ShadowCraft: Rogue spreadsheet for 4.0 - Page 54

Rejinald · 12/10/11, 6:44 PM

Originally Posted by galatapus

Along the lines of bugs, I clicked "optimize gems" out of curiosity on my character sheet today, and it happily told me to socket my gear with four Chimera's Eye.

Seeing the same

Lucindae · 12/13/11, 12:33 PM

I'm seeing some odd results from the reforger tool in Shadowcraft. I'm assassination spec.
It wants me to reforge Fear using 40 Haste -> Mastery when it's clear that 43 Crit->Mastery is better.
It also wants me to reforge Dreadfire Drape using 30 Mastery -> Haste.

PanzerBear · 12/13/11, 1:53 PM

Sorry if this is a dumb question, but im trying to figure out why my DPS is so far off what Shadowcraft tells me it should be.

But is there a way to see a breakdown of what the DPS in Shadowcraft comes from? Like what Recount does in game. Like what % of the Shadowcraft DPS would come from Mutilate, Rupture, Venomous Wounds, etc etc.

Im just trying to find out why Shadowcraft says I should pull 28k dps, but im only actually pulling 20.

Thanks.

• Aldriana · 12/13/11, 2:05 PM

There is support for this in the backend, but its not currently exposed in the UI. So if you have the computer savvy to run the engine directly, that would be one option.

That said, when you're looking at a DPS difference of 30%, you're not talking minor rotational differences. Its probably one of two things:

1) ShadowCraft is designed for sustained DPS stand-and-burn situations - Baleroc in the previous tier, and Ultraxion (and LFR Zon'ozz) in this one. If you're comparing your DPS on any more complicated fight, your DPS will necessarily be lower due to the interruptions and target switches.

2) Otherwise, you're doing something fairly significantly wrong in not spending energy, using the wrong poisons, not staying in melee range of the target, and so on. To be 30% behind requires omitting major elements of your cycle. 30% is not omitting or misusing minor elements of your cycle - its omitting essential pieces of your cycle outright.

PanzerBear · 12/13/11, 2:18 PM

Originally Posted by Aldriana

There is support for this in the backend, but its not currently exposed in the UI. So if you have the computer savvy to run the engine directly, that would be one option.

That said, when you're looking at a DPS difference of 30%, you're not talking minor rotational differences. Its probably one of two things:

1) ShadowCraft is designed for sustained DPS stand-and-burn situations - Baleroc in the previous tier, and Ultraxion (and LFR Zon'ozz) in this one. If you're comparing your DPS on any more complicated fight, your DPS will necessarily be lower due to the interruptions and target switches.

2) Otherwise, you're doing something fairly significantly wrong in not spending energy, using the wrong poisons, not staying in melee range of the target, and so on. To be 30% behind requires omitting major elements of your cycle. 30% is not omitting or misusing minor elements of your cycle - its omitting essential pieces of your cycle outright.

Well, I was even lower on Ultraxion. Which was why I was really trying to find out why ShadowCraft said I should be pushing 29k. We don't have a Druid or other Bleed effect person, but even disabling those 'buffs and debuffs' only dropped me by around 1k dps output on ShadowCraft. Guess its time to run the engine directly. Thanks for the help.

♦ Viper · 12/13/11, 2:38 PM

Considering Ultraxion is the closest fight right now to what ShadowCraft is modeling, does the engine support an assassination cycle without Backstab sub-35%? You can change talents in the UI (say, move 2 points from Murderous Intent to Imp Expose Armor) to force you into a situation where Backstab should never be used, but I'm not certain if this is modeling Mutilate all the time or a suboptimal Backstab sub-35% without MI.

e: It seems changing the Backstab "# of CPs to Envenom" cycle option still affects the dps calculation, so it must still be assuming the use of Backstab?
e2: And it thinks 4CP is a higher dps setting than 5CP, so I'm going to guess that cycle option is strictly based on % health and not which ability it's using-- which is actually probably Mutilate.

• Aldriana · 12/13/11, 2:58 PM

Similar to the previous question: there's support for turning off Backstab in the backend, but its not currently exposed in the UI.

Basically, the feedback I got on my previous sheets was that people were annoyed/confused by some of the wizardry they performed - while in a lot of cases its nice that it automatically detects things like what size finishers you should use, sometimes you do want to know how much damage you lose by using the "wrong" size finishers. So ShadowCraft is intentionally more manual in its configuration. In this case that means it uses Backstab for a fixed percentage of the fight specified in the engine settings whether that makes sense or not. It also uses Rupture regardless of whether you have Venomous Wounds, and so forth.

Phrixos · 12/13/11, 7:02 PM

I have noticed in Shadowcraft a huge dps loss when I drop my 2 piece T12 in favor of 4 piece t 13 all the way until I replace all of my heroic tier 12 for heroic tier 13, and even then, its not that large a dps increase. Is 2 piece t 12 really that important or is it not being modeled correctly?

Ferrik · 12/14/11, 1:19 AM

Originally Posted by Phrixos

I have noticed in Shadowcraft a huge dps loss when I drop my 2 piece T12 in favor of 4 piece t 13 all the way until I replace all of my heroic tier 12 for heroic tier 13, and even then, its not that large a dps increase. Is 2 piece t 12 really that important or is it not being modeled correctly?

For which spec? It was found out that bis for Subtlety actually uses t12 shoulders and gloves for the rest of the game because the 2pc is that much stronger than the 4pc from t13. It averages like 5% of your damage as sub and that scales up with the rest of your gear.

Phrixos · 12/14/11, 4:56 PM

I found that it was larger for Sub than Combat, but still a dps drop for combat until full heroic was obtained. According to Shadowcraft of course.

Artoxia · 12/15/11, 2:13 AM

Recording to this Post from Aldriana i was wondering if the 7% for the No'Kaled proc is already modelled in shadowcraft? For myself it would be interesting if the 384 LFR version would be bettern than the stage 1 dagger. (in 10 man DS the first drop will be for our enhancement shaman who's still running with 378s

)

Thaelon · 12/15/11, 1:27 PM

Anyone else getting a 502 error when trying to load the Shadowcraft website?

Antiarc · 12/15/11, 3:20 PM

The VPS ran out of disk space. I've corrected it and everything's back online now.

AzGuL^ · 12/15/11, 5:13 PM

gearProcs = {
	...
	# 4.3
	77974: 'lfr_wrath_of_unchaining',
	...
}

gearBoosts = {
	...
	77974: 'lfr_kiroptyric_sigil'
}

trinketMap = dict(gearProcs, **gearBoosts)

While I don't know Python and I haven't had time to look throughout the code, this looks pretty wrong and perhaps it's why LFR Wrath of Unchaining is bugging?

77974 being item id of lfr WoU

right, after digging a bit more, as I understand it things under "gear boost" are on use and will automatically be applied when possible, and gear procs will be handled differently. If my assumption is correct, it would make sense why LFR WoU is overrated by such large margin.

nextormento · 12/15/11, 6:59 PM

You are correct in both assumptions. We have that distinction in the engine because, well, they need different modelling; it'd make sense to have a unique way to input this kind of things in the future, mainly because that segregation is as arbitrary as it gets from a UI development perspective. What the front-end is telling the engine to do here is that whenever it sees the item 77974 equiped it should compute as if both wou and the sigil are present (minus the static stats in the sigil). The ranking should be working as intended though.