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Old 06/19/11, 12:04 PM   #421
Pathal
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Worgen Rogue
 
Doomhammer
(@Antiarc) I was curious if you intend to refill the item DB before 4.2 (or on the launch of 4.2) with Wowhead's PTR data of the the Firelands raid and rep gear. The alternative is waiting a few days for normal drops to trickle in via armory imports, and Shadowcraft would definitely see more utility in the first week if it were preemptively updated. At this point I doubt there will be any noticeable changes to the gear.

Another thing I want to mention is that I foresee the UI be rather overloading soon when picking between gear, and it arguably is already. While I haven't dug through the code as much as I would like, I expect that it would make it easier on network communications if you create a ceiling and a floor for items that show up. For example, I doubt any rogues who are working on Heroic AC have an interest in [Smoot's Shredded Smock]. It's therefore just another item on the list that should probably be hidden with either an ilvl floor or an EP floor. To elaborate further with something like a floor of items with, say, 10% less EP, it would turn a list of near 50 cloaks into a list of 11 for me. You would just need an option at the bottom to override any limits and list all items, as well as an option to list nothing to handle the case that someone would ever need to check out older items.

Lastly I was wondering if you had any plans to reduce the number of dependencies, even in the distant future. The web app is clearly not coded for just anyone to pick up and run a server of it locally, but it looks like it could be a little less reliant on other projects. This is really a case of "if it's not broke don't fix it", but it would be nice.

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Old 06/19/11, 4:21 PM   #422
Antiarc
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Cenarion Circle
The item discovery stuff depends explicitly on the official armory for some data. I don't remember which pieces I needed, but some stuff wasn't discoverable via Wowhead easily. I'll have to take a look to find out what specifically. I can force a sync of all the 4.2 items as soon as they're available on the official armory, though.

An ilvl filter would be fine. One of my design goals was that the tool be usable by any level 85 rogue, not just those in current-tier raiding gear. This had been a weak point of spreadsheets in the past, since they came prepopulated with a small set of raiding gear, which left the tool unusable for newbie rogues. That said, in the common case, an ilvl filter might be appropriate.

I don't have any particular plans to reduce the dependencies, no. I wrote the tool with the expectation that end users wouldn't be worrying about setting up or deploying it - they just hit and use a URL - but it is open source if another developer wants to run their own copy. That said, the UI is pretty decently decoupled from the data processing backend (the actual backend is very simple!), and you could write a PHP backend or whatnot for it pretty easily if you wanted to (though you'll have to do all the item and character retrieval, storage, and reconstitution yourself). Is there a particular reason why you'd want it to be in a more "portable" format?

Need a Mumble server? I run MMO-Mumble for all your voice chat needs. | My rogue planning tool: Shadowcraft

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Old 06/19/11, 4:40 PM   #423
Pathal
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Worgen Rogue
 
Doomhammer
My bad on pulling from Wowhead rather than the armory. I could of sworn you said you used Wowhead in the past, but maybe that's just for item links / hovers.

The dependencies concern was more of a pet peeve / personal preference of mine. I was working on setting up a server on my laptop to toy with last night, and it usually irritates me a little when I have to check the dependencies for projects, then any dependencies for those, and so on; all the while making sure updates install right and nothing broke in the meantime. Like I said in the other post, it's not designed for the general public, but more experienced site owners to host, so if it isn't broke then it doesn't need to be fixed.

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Old 06/19/11, 4:46 PM   #424
Antiarc
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It's pretty easy to install on Linux.

1. Install mongodb

yum install mongodb
service mongod start

2. Install RVM

bash < <(curl -s https://rvm.beginrescueend.com/install/rvm)

3. Install Ruby

rvm install ree

4. Install bundler and passenger

gem install bundler passenger

5. Check out the code

git clone git://github.com/cheald/shadowcraft-ui.git

6. Install the gemset

cd shadowcraft-ui/
bundle install

7. Check out the engine

cd shadowcraft-ui/backend
git clone git://github.com/cheald/ShadowCraft-Engine.git

8. Start the engine

./restart.sh

9. Start the app
cd ..
passenger start- p 3000

10. Go to localhost:3000 and you're up and running.
It's certainly not a one-step deploy, but dependency managers like yum and rubygems make it pretty fast and easy.

Last edited by Antiarc : 06/19/11 at 11:30 PM.

Need a Mumble server? I run MMO-Mumble for all your voice chat needs. | My rogue planning tool: Shadowcraft

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Old 06/22/11, 2:02 AM   #425
Pathal
Don Flamenco
 
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Worgen Rogue
 
Doomhammer
Even then it's not quite that simple. For kicks I tried installing it on a fesh VM running Ubuntu and those 10 steps quickly turned into 20+ simply due to needing other dependencies, or having to use alternative install methods such that I would have a compliant version of whatever was needed. Of course, there are other methods to get this to run, but that would just be even more involved.

There's also the chance that I mistyped something, or I forgot a step somewhere, but the point of high dependency usage becoming hostile to run on other computers remains.


Click Here ← Click Here
1- Change /etc/apt/sources.lst to include "deb Index of /repo/ubuntu-upstart dist 10gen"
2- Add a key so that apt will use the new source: "sudo apt-key adv --keyserver keyserver.ubuntu.com --recv 7F0CEB10"
3- Update apt and grab the new software: "sudo apt-get update; sudo apt-get install mongodb-10gen"
4- Download and install curl cause apparently it's not installed by default on 11.04: "sudo apt-get install curl"
5- Download and install git software: "sudo apt-get install git"
6- Grab rvm: "sudo bash < <(curl -s https://rvm.beginrescueend.com/install/rvm)"
7- Link rvm to /bin because it wasn't globally accessible: "sudo ln -s ~/.rvm/bin/rvm /bin/rvm"
8- Try to install ruby: "sudo rvm install ree"
9- Grab several tools to fix a failed install: "sudo apt-get install zlib1g-dev libssl-dev libreadline5-dev"
10- Retry to install ruby: "sudo rvm install ree"
11- Install bundler passenger: "sudo gem install bundler passenger"
12- Grab the UI git repo: "git clone git://github.com/cheald/shadowcraft-ui.git"
13- Move within shadowcraft-ui and install via build: "cd shadowcraft-ui; sudo bundle install"
14- Link bundle to bin because the installer didn't: "sudo ln -s /var/lib/gems/1.8/bin/bundle /usr/local/bin/bundle"
15- Try to install again: "sudo bundle install"
16- Grab several binaries that caused bundle install to fail: "sudo apt-get install libcurl3 libcurl3-gnutls libcurl4-openssl-dev libxml2-dev libxslt-dev"
17- Retry: "sudo bundle install"
18- Go to the backend and grab the engine: "cd backend; sudo git clone git://github.com/cheald/ShadowCraft-Engine.git"
19- Set all files to full read/write with my ownership to deter read errors: "sudo chown -R shadowbox /path/to/folder/; sudo chmod -R 777 /path/to/folder/;"
20- Start up the engine: "./restart.sh"
21- I didn't really feel like fixing an issue with the VM version once I received "Failed to load application: No module named shadowcraft.calcs.rogue.Aldriana" upon trying to start the backend.

Note: I trimmed out a lot of failed apt-get install's and others while trying to establish what dependencies were missing (apt-get would just bail as soon as it found the first missing one), and condensed many apt-get installs to a single line.

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Old 06/22/11, 8:02 AM   #426
Jaybird
Von Kaiser
 
Night Elf Priest
 
Bronzebeard (EU)
First off - the web interface is awesome! Thanks for all the effort.

I just tried loading up my sub rogue, and it recommended switching all my Haste reforges to Crit. This resulted in the new calculated DPS value dropping by over 500. I believe for Sub the weightings post yellow hit and exp caps should be haste > crit > mastery (at least at my iLvl)

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Old 06/22/11, 9:09 AM   #427
Anticitizn
Glass Joe
 
Orc Rogue
 
Ysera
Indeed, the web interface and the entire program are incredible!

I have one quick question, exactly what type of in-game situation does Shadowcraft model? For example, Simcraft has options for a "Patchwerk" and a "Helter Skelter" fight, I'm assuming Shadowcraft is modeling a "Patchwerk" style fight? Are there any plans to introduce a target-switching/interrupted dps style fight? I also figure that this has been brought up before, but after a bit of searching I couldn't find the answer.

Last edited by Anticitizn : 06/22/11 at 9:58 AM. Reason: Grammar

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Old 06/22/11, 1:47 PM   #428
• Aldriana
Mike Tyson
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Doomhammer
Shadowcraft is modeling a sustained DPS situation; however, historically we've found that the difference between a slightly interrupted fight and a sustained fight is actually not that large in terms of stat priorities. So it might not be a great model for Omnotron or Ascendant Council, it should be a reasonable estimate of your stat priorities (if not your actual DPS) for most fights in the tier.

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Old 06/23/11, 2:03 AM   #429
Scoparli
Glass Joe
 
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Goblin Rogue
 
Kil'Jaeden
Does shadow craft ever take into account Two set and four set when calculating ep values for tier pieces or does it just calculate for that individual slot?
Or is this something I just need to calculate for myself weather or not four set is worth taking over slightly better stats of a different piece.

On a side note, I'd like to say i love shadow craft allot its been a huge help in my dps.

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Old 06/23/11, 2:32 AM   #430
Nyashin
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Saurfang
I am pretty sure that SC takes everything into account, it is one of the best sims out there. Now if only our class were as awesome as the sim

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Old 06/23/11, 2:56 AM   #431
Scoparli
Glass Joe
 
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Kil'Jaeden
Originally Posted by Nyashin View Post
I am pretty sure that SC takes everything into account, it is one of the best sims out there. Now if only our class were as awesome as the sim
Thank you, for the longest time ive wondered if it did or not automatically, since it doesn't show four set or two set anywhere.

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Old 06/23/11, 3:07 AM   #432
Antiarc
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Yes, it does take set bonuses into account. This isn't very well publicized in the UI. Sorry about that.

On a personal note, my wife just had a baby, so I'm going to be somewhat unfocused for a bit. I do ask your patience, and know that we have a patch coming along, so while I'll be working on keeping things updated, I will be a bit slow about it.

Need a Mumble server? I run MMO-Mumble for all your voice chat needs. | My rogue planning tool: Shadowcraft

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Old 06/23/11, 10:45 PM   #433
TYious
Glass Joe
 
Undead Rogue
 
Garona
CONGRATS! We'll see you when you come back. Thanks for all the great work!

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Old 06/24/11, 12:11 PM   #434
Mariele
Glass Joe
 
Night Elf Rogue
 
Uther
Weird situation, when I load my Assas Rogue up, optimizing gems gives me lower DPS, reforging is always an increase, but gemming always will lower that, not sure if it's a bug or what could be going on

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Old 06/24/11, 3:42 PM   #435
Tziva
Glass Joe
 
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Human Rogue
 
Feathermoon
Originally Posted by Mariele View Post
Weird situation, when I load my Assas Rogue up, optimizing gems gives me lower DPS, reforging is always an increase, but gemming always will lower that, not sure if it's a bug or what could be going on
"Optimise gems" is a little misleading. As far as I can tell, it doesn't mean that it min/maxes your gem choices for maximum DPS. I think it's just a shortcut button for swapping all your sockets to your best gem (Delicates) regardless of socket bonus (if it's meant to do something else then I can't figure it out, since it's always been a DPS decrease for me). I just swap them around manually now if the math isn't obvious.

Last edited by Tziva : 06/24/11 at 3:47 PM.

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