It's easily explained. As a legacy prior to the development of the sheet, the categories where broken down the way they were. Slice and Dice is included in the Finisher damage although in a typical WWS it shows up as melee. Some of the "Other" damage is Haste effects (which adds to your base melee).

So in your case,
Melee is just your base MH and OH damage
Hemo is likely adding in the Hemo Debuff estimate if you have that on (thus why it's high).
Finisher is your SnD damage plus your other finishers.
Other would include Blade Flurry, Sword Spec I think, and other procced Haste effects.

So, in other words, the breakdown of damage is determined differently than a Combat Log parse where all normal attacks get lumped in together even if they are the result of a haste effect or your finisher cycle. You are doing nothing wrong, it's just differently broken down in a WWS. I've considered changing this at some point to be more consistent with the WWS format, although there is some value to the manner the damage is broken down here. I'll probably revisit the issue when I get to redoing the Gear Buff sheet and ask for comments at that time.

As to damage vs the sheet, the spreadsheet models a fight where you do not move at all and can stand in back swinging away at one's heart's content. Any movement is likely to lower your overall DPS. And if you have the Hemo Debuff Estimate active (enabled by default), this adds damage based on the estimated raid contribution from Hemo. This will not show in your WWS personal DPS and is probably about a 120 DPS increase to your spreadsheet damage.

I hope that helps explain it a bit.

Hmm...I guess so. Must be I forget I downloaded a patch when there are no new items and no Rogue abilities changed.

I believe this is a result of the Update function failures. Should work again when I resolve that. It doesn't appear to have anything to do with copying those fields by hand.

Makes me wonder how long those multiple copies have been there...I'll go through those.


Yeah, there is an inherent problem with the design. If you change any of the fields, the combo box doesn't change. So I left that bug in there as a shortcut way to change the box. I could have the box clear when you click "No" and that will resolve some of the problem. There is still the issue of when you start with a saved talent set and then change it without saving a new set. It's clunky, but it looks like the only way to get back to the selected value is to attempt to switch and say "No" or to switch it again as it only calls the routine when the box changes.

I think I misinterpreted what I was told by one of the Mac testers who found a fix for the upgrade Macro. I believe if you remove the = vbBinaryCompare at the end of the Replace declaration it should work. No, I took this code straight from the MS website as the fix for this issue but I now get the impression this is a fix for old PC versions of Excel still using VB 5.0 and it didn't work for Macs using VB 5.0. I think I'm going to dump all that code and just rewrite the one use of that function. I should have just done that in the first place, but hindsight is 20/20.

I'll get a test version out tonight and post a new fixed version if the Macros are reported as fixed. The new version will also include a revised Deadly poison model. I'll be explaining the model when I get home from work in the Roguecraft 101 thread so people can double check the math. I believe I have found a 100% accurate modeling of it (at least without taking into account things like Shiv and Envenom). It's closely related to the conversion of PPM mechanics to % uptime, so will have significant implications for the accuracy of non-cooldown PPM mechanics when I remodel them as well.

I would like to do a suggestion which might be a nice improvement to the spreadsheet.

There's quite some consumables and sometimes I don't know which one I have to choose. Would it be possible to have a dropdown menu for the food? And maybe for the flask/elixers as well? Another option could be to see which food is the best upgrade as being a consumable (like all slots of armor have with the upgrade-search-macro).

And second: this would also cut the big list of the sheet, it currently counts 141 rows of info. And with this suggestion it could be like 130.

I don't know if this all is possible, but it would be great to hear your opinion about it.

That's a good idea. The trick being compiling which buffs do not stack with one another. If someone wishes to do the legwork and get me a comprehensive list of which items are the same type, it should be simple enough to implement, although Battle vs. Guardian vs. Both might be a little tricky if we have any straight Guardian Elixirs in the list.

Scrolls:
Scroll of Agility V
Scroll of Strength V

Food :
Spicy Hot Talbuk
Warp Burger/Grilled Mudfish
Ravager Dog

Flasks: (count as both battle and guardian)
Unstable Flask of the Bandit
Flask of Relentless Assault
Shattrath Flask of Relentless Assault (this one isn't on the list yet)

Battle:
Elixir of the Mongoose
Elixir of Major Agility
Elixir of Demonslaying
Ground Scorpok Assay
Fel Strength Elixir
Elixier of Mastery
Onslaught Elixir

Extra: (Shared CD unsure)
Drums of War
Drums of Battle
Haste Potion
Thistle Tea
Flame Cap (not sure if these can be used while windfury is active)


For modelling, you'll need to look at which items are triggered by the potion CD, and which trigger the healthstone CD.

The darkblue + black used for shaman buffs is pretty hard to read.
Also, could you add a bottom line to rows: 79, 94, 111, 132. This should give the buffs list a slightly cleaner look.

Some of the "other" buffs, such as the rallying cry, no longer work on level 70 players.
It might be worth testing which ones exactly and considering the removal of such buffs.

On the subject of buttons capping cropping etc, perhaps you could use the square button that you used for "import armory" everywhere?
The rounded buttons that are used everywhere else in the sheet seem to have some trouble fitting properly. But the big square button should have a lot less problems with alignment, cropping etc.


Also there's Dragonbreath chili, and stormchops which are consumables (food), it might be worth adding these to the list to show people how weak they are.

Drums only share CD with other drums. Haste Potions with the pot CD. I think thistle tea and flame cap shares with the healthstone CD.

Thistle tea do share the HS CD, but the flame caps don't, since it's a temporary enchant so I think it also won't stack with windfury, like Zurgat said.

Are you sure about this? I'm pretty sure that I've used flame caps and seen my healthstone go on cooldown. WoWHead says the same thing under the comments section for flame cap. What I haven't checked is to see if flame caps operate with WF. However, I am assuming that they do, as I have used flamecaps in fights where I am running dual poisons and the flamecaps still deal damage. (Maybe they changed it in a recent patch?)

If I think about it, I'll test this with and without poisons on tonight in SSC.

However, it's almost a moot point, because the damage contribution, for me at least, has been only 200-300 total per use, according to recap. That's like... an extra white swing. Since you can pop them once per 3 minutes, 300 damage over 3 minutes is a 1.67 DPS increase. (The spreadsheet models an even smaller increase; something like 0.5 DPS.) In my opinion, you're better off saving the CD for when you actually need to use a healthstone or nightmare seed.

I'm combat sword since two days, was dagger since MC before that (all spec : prepa, seal fate, combat, then s-mutilate, c-mutilate, re-combat).
My guild is at the same level as yours (RoS down, Hyjal on farm) for the record.

And wow. Those spreadsheet are so true.
Easy mode (no positionning, no combat potency proc wasted), max dps.

The difference may go from 50 to 100 dps depending of your group & raid setup, but i managed to pull #1 against everyone on most boss (not on supremus :p).
Second rogue was 25% behind me (due to stuff, but when i was combat dagger he was something like 15% behind).

My heart felt apart when i saw those 2500+ SS, which could have been an acceptable backstab.

OK^^
for the record, what swords u have and what daggers the rogue second to u is using?
thanks again!

First off, I want to thank you experts for the spreadsheet here. We as Rogues are very fortunate to have such a complete and comprehensive resource available as well as the theorycrafters responsible for it.

I am very new to theorycrafting on this level, and have solo-researched for a week or two before replying, since that is what I EJ likes to inspire before coming here for questions.

That said, there are simply a few things I cannot work out on my own. I apologize grievously if this information has already been hashed out; I simply cannot find it on my own and I realize how frustrating it is to repeat oneself time and again.

If I may, I have a few questions.

1. Concerning stat weight, I've read Vulajin's first post in Roguecraft 101 and understand the value of hit has a weight of 2.28 with Combat Swords. However, in my DPS spreadsheet on the talents page, the value of hit is only 1.03-1.19 on the Talents page, and virtually none of the stats on the Unbuffed DPS and Buffed DPS don't match these weights either in his post either.


2. I downloaded the sheet, imported my gear from the Armory, and went straight to Talents page to "Calculate AEP". The sheet did something strange.It places ##### in many of the cells, and shows a DPS change of 1295592.63. Am I doing something incorrectly?

Thanks so much for anyone taking the time to reply to these.

Goodness that makes a lot more sense since agi is roughly equivalent to 2 attack power in both systems. Thank you.

Well, I'm sorry then, then I must have switched it with something else, allthough I thought it was this way.

Okay, I think I found the issue for Macs and the Save DPS button in the NA version. I apparently forgot to delete the Import from Armory button. Deleting this button should fix that issue as its bugging out because it cannot create the button as the command routine was deleted. I'm looking into the AEP issue next.

There seems to be some strange interaction with Hourglass of the Unraveller and the AEP routine. I'll have to track this down, but have identified the culprit. You can fix the rest of the sheet by selecting a different trinket (pick something in the ballpark), hit the AEP button again and reselect the Hourglass.

Awesome! Thank you.

If only there was some kind of spreadsheet to help answer your question.

What for example?

Could someone please either post this /facepalm ascii or quote the first post of this thread for Graz? Can't be that hard to switch forth and back between s1/2/3 maces/swords with your gear plugged into the sheet switching mace/sword spec appropiately.

There is no answer for my question, i read it.

There is spreadsheet where you find your answer, it's whole purpose of the thread and you seemt to miss it.

I tryed to find again, sorry guys i cant, can some one help pls? The spreadsheet given in the first post is a little bit hard.