The Roguecraft Spreadsheet - Page 11

Karmon · 09/20/08, 10:47 AM

Setting "use envenom" to false exhibits the same behavior.

• Maestroquark · 09/20/08, 12:51 PM

I don't see Wound Poison implemented in the spreadsheet. I think this ends up being important for builds that don't take Improved Poisons.

Instant Poison IX is 300 + 0.1*AP damage 20% of the time. So it's 60 + .02*AP damage average per attack.

Wound Poison VII is 231 + 0.04*AP damage 50% of the time. So it's 115.5 + .02*AP damage average per attack.

Untalented, they scale the same but Wound Poison has a 55.5 damage per attack bonus for it.

tetracycloide · 09/23/08, 9:48 AM

I have located a bug in the envenom modeling of the sheet related to the eviscerate glyph on the LK 0.2.6.xls sheet.

The DPS sheet lists envenom and eviscerate in the same column for per sec stats, presumably because the sheet is assuming eviscerate and envenom will never be used in the same cycle. The crit/sec stat for this column is listed as

=F32*J17

Where F32 is Swings/sec as derived from Miss, Doge and Parry stats for eviscerate and the cycle selected. This stat is then multiplied by the crit rate J17. However J17 is the crit rate of eviscerate, not envenom. Since the eviscerate glyph increases the crit rate of eviscerate this coding causes the glyph of eviscerate to incorrectly increase the crit rate of envenom when envenom is selected as a finisher and the eviscerate glyph is selected as a major glyph.

This can be confirmed by using any gear and build set up, manually setting the cycle to anything with 'e,' setting 'Use envenom instead of eviscerate' to TRUE, and switching from a 0 DPS glyph to the eviscerate glyph. This will cause DPS to increase by a small amount in all cases even though it should have no effect.

Suggested fix:

Change the formula in F34 to

=F32*IF(envenom,K17,J17)

It may be prudent to either list eviscerate and envenom seperatly for these stat calculations or to add this conditional code to every calculation in this column in case additional finisher specifc talents/glyphs that adjust crit, hit, miss, doge, or parry are included later.

• Vulajin · 09/23/08, 2:25 PM

I'm not likely to separate out Envenom/Eviscerate modeling entirely in the sheet (it's also merged on the Cycle calc sheets), as that would cause a huge increase in the sheet's size, but I'll take your suggestion and split them up on the DPS Calc sheets.

0.3.0 is coming within a couple hours.

• Vulajin · 09/23/08, 8:00 PM

Version 0.3.0 LK is now available via the download link in the first post! Changes:

- Removed all BC gear, enchants, and gems except for selected legacy items.
- Implemented a reasonable selection of Wrath gear, enchants, and gems including all epic items and most rares.
(Note: exact criteria used were uncommon items of ilvl ≥ 167, rare items of ilvl ≥ 154, epic items of ilvl ≥ 141.)
(Note: trinkets were not handled specifically by the above rule. Some lower level trinkets were retained.)
- Implemented level 80 stats for all races, level 80 base health, and level 80 Blood Fury.
- Implemented Blood Pact and Commanding Shout.
- Implemented profession-specific benefits for all professions.

The default gear set is what I found to be the best setup for 10-man tier 7 (i.e. item level 200), including enchants and gems. For a Mutilate build, the top DPS gem is always Bright (straight AP gem), followed by Wicked (AP+Crit) and Deadly (Agility+Crit). The best gem for your single blue to meet the meta requirement is Balanced (AP+Stamina). It is still always best to gem for socket bonuses only if they don't require blues, except the one blue for your meta gem (or, if you're a Jewelcrafter, use a Bright Dragon's Eye and you don't have to use a blue).

I compared this build using Hateful Gladiator's Shanker/Shiv against a Combat swords build using Hateful Gladiator's Slicer/Quickblade. The Combat build fell over 16% behind in DPS using the optimal cycle. However, I did not change the gems or enchants for Combat, and it's very likely that the stat priorities between the two builds differ significantly. As a result, some of my optimal gear selections for Mutilate may not have been optimal for Combat. I'll revisit the question later on to determine how significant the scaling difference really is between the two builds.

If you have any questions about the items I've chosen to add, the items I've chosen to leave in from BC, or the items I've chosen to remove, or requests for me to add an item back, please let me know. Hope you enjoy it.

kurosawa · 09/24/08, 12:07 AM

Just a curious question about EPS. How exactly do I calculate it? I remember there being some magic formula that shows your average EPS that takes into account talents, OH speed, rotation, etc. But I can't find it anywhere. You set the default energy per second at 12.65. I assume it's the passive 10 energy + 2.65 (I have no idea where to get this number).

By the way, it's the first time I've ever posted on this forum, but I've been reading your material for a long time. Big fan. Have my babies.

• QControl · 09/24/08, 2:44 AM

One small thing: Massacre being able to be put on 1h weapons is a bug. The high-end AP weapon enchant is 65 AP.

mih · 09/24/08, 10:09 AM

Enchant 2H Weapon - Major Agility - Spell - World of Warcraft
Enchant 2H Weapon - Major Agility
Permanently enchant a two-handed melee weapon to increase Agility by 35. Requires a level 35 or higher item.

Enchant Weapon - Massacre - Spell - World of Warcraft
Enchant Weapon - Massacre
Permanently enchant a melee weapon to increase attack power by 110. Requires a level 60 or higher item.

i think Massacre will be an 1hand enchant

• QControl · 09/24/08, 1:47 PM

Well, there's also Enchant Weapon - Superior Potency - Spell - World of Warcraft which is learned at 435 skill whereas Massacre is learned at 430 skill. Trust me, it's a bug.

• Vulajin · 09/25/08, 3:03 AM

Version 0.3.1 LK is available via the link in the first post. Changes:

- Changes incorporated per build 8982.
- Implemented Murder Spree.
- Fixed main hand Instant Poison damage.
- Fixed an error incorporating swings performed by Envenom in poison calculations.

Murder Spree amounts to about a 2.5% boost to Combat builds, which now still come in behind Mutilate by around or above 7%. Also, declined to implement the Massacre change just for now until it becomes explicitly clarified as being for two-handers only (also because I sort of forgot).

luke_twigger · 09/25/08, 7:12 AM

Thanks for the hard work on this useful spreadsheet. It's very interesting for me, watching things develop through the WotLK beta process and getting a head start on understanding how best to spec/gear for lvl80 raiding.

I have a bug report/query. Changing the number of talent points spent on Master Poisoner does not change the DPS value at all.

I looked at the total crit chance formula (cell C5 on "DPS" tab) and it doesn't seem to include any contribution from that talent?

A simple fix would be to change the formula as below (my change in bold), though this assumes the target is continually poisoned and doesn't take into account downtime from Envenom removing Deadly Poison.

=(B5/(crbase*conv)+tmalice+B2/agicrit+critbase+tmp)/100+bmcrit+bcrit+bgsoe

I note you compute the chance to be at zero stacks of Deadly Poison (cell P13 on "DPS" tab) so I guess this could be factored in. When I tried this I got a "circular reference" error.

This was using latest spreadsheet, 0.3.1 LK.

• Vulajin · 09/25/08, 7:17 AM

Master Poisoner does not directly feed into your own DPS because you activate the buff on the "Buffs" sheet under "Critical Strike Chance." Your fix would result in Master Poisoner getting counted twice in the event of specifying both 3/3 Master Poisoner and activating the debuff on the "Buffs" sheet.

I'll make it notice your talents for those purposes in the next version. But it's most likely never going to account for your poison uptime, because that's a huge pain.

luke_twigger · 09/25/08, 7:51 AM

Originally Posted by Vulajin

Master Poisoner does not directly feed into your own DPS because you activate the buff on the "Buffs" sheet under "Critical Strike Chance."

Thanks, that makes sense.

Amerilina · 09/25/08, 11:12 AM

Originally Posted by QControl

Well, there's also Enchant Weapon - Superior Potency - Spell - World of Warcraft which is learned at 435 skill whereas Massacre is learned at 430 skill. Trust me, it's a bug.

I believe this to be the case. Enchanting is full of bugs right now. The Titanium rod requires the Eternium Rod you used to make the Cobalt rod they seem too be neglecting fixing some of the bugs in enchanting at the moment.

Also, Enchant Weapon - Icebreaker - Spell - World of Warcraft does nothing right now. I tried testing it on a training dumb for about 15 minutes had zero procs. When they fix it I will get some test data.

I Should Have the mats to do Enchant Weapon - Berserking - Spell - World of Warcraft tonight to get some test data if it is actually implemented. I am guessing from my experience so far in enchanting it will also be NYI, but I will try to get some test data.

I also want to Add this:

BS Socket And Fur Linning

It Appears for now Fur linning is considered a enchant and over rides current enchants. The sockets Bracers and Gloves are not considered enchants and work with Enchants. I can confirm the Socket bracers and gloves from my own experience in beta. I does make sense that the sockets do not take up a enchanting slot other wise they would be worthless.

• Vulajin · 09/25/08, 5:57 PM

Version 0.4.0 BC is now available for download. Changes:

- All WotLK changes merged back in, in preparation for 3.0 patch on live servers.

This sheet is for use in planning for the 3.0 patch hitting the live servers. The day Wrath of the Lich King launches, this spreadsheet is obsolete. In addition, many aspects of level 80 theorycrafting are not implemented in this sheet. If you want to plan for level 80, you must use the 0.3.1 LK sheet. There are no quick tweaks you can do to change this version of the sheet into a level 80 theorycrafting tool. Don't bother trying.

Interesting things discovered in this version include the seemingly optimal builds for level 70 raiding in 3.0: 51/5/5, and 5/51/5. 51/5/5 comes out ahead by a small margin, which you can see from the default build and gear (the saved DPS is from a 5/51/5 build). It seems that Combat exhibits a poorer scaling than Mutilate, where it starts at roughly equivalent, by the time you hit 80 in Sunwell gear it is about 5% behind, and then by Naxx 10 gear it seems to be about 7% behind. I'm not sure what's causing this.