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07/30/12, 8:53 PM
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#16
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Glass Joe
Night Elf Rogue
Argent Dawn (EU)
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More on 33;
 ← Click Here
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7/31 01:25:41.041 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:41.244 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,411,410,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:42.043 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:42.442 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,411,410,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:43.143 SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x010000000043C752,"Ath arieltwo",0x511,0x0,13750,"Adrenaline Rush",0x1,BUFF
7/31 01:25:43.143 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil, 0x80000000,0x80000000,13750,"Adrenaline Rush",0x1
7/31 01:25:43.927 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:43.927 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,403,402,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:44.120 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:46.078 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:46.315 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:46.485 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,405,404,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:48.720 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:48.720 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,447,446,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:48.910 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:50.907 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:50.907 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,451,450,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:51.045 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:53.304 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:53.304 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,444,443,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:53.469 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:55.646 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:55.646 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,447,446,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
7/31 01:25:55.781 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:58.148 SPELL_AURA_REMOVED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x010000000043C752,"Ath arieltwo",0x511,0x0,13750,"Adrenaline Rush",0x1,BUFF
7/31 01:25:58.148 SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Tra ining Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1
7/31 01:25:58.186 SPELL_CAST_FAILED,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0x0000000000000000,nil,0 x80000000,0x80000000,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,"Not enough energy"
7/31 01:25:58.581 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x010000000043C752,"Atharieltwo",0x511,0x0,0xF13079A800001104,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,1752,"Sinister Strike",0x1,490,489,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
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World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
Since I have some horrible problems with tables on EJ I took a screenshot of my calculations from Excel:

Time stamps used are "SPELL_CAST_SUCCESS" from the combatlog.
Ran the entire test with BladeFlurry on from start to stop. No gear but a weapon (with no stats).
I think my test shows that actual regen match that of the character sheet.
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07/31/12, 12:13 AM
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#17
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Glass Joe
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Looking at how venomous wounds works, it is being multiplied by assassins resolve in beta currently with switching between swords and daggers there is exactly a 20% difference. With doing tests between set attack power and mastery amounts the math I saw for it including the damage from master poisoner came out to be VW=(1.26*(1+mastery%))(748.243+.168*AP). Trying this on current numbers worked out along with matching the values in the character sheet to the tool tip damage while factoring out master poisoner bonus along with matching those with actual seen values on raiders dummy. Sorry not the best with spread sheets so will post numbers used below. If there's more info that is needed that I omitted please ask. All numbers are tested at level 90.
AP Mastery% Target Damage Tool Tip Damage
739 28% 1406-1407 1340 (daggers)
739 28% 1172-1173 1116 (swords)
2687 28% 1934-1935 1842 (daggers)
2687 29.07% 1950-1951 1858 (daggers)
1661 28% 1656-1657 1578 (daggers)
1661 28.43 1662 1583 (daggers)
1661 28.43% 1385 1319 (swords)
Last edited by Torima : 07/31/12 at 12:23 AM.
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07/31/12, 10:01 AM
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#18
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Rogue
Uldum (EU)
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Originally Posted by Torima
[venomous wounds derivation]
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I did some testign on my own in the ptr (lvl85):
| AP | mast | dmg range | tooltip | | 673 | .28 | 1270-1271 | 1210 | | 10753 | .4981 | 4684-4685 | 4461 |
This matches spot on with your findings for a base damage of 675 (rounded from 675.1364769757 as the dcb extract suggests) and ap scaling of .168
Update:
Originally Posted by Athariel
[energy spreadsheet]
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Not much to say, but I've uploaded a 'spreadsheeted' copy of your image to google docs >here< if someone wants to play with it. 40-39.81 energy deficit is a very solid aproximation.
Bonus round: props for using commas as decimal points.
Last edited by nextormento : 07/31/12 at 9:29 PM.
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08/05/12, 4:29 PM
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#19
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Glass Joe
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36.
That's the off hand portion, dodges and parried involved.
Main head portion, I had to do another quick lookover to make sure it can be parried (expected but just confirming)
9.
From everything I saw in my testing I saw near perfect proc rates for Shadow Blades and that they work off of special hit cap, unfortunately my game has crashed and my WoL seem to not want to be uploading right now so I will have actual logs to back that statement later when I delve into it more. As a rough estimate from what I remember testing I had a 2.17 MH attack speed and a 1.5 OH attack speed. Would expect 12/2.17 MH Shadow Blade procs and 12/1.5 OH Shadow Blade procs which would be 6 and 8 respectively which is what I was seeing. As mentioned I'll have actual numbers in a bit unless anyone else can confirm in the meantime.
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08/05/12, 6:44 PM
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#20
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Glass Joe
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37 Does Garrote get additional combo points during Shadow Blades?
Yes, just popped Shadow Blades stealthed and garroted as Combat, gave 2 CPs.
38 Does Shadow Blades stack with Seal Fate? That is: does a critical mutilate during Shadow Blades get 4 combo points?
Yes, critical Mutilate gave 4 CPs during Shadow Blades.
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08/05/12, 9:32 PM
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#22
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Rogue
Uldum (EU)
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Originally Posted by Isebel
[Shadow Blades]
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It'd be good to have some WoL or simply timestamped logs for this, yes:
Mainly to check if the procs occur exactly when a swing is expected, or if it has any kind of swing reset or server-client bugginess. Also, we've seen some missed procs being reported in combat logs as melee swing misses; perhaps that's worth investigating too.
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08/05/12, 10:27 PM
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#23
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Glass Joe
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40d
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
[19:03:00.569] Xarran Deadly Poison Raider's Training Dummy 5836
[19:03:01.031] Xarran Shadow Blade Raider's Training Dummy *33020*
[19:03:01.031] Xarran Shadow Blade Off-hand Raider's Training Dummy 11042
[19:03:01.031] Xarran Deadly Poison Raider's Training Dummy *22868*
[19:03:01.402] Xarran gains 15 energy from Xarran's Combat Potency
[19:03:01.408] Xarran Revealing Strike Raider's Training Dummy 18808
It appears that Shadow Blades can proc Combat Potency and Deadly Poison. I haven't tested for weapon enchant procs but seeing as Shadow Blades appears to work like a modified auto attack I wouldn't be surprised if that were the case as well.
Also 40a
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
Having attack speeds of 2.12 and 1.47 in MH and OH respectively, you can theoretically calculate you'd see 12/2.12 and 12/1.47 Shadow Blades procced. Seeing as most of the information I've seen so far it's to no surprised Shadow Blade doesn't really proc it's just an empowered auto attack as I had 6 Shadow Blades hit in each cast as well as 8 Shadow Blade Off-hands hit in each cast.
Now I'm not white hit cap, I am special hit cap though and I am yet to see a miss on a Shadow Blade in a heroic that I haven't logged nor any of those in the log above. I'd venture to say that Shadow Blade is an empowered auto attack and behaves the same as one BUT it is possible that it goes off of Special Hit cap. That could probably do for more iterations of tests but from what I've seen so far it appears they also go off Special Hit cap.
Last edited by Isebel : 08/05/12 at 11:06 PM.
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08/06/12, 10:10 AM
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#24
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Rogue
Frostmane (EU)
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Wrapping up (15.), both the instant and DoT compontent of Deadly Poison scale with Bandit's GUile, as well as Wound Poison. The DoT component of Deadly Poison behaves the same way as Rupture and Crimson Tempest (the DOT doesn't update with Bandit's Guile until it is reapplied), although due to its rapid reapplication it will barely be noticed.
Edit: 40d. The picture linked here shows evidence of Main Gauche proccing from Shadow Blades.
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08/06/12, 11:33 AM
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#25
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Von Kaiser
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Regarding Elemental Force. It appears to proc as a spell using spell hit/crit mechancs as indicated in this log. That log was done at 7.63% hit,1.84% expertise (if I remember correctly), and 9.48% spell hit (all values taken from character sheet).
Another note relative to level 85 content. Throw and Deadly throw can both proc vial of shadows. Shurikan toss can as well, but it's not really relevant at level 85.
Dual wielding with Windsong: The other weapon basically just increases the uptime, offhand procs will refresh a mainhand proc (in other words, there was never more than 3 buffs up at once).
Dual wielding 1.8 daggers, autoattacks only, no poisons: log
Single wielding a 1.8 dagger, autoattacks only, no poisons: log
Both tests were run for the same total number of hits, noting the difference in uptime and similarity of number of procs.
Here are some questions not specifically asked that I investigated but may be important and/or interesting to know:
Combo point behavior: Premeditation does NOT add any anticipation charges. If used at 4 combo points, premed grants one combo point and the second does not overflow into an anticipation charge, it is merely wasted.
I also noted the timer on slice and dice to interpret how SnD behaves with respect to the "dot extend" mechanics of envenom and revealing strike. What I have found is that SnD follows that behavior with a 2sec tick timer. I used slice commander addon and noted buff timing. I found that if I refreshed with a 5pt SnD at 2.9 sec, it was extended to 36.9sec. If repeated at 1.9sec, it was extended to 37.9sec. This is not unreasonable given that SnD gives energy at 2sec intervals for subtlety (which was the spec I tested it in). It may be worth confirming if it behaves the same way for combat and assassination.
Edit number x: I tested the heal behavior of leeching poison and how it interacts with bandit's guile. The question I was wondering was if the leeching poison heal was derived from the base weapon swing before applying bandit's guile, or the final weapon strike damage after applying bandit's guile. The leeching poison heal is based on the weapon strike damage AFTER bandit's guile is applied (so basically you get 30% bigger leeching poison heals in deep insight than you do at no insight). Also wound poison is benefitting from bandit's guile. I have not tested deadly. There is also a slight delay from the weapon strike and the leeching poison heal it triggers.
I used an item level 4, 1.6 speed dagger with a damage range of 3-5. I unequipped all items that proc increased agility/ap.
Snipped log (for readability), with a single typical melee swing, leeching poison heal & wound poison proc per insight level:
 ← Click Here
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8/6 15:49:31.010 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,8680,"Wound Poison",0x8,2886,2885,8,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:49:31.010 SWING_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,2721,2720,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:49:31.827 SPELL_HEAL,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom ",0x511,0x0,112974,"Leeching Poison",0x8,273,273,0,nil
8/6 15:50:21.549 SPELL_AURA_REFRESH,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Sha dowvenom",0x511,0x0,84745,"Shallow Insight",0x1,BUFF
8/6 15:50:22.100 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,8680,"Wound Poison",0x8,3148,3147,8,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:50:22.866 SWING_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,2992,2991,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:50:23.316 SPELL_HEAL,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom ",0x511,0x0,112974,"Leeching Poison",0x8,299,299,0,nil
8/6 15:51:03.897 SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Sha dowvenom",0x511,0x0,84746,"Moderate Insight",0x1,BUFF
8/6 15:51:04.732 SWING_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,3265,3264,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:51:05.515 SPELL_HEAL,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom ",0x511,0x0,112974,"Leeching Poison",0x8,326,326,0,nil
8/6 15:51:06.733 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,8680,"Wound Poison",0x8,3459,3458,8,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:51:16.057 SPELL_AURA_APPLIED,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Sha dowvenom",0x511,0x0,84747,"Deep Insight",0x1,BUFF
8/6 15:51:16.440 SWING_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,3537,3536,1,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
8/6 15:51:16.824 SPELL_HEAL,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom ",0x511,0x0,112974,"Leeching Poison",0x8,354,354,0,nil
8/6 15:51:17.227 SPELL_DAMAGE,0x01000000003FEEE4,"Shadowvenom",0x511,0x0,0xF1307F9A000028EB,"Training Dummy",0x10a28,0x0,8680,"Wound Poison",0x8,3633,3632,8,0,0,0,nil,nil,nil
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Edit number x+1: Recuperate can proc windsong. I have not observed any procs from shiv, nonlethal poisons, or deadly poison dot ticks, still need more testing on poison proc behavior though.
Last edited by shadowboy813 : 08/06/12 at 8:22 PM.
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08/06/12, 3:52 PM
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#26
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Von Kaiser
Night Elf Rogue
Uldum (EU)
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Originally Posted by Sakuratei
[Poisons and Bandit's Guile]
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They seem to behave like expected. However, given that this is mechanics testing, I would like to know how you addressed this test. I'm not particularly concerned about snapshoting but, if someone can provide logs with highest-lowest DP-I procs under Bandit's Guile, that would be very appreciated.
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08/06/12, 7:38 PM
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#27
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Glass Joe
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5.
Testing with H No'Kaled the damage proc is going off of the spell crit and appears to not use any hit table as it always hit no matter what.
Tested at level 85. 6.55% spell crit.
85 target dummy
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
120 procs 8 crits 0 misses 6.67% crit seen
93 target dummy
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
61 procs 0 crits 0 misses
Vial of Shadows which was physical going off of melee crit and always hit as well regardless of miss rate 16.41% crit.
85 target dummy
World of Logs - Real Time Raid Analysis
241 procs 34 crits 0 misses 14.1% crit seen
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08/07/12, 1:27 AM
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#28
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Piston Honda
Night Elf Rogue
Frostmane (EU)
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Originally Posted by nextormento
They seem to behave like expected. However, given that this is mechanics testing, I would like to know how you addressed this test. I'm not particularly concerned about snapshoting but, if someone can provide logs with highest-lowest DP-I procs under Bandit's Guile, that would be very appreciated.
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No gear, weapon only, as with the other Bandit's Guile tests. DoT behaviour checked by observing tick damage in combat log when DI falls off.
http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/8340/test1po.jpg
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08/08/12, 6:54 AM
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#29
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Von Kaiser
Blood Elf Rogue
Temple Noir (EU)
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Originally Posted by shadowboy813
I also noted the timer on slice and dice to interpret how SnD behaves with respect to the "dot extend" mechanics of envenom and revealing strike. What I have found is that SnD follows that behavior with a 2sec tick timer. I used slice commander addon and noted buff timing. I found that if I refreshed with a 5pt SnD at 2.9 sec, it was extended to 36.9sec. If repeated at 1.9sec, it was extended to 37.9sec. This is not unreasonable given that SnD gives energy at 2sec intervals for subtlety (which was the spec I tested it in). It may be worth confirming if it behaves the same way for combat and assassination.
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Just tested it for Assassination and it behaves the same, whether refreshed by applying SnD or refreshed with an Envenom. Got to aim for that 2s window to avoid losing energy on SnD (obviously it won't happen that often for Assasination rogues, who refresh SnD for free all the time).
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08/10/12, 10:09 AM
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#30
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Von Kaiser
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Question 13:
Revealing strike is NOT normalized
Main Gauche is still normalized.
I attacked a level 60 dummy using white gear (no stats), and an item level 4, 1.9 speed mace with a tooltip listed damage range of 3-6. The mace was 2.48 dps.
I ran several autoattacks on a level 60 target dummy to compare the damage to the character sheet (AP = 921) damage range of 128-131 to determine armor mitigation. The result was 119-121 damage, 120 average, for an armor factor of about 0.92.
The average damage of Main Gauche was 180.
Expected damage if normalized is: 1.2*0.92*(2.48*1.9 + 2.4*921/14) = ~179.5, very close to the average of 180.
If not normalized, expected damage is 143.
After repeating by casting revealing strike 4 times, waiting for shallow insight to fall off, and repeating, I got an average revealing strike damage of 180 (damage range of 179 to 182, only 13 casts, but the damage range is narrow enough for that to be conclusive).
Expected damage if normalized: 1.5*0.92*(2.48*1.9 + 2.4*921/14) = ~224,3. Average damage was 180, which is well outside that range.
Expected damage if not normalized: 1.5*0.92*(2.48*1.9 + 1.9*921/14) = 179, very close to the 180 observed.
Another noted observation. The revealing strike (and presumably sinister strike as well) that triggered advancement of bandit's guile did not benefit from the new bandit's guile state.
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