choose, take a minimal amount of haste, up until you hit the GCD cap with borrowed time up, then use crit - but keep in mind that you should be stacking spell power over absolutely everything.

While the core idea of your statement (focus on spellpower over other stats) has been widely demonstrated and approved, I think that your opinion on haste value may be wrong.
From my personnal raiding experience, I think that it is really important to have enough haste to be GCD-caped without taking the borrowed time buff in account, because you can often find yourself spamming a pseudo PW:S/Penance/FH/PoM/FH/FH... "cycle" (or sometimes an even simplier cast sequence FH, FH, FH, P ...) that does not allow you to refresh the borrowed time buff.
I know that most of the time in normal modes it's great to cast PW:S then any spell (rinse an repeat), but I really think that it is not possible to do so in several heroic or hard mode situations where you cannot afford to waste a GCD on an extra target just to refresh BT. Remember that PW:S+BT-hasted-FH takes more time than just a FH.
And now that most of us have dropped the 4p T8 bonus, this extra PW:S is less useful.

edit : I must admit that Power Infusion can compensate the lack of haste in most of the situations that I've described here.

Does anyone have any math or an opinion for Holy Conc vs Healing Prayers? Either that one is always better or that Healing Prayers becomes better after so many PoH casts ect. Ignore the fact that one is more talent points, and assume 6 min fight, ~30% crit and ~400 mp5 from spirit (raid buffed.) I realize that Holy Conc up-time is based heavily on play style, and that the same applies for mana reduction on PoM, I'm not asking for an exact science just a general idea. I'm not interested in being told that I should have both.

I'm having a hard time seeing why you'd want to drop either? I doubt the actual trade off you are making is between these talents but between some other talents, most likely trying to fit in Body and Soul(I usually drop SoL to 1/2 and Blessed Resilience to 2/3 for this) or empowered healing, which I personally would never pick up since even with a flash-over-renew playstyle it's still just taking a raidbuffed flash heal from 5-6k to 6-7k, hardly worth 5 talentpoints in any scenario.

Disregarding the fact that TotGC isn't particularly demanding on raidhealing, I still feel that PoH is a very strong and viable spell for aoe-healing and superior to CH in terms of dealing with sudden spikes of aoe damage. I've also never had any issues finding the space to cast PoH, no more so than on previous high movement fights such as FF/F3E.

On the other hand, I really don't see the advantage to forcing yourself down a single target spothealing path as flash simply isn't a very strong spell(go disc if you really want to do that). I recognize the utility of flash in terms of stacking serendipity, but even so when raid damage is high, I'm not casting flash heals, SoL procced or not. And discussing best practices when there's nothing to do just seems rather pointless to me.

I tend to sacrifice one point from Blessed Resilience simply because on the rare occasion when I actually spec Body and Soul it tends to be for fights with lower overall raid damage, meaning the point is easy to make up for and effects my playingstyle the least. I'll admit this is personal preference and maybe be suboptimal in some situations.

To be clear, I'm suggesting you cut 2 points from Healing Prayers and 1 from Inner Focus to max out Blessed Resilience and Surge of Light. If mana isn't a concern, then this is absolutely the right choice. Maxing Surge of Light doesn't pigeon hole you into single target healing. It's just one more spell you can cast while moving.

Regarding Prayer of Healing, I understand it has its uses, especially with Serendipity. I'm just questioning whether it's cast enough that it's worth spending 2 talent points for -20% mana reduction. I suspect that's not the case.

As said current content doesn't really challenge raidhealing, even twins has with practice become effectively just a matter of resto druids keeping hots up and the resto of us trying not to look too useless. However when we were still learning Twins and people were taking spikey damage, PoH was still doing 20-35% of my healing, only rivaled by CoH. I'll gladly agree that if you're doing nothing but casting PoM, Renew(imo easily better than SoL Flash when moving) and CoH, then you don't need the mana efficiency talents. You also don't need to be there, that place would be better filled by a druid.

I suppose you could accuse me of gearing for the next tier of content. You'd probably be right.

I guess my experience learning Twin Valkyrs was different. The damage was rarely so evenly distributed in groups that a Prayer of Healing was the right choice, and when you are soaking orbs, you might not have the luxury of stopping moving at that exact moment. Many times people were already mostly healed up before my prayer of healing could land. Looking over the parse from our very first kill, my healing breakdown was 32% circle, 32% renew, 29% mending, 7% everything else. I was competitive with the resto druid who was soaking, as well as a non-soaking paladin and shaman. Obviously we're blown out of the water by a non-soaking resto druid but what can you do. Here's the parse:

World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis

Regardless, even if you were using Prayer of Healing on that fight, taking the mana reduction talent only makes sense if you would have run out of mana without it. I just don't see how that could be the case. If you are soaking, there are fewer opportunities to cast prayer. If you aren't soaking, you should be casting holy nova instead (and glyphing it).

Similarly, if you aren't using Surge of Light at all, then don't take 1/2 points in it. Go to 0/2 and max out Blessed Resilience. The second point in Surge of Light is exactly as good as the first, so the only real options are 0/2 and 2/2.

I pulled in the region of 7-8k HPS while soaking during early attempts, and I was quite able to actually go quite low in terms of mana, so I'd say I had a clear benefit from the talents. The damage doesn't need to be completely uniform, in my experience if you can hit 3/5 targets that's already the best use of a GCD assuming your CoH isn't up.

Just for clarification, I very rarely run with Body and Soul, and throughout this period I was running 2/2 SoL and 3/3 BR, the only reason I've got B&S in my spec atm is because we specced into it for first week of Anub and I just haven't cared enough to spec back out of it since we abandoned that tactic.

Also I tend to run more crit heavy than most priests, meaning the benefits from 2/2 SoL in terms of uptime are smaller for me than for someone who avoids crit. With current content jamming haste down my throat I suppose that 2nd point will become more valuable to me as well.

The same stack of mana pots that I bought the day before heroic ToC release is still in my bags, untouched. I only use shadowfiend because he does damage. Both of these seem like good reasons.

Renew is better then flash in terms of HpM, but renew doesnt save people who are about to die. I use renew over flash when applicable, but having flash heal for a lot is a good thing. On a side note if I was having mana troubles empowered healing would be the best place to steal points from.