Assassination from the Mists - Page 21

Usunar · 03/08/13, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by kindath

For now, I'd stay away from Renataki's and Bad Juju; Bloodlust looks like it has a high enough PPM to be reliable; Reorigination depends heavily on your gear (but I suspect it isn't as good as it looks, given that dropping haste and crit to near zero devalues the mastery you gain).

About Bloodlust: my friend recently shared the impressions about this proc, he said that he had about 2-3 stacks during the fight, and only during bl phase the number was about 5.

Kryptomaniac · 03/08/13, 1:39 PM

Originally Posted by Usunar

About Bloodlust: my friend recently shared the impressions about this proc, he said that he had about 2-3 stacks during the fight, and only during bl phase the number was about 5.

I also recently acquired Bloodlust, but was getting seperate results that seemed a lot better. On Iron-Qon fight I had roughly 40% uptime on the trinket, ranging from 2-5 stacks. If I can remember off the top of my head I believe it hit 5 stacks 6 or 7 times throughout the fight.

Im having issues with world of logs right now, but Ill get logs up as soon as I can.

also, our combat rogue tested it out and got next to no procs, something like 3% uptime. Hard to go into detail without analyzing a World Of Logs report.

Kesa0003 · 03/09/13, 9:25 AM

After reading through every page of this post, I still don't think I have an answer to the following two questions that have come up for me with 5.2:

1.) With shadow focus now only reducing the cost of abilities by 75%, do we still want to vanish and take advantage of it as often as possible? I'm just curious if the energy reduction for one move is worth the (brief) loss of auto-attacks and potential poison procs? My guess is that it is, but I'm not great at modeling something like this.

2.) With the new level 90 talent, Marked for Death, giving us 5-7 or so uses, (depending on fight length) that's 25-35 free combo points--is that worth the loss of anticipation? I know without anticipation we would lose some combo points from seal of fate procs, and during shadow blades for sure, and would also use less than optimal finishers on occasion too. I just wasn't sure if the "free" combo points from the talent would outweigh the lost combo points from not having anticipation, and the 4 point finishers too.

Hünsmasher · 03/09/13, 9:48 AM

Hi guys,

First i want to thank you for your great work.

Then i saw the new simcraft numbers and wondered why assassination rogue seemed to focus haste on his gear (more than 11k for 4k+ mastery). Does the new RPPM mechanic and new trinkets make us change our stats focus?

Egészségére · 03/09/13, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by Kesa0003

After reading through every page of this post, I still don't think I have an answer to the following two questions that have come up for me with 5.2:

1.) With shadow focus now only reducing the cost of abilities by 75%, do we still want to vanish and take advantage of it as often as possible? I'm just curious if the energy reduction for one move is worth the (brief) loss of auto-attacks and potential poison procs? My guess is that it is, but I'm not great at modeling something like this.

2.) With the new level 90 talent, Marked for Death, giving us 5-7 or so uses, (depending on fight length) that's 25-35 free combo points--is that worth the loss of anticipation? I know without anticipation we would lose some combo points from seal of fate procs, and during shadow blades for sure, and would also use less than optimal finishers on occasion too. I just wasn't sure if the "free" combo points from the talent would outweigh the lost combo points from not having anticipation, and the 4 point finishers too.

1) Ive been wondering this myself, Im still using it.

2) My guess is that Anticipation is still better, but for fights like Horridon with many adds MfD is better.

Usunar · 03/09/13, 6:40 PM

Originally Posted by Kryptomaniac

I also recently acquired Bloodlust, but was getting seperate results that seemed a lot better. On Iron-Qon fight I had roughly 40% uptime on the trinket, ranging from 2-5 stacks. If I can remember off the top of my head I believe it hit 5 stacks 6 or 7 times throughout the fight.

Im having issues with world of logs right now, but Ill get logs up as soon as I can.

also, our combat rogue tested it out and got next to no procs, something like 3% uptime. Hard to go into detail without analyzing a World Of Logs report.

Got it also today.I saw about a 50-55% uptime from several Qon ant Twins fights, but the problem is that majority of this uptime is made by 2-3 stacked buff, not the full 5, still need testing.Its hard to analyze it properly from the logs because every stack has the same name.

Strifelol · 03/11/13, 5:40 AM

I'm sorry if anyone has asked before but I was really wondering if T14 Heroic 2/2 for most pieces would be better than normal mode 4pc T15? Or would 4pc T15 be better still regardless of the upgrades. I remember seeing a lot of Rogues keeping their Heroic T14 4pc until they get T15 Heroic.

Shadowcraft shows that T154pc is by about 5k but I know that Shadowcraft can be a bit wonky at times, what do you think??

Torima · 03/11/13, 5:50 AM

Well the 4 set is extremely good for combat and is defiantly worth getting but if you look at just the raw stats on it for any spec upgrading to 2 set and 4 set is worth it even with the lesser worth of the bonus.

Farz · 03/11/13, 7:33 AM

Originally Posted by nonmagical

Flipping through the pages (and looking at the first post) I don't see any EP values for the new trinkets listed anywhere. Is there a place I can view those? Or are some of them up in the air about what their EP value actually is?

Here are some numbers i found on the official forums

Trinkets :

Combat :
heroic_rune_of_re_origination: 7651.1559335
heroic_talisman_of_bloodlust: 7172.9323069
rune_of_re_origination: 7127.55363101
heroic_renatakis_soul_charm: 7088.75103413
lfr_rune_of_re_origination: 6441.35903459
talisman_of_bloodlust: 6351.36491611
renatakis_soul_charm: 6274.06068871
heroic_bad_juju: 6248.65724114
heroic_bottle_of_infinite_stars: 6069.06944712
vicious_talisman_of_the_shado-pan_assault: 5759.79050482
bad_juju: 5530.22572453
lfr_talisman_of_bloodlust: 5273.51783002
heroic_terror_in_the_mists: 5226.42288042
lfr_renatakis_soul_charm: 5205.13331759
bottle_of_infinite_stars: 5152.70534325
relic_of_xuen: 4690.43363381
lfr_bad_juju: 4587.4494186
lfr_bottle_of_infinite_stars: 4561.04815342
terror_in_the_mists: 4526.25789735
hawkmasters_talon: 4184.05142327
jade_bandit_figurine: 4184.05142327
lfr_terror_in_the_mists: 4011.26857457
searing_words: 3677.89732142
windswept_pages: 3641.65721572
flashing_steel_talisman: 3090.44327156

Assa :
Assassination:
heroic_talisman_of_bloodlust: 6351.12434642
heroic_rune_of_re_origination: 6169.99067896
heroic_bottle_of_infinite_stars: 5814.85427673
vicious_talisman_of_the_shado-pan_assault: 5689.13455441
rune_of_re_origination: 5650.0860901
talisman_of_bloodlust: 5623.19498234
heroic_bad_juju: 5611.85198751
heroic_renatakis_soul_charm: 5495.40385153
heroic_terror_in_the_mists: 5128.60270916
lfr_rune_of_re_origination: 4968.73744469
bad_juju: 4966.35237112
bottle_of_infinite_stars: 4946.10949944
renatakis_soul_charm: 4863.26220753
lfr_talisman_of_bloodlust: 4668.53844031
relic_of_xuen: 4587.97646653
terror_in_the_mists: 4447.06157551
lfr_bottle_of_infinite_stars: 4377.50663215
lfr_bad_juju: 4119.4069302
lfr_renatakis_soul_charm: 4033.822409
lfr_terror_in_the_mists: 3940.96465746
hawkmasters_talon: 3889.23278196
jade_bandit_figurine: 3889.23278196
searing_words: 3527.47263915
windswept_pages: 3299.72974283
flashing_steel_talisman: 2846.64259977

Sub :
heroic_talisman_of_bloodlust: 8289.80698527 (6.55%)
heroic_bottle_of_infinite_stars: 7520.01222189 (5.94%)
heroic_bad_juju: 7429.65319778 (5.87%)
vicious_talisman_of_the_shado-pan_assault: 7355.92988352
talisman_of_bloodlust: 7340.12337636 (5.80%)
heroic_rune_of_re_origination: 7322.03198365 (5.79%)
heroic_renatakis_soul_charm: 7204.30417804 (5.70%)
rune_of_re_origination: 6628.82233081 (5.24%)
bad_juju: 6574.42826037 (5.20%)
relic_of_xuen: 6454.85365535 (5.10%)
heroic_terror_in_the_mists: 6389.7041056 (5.05%)
bottle_of_infinite_stars: 6388.71763105 (5.05%)
renatakis_soul_charm: 6374.9625015 (5.04%)
lfr_talisman_of_bloodlust: 6094.50851528 (4.82%)
lfr_rune_of_re_origination: 5720.35283841 (4.52%)
terror_in_the_mists: 5662.16468148 (4.48%)
lfr_bottle_of_infinite_stars: 5653.82790362 (4.47%)
lfr_bad_juju: 5452.36422185 (4.31%)
lfr_renatakis_soul_charm: 5286.82897609 (4.18%)
lfr_terror_in_the_mists: 5017.98275249 (3.97%)

Khazilein · 03/13/13, 3:15 PM

Would like to see the new values of the updated trinkets from tonight hotfix.

Jodou · 03/13/13, 6:46 PM

Originally Posted by Khazilein

Would like to see the new values of the updated trinkets from tonight hotfix.

For reference:

Originally Posted by Blizzard

Items

Protections for unlucky streaks have been added for trinkets that use the RPPM (real procs per minute) system.
Activation chance for trinket effects on a pull has been increased.
Every time the trinket fails to activate, there's an increasing chance that it will activate.
Increased the activation chance for agility and strength trinkets from Throne of Thunder by 10%.
Increased the activation chance for intellect and spirit trinkets from Throne of Thunder by 5%.

Source

All I can offer is that Bad Juju proc'd off my first attack on boss pulls more often than not, so it was a noticeable change.

orderofmaken · 03/13/13, 7:36 PM

I'd love to see an updated trinket list too. I tried Bad Juju myself and had a proc mostly reliable on pull but future procs could be long at times still over 3-5 minutes.

snowman2050 · 03/14/13, 4:57 AM

Doing any form of update at the moment is not really viable, due to the fact that we still don't have any accurate information to release. As soon as things have leveled out i'll perform all possible updates to the OP.

Thuzada · 03/15/13, 2:20 PM

Alrighty, so I'm sure that many of us are in the same boat, we've gotten a few new 522 pieces of gear, coughed up 1750 valor for that trinket, probably replaced our t14 4set. My question is this, with the strength of the valor trinket proc, are you guys saving your shadowblades and vendetta to line them up for the proc? Rephrasing the question, is it worth wasting one vendetta in order to get all three up at once on the pull and again at around the 3.5 minute mark. Would it be worth wasting a shadowblades use to line them up? Ancillary question, because the proc is so strong, are any of you taking glyph of vendetta? I know it's a DPS increase overall, but with both the trinket proc and vendetta lasting 20 seconds is it not better to have them overlap with higher multiplier rather than having a slightly weaker vendetta last longer?

All of this lining up procs is extremely frustrating on a fight like Megaera where procs can be wasted by a retreating head. It's also infuriating that Marked for Death doesn't work on that fight, but I'm just griping. Side-bar I'm being brought along on many more fights because of smokebomb (very clever of blizzard to get rogues back in action).

snowman2050 · 03/18/13, 8:14 AM

OP updated, a few things that need confirmation are:

- Tier 15 set piece EP values.
- Rune of Re-Origination value (possibly needs extensive in game testing).
- Legendary meta gem EP value.

edit*

Due to Shadowcraft update, the OP has been re-done, changes to Stat values and Trinket EP's.