magicp

Running on top of a framework doesn't make it automatically safe. It's really simple folks. If he never runs any of those programs, none of those programs can ever install a keylogger. Basic security principles win again.

You might say he's missing out on a great program, but, seeing as no Rawr module exists for rogues, I'd say you're mistaken.

 

• Aldriana

Okay, stop. Just stop. This bullshit Rawr argument ends now. If you don't want to run third party programs that have to do with WoW, that's your decision - no one is saying you have to. But lets stop with the unsubstantiated "Rawr might be malware" crap, because it's not. And the reasons why no Rawr.Rogue module has been written have previously been extensively discussed. Hence, further discussion of the topic is unproductive, and, thus, if it continues, there will be consequences.

 

dinesh

I'm not sure if there was a more recent "here is why we don't use Rawr" analysis which included more recent features of that tool, but in case anyone is interested in the why's as of late 2008, this post summed it up nicely: PvE DPS / WotLK Discussion

 

FWk

Could someone with 4 piece T8 please confirm through testing how rupture crits work. I'm looking for long parses where you keep up rupture and wear no gear with a proc to increase AP, Agility, or Crit. If you're mutilate, either use HfB or don't use it, but the key is consistency.

1) Crit rate: What was the crit rate on your character screen, and what was your observed rupture crit rate? Are you specced into CQC?
2) Crit damage: What is your AP? How much did your average rupture tick hit for? What was the average crit? Are you using Relentless Earthsiege Diamond meta? Are you specced into Prey on the Weak?
3) Does Cold Blood work with Rupture in any way i.e. is the first tick always a crit? I assume it simply won't trigger when you use rupture.

I would appreciate your assistance. Alternatively if you're aware of someone already answering these questions please link me to that information.

 

◊ chalon

1. Crit rate is your physical crit rate. Each tick has a chance based on your physical crit rate to crit. The multiplier is not effected by Lethality. Prey on the Weak and RED do effect it.

2. Cold Blood doesn't do anything for Rupture -- if you hit Cold Blood and Rupture, the Cold Blood buff will not be removed.

 

Sylvira

I switched up my cycle in last nights uld run to the 5s/5r. Im swords and find myself having to waste cp with a SS while waiting for rupture to fall off about 35% of the time. It feels really weird to do ><. I didnt really notice any dps difference but it would be pretty small anyway. I at least didnt lose any noticeable amount of dps so it seems the spread sheet is not completely wrong in that sense or anything.

 

Videlicet

If you view the DPS tab after each change to a Xs/5r cycle, you'll find the value that shows the most significant change is the Builder DPS. So I would assume that the extra SS trumped any change in Rupture DPS. Of course this is with my gear and settings.

 

Jeppathum

I may be missing something here, but rupture has a finite length, 20s glyphed i think, so how do can you keep rupture up 100% and still go from a 3s/5r rotation all the way up to a 5s/5r/5e? The first one requires you to build 8 combo points in 20s, and the other requires 15.

 

Rambaral

The discussion is a page back, it refers to a set up using vile poisons and forgoing evis or envenom, and spamming SS more. It reminds me a little of the old shiv builds which makes me cautious. It appears to be a by-product of sword spec in certain gear.

 

StijnH

Would anyone be able to implement the updated Hand-Mounted Pyro Rocket - Spell - World of Warcraft ?

• While it still says it's a 60 second CD, it's actually a 45 second CD.
• It is off the GCD and does not reset the swing timer.
• Damage can be increased by debuffs (testing needed). Anything that increases the potency of normal spells should increase the potency of your rockets.
• Deals 1440 to 1760 Fire damage, can crit.

It might be worth discussing, but I can't make topics yet, and didn't really know in which existing topic I should post it.

 

Chatte

I'm pretty sure it has been valued already. An easy rule of thumb is to take the average damage it can do, multiply it by the damage modifier taking into account raid buff/debuffs (1.xx) and dividing that value by the cooldown (45s). I'm guessing it can also crit at a 150% value so it has to be worked out in the average value. This method should yield you a fairly accurate value in term of dps.

Keep in mind some fights might alter this value (Hodir, Mimiron while he lands etc.)

 

StijnH

Average non-crit damage: 1600
Average crit damage: 2400
Assume a Spell Crit Chance of 25% (that's including Moonkin Aura and Affli Lock/Mage debuff)
[(1600 * 7.5) + (2400 * 2.5)] / 10 -> Average damage: 1800

Excluding any raid buffs that increase damage on the target, there would be an increase of 40 DPS.
With the spreadsheet and my gear, it's slightly better than Crusher, but the Hyperspeed Accelerators are superiour with ~60DPS (in my case).

I was hoping it would do more DPS so I could justify dropping BS for Engineering, maintaining (or increasing) my PvE DPS and having a nice burst move for Arena.

 

Rambaral

Doing so before switching would've been the better move. Not to pile on to the Eng hate, but being a former 450 raiding engineer, it's clear that Blizz has decided it's easier to nerf engineering into the ground instead of trying to balance the PVP/PVE "benefits" it provides. Just look at the recent removal of all stealth detect from gear to see how much they care about it.

Dropping any profession for engineering is a bad move if you raid. The fact that our MT and his healer are engineers still makes me livid.

 

Grunge

Removal of all stealth detect from gear is anything but a nerf. In fact it's a buff since we don't have to wear inferior ilvl gear anymore in PvP to compete in the stealth detect arms race.

While Accelerator's don't provide as much as other profession, they're slightly above half (33~ep) in avg value, more if you consider every 2nd is stacked with BF.

Hand-rockets are still worth it in arena, so engineering is still useful. But it's no longer a must.

Fans glory to the Gladiators,
Gods glory to the Heroes.

 

amele

It's a buff to Rogue, it's a nerf to Engineering (and to engineering rogues). While I wouldn't necessarily suggest to a pvp rogue to drop engineering at this point, I wouldn't suggest picking it up either - and if you're a raiding rogue you shouldn't even consider it.

 

Palanuial

You could argue that the hyperspeed accelerators hold an even bigger advantage over crusher on any fight that has a burn phase. Or several. Although my (rough) napkin math shows that the only place where the accelerators would be better than the AP from fur lining, would be for something like XT's heart. In all other cases it's strictly inferior. They would have to lower the CD to 30s for it to become competitive. And even then it would probably be behind by a small margin.

 

Acaelus

I think thier value also changes somewhat according to spec. As Mutilate I have very little in terms of burst cooldowns, and the additional cooldown to be used during burst phases, especially haste during envenoms, can be very appealing. With pots of haste, these, and if you have any good triggered instead of proc trinkets it allows mutilate some nice forms of controllable burst that can be handy for many fights, considering their general lack of cooldowns.

 

tetracycloide

Has the interaction between the rockets damage effect and rogue talents been throughly investigated? Death Knights with engineering are asking similar questions and have concluded that several Death Knight talents also increase the damage of the rocket as per this post. As such the asumption that the tooltip average is accurate in a raid setting might be wrong.

My vanity is justified.

 

Harlequin719

Hello,

I'm not really sure I'm understanding the comparison you are trying to make here. By and large, I'm pretty sure the consensus is that Hyperspeed Accelerators do hold an advantage over the Crusher enchant; probably even moreso during a burn phase.

However, you then go on to compare the Accelerators to "the AP from fur lining." As far as I know, the fur lining from LW goes on bracers, and the Accelerators are placed onto gloves. I know my rogue has fur lining and Accelerators, so I'm not really sure where the comparison is. Did you mean to say "Crusher" instead of fur lining? Just curious as I'm strongly debating dropping Engineering since the stealth nerf.

 

• Aldriana

The point is that the marginal benefit of Hyperspeed Accelerators over Crusher is smaller than the benefit granted by many other professions - specifically Leatherworking in the example given, but Jewelcrafting, Blacksmithing, Enchanting, and Inscription are similarly superior.

 

Harlequin719

Thanks, Aldriana. I think I may have interpreted it the wrong way.

 

tenaki

I've actually just bound my accelerators to envenom/eviscerate.
Not necessarily the best use of it, but it means that I'm using it on every cooldown (more or less), and I like to think that it has synergy with the envenom buff for IP.

Although, now that I think about it... That synergy might not be the case anymore what with it having moved to a PPM model...

 

shadow_freak

I'm completely new to these forums and still a relative noob to WoW and rogues. Could someone explain to me how to use the spreadsheets? I know what program to open them with. Also, I haven't hit 80 yet. Been leveling with combat spec in Outland. I'm level 61 troll with dual swords. Any suggestions for gear or talent trees?

 

Syrek

You might want to visit Shadowpanther.net to look for gear upgrades.
It's pretty good outline until you get into endgame min-maxing and got your first epic pieces. That's the time when you need to switch to a spreadsheet. It's not much use before that point, because the gear available to you will not be found in there anyway.

 

tetracycloide

For auto attacks my instinct is that this is a wash, perhaps a slight DPS gain. The haste will reduce the % chance to poison but the overlapping effect with the envenom buff might result in a DPS gain after factoring in the increase in hits during the buff due to the nature of the buff being of limited duration. For instants it would strictly be a DPS loss because the small haste gain is not going to change the energy regen profile enough to add more instants and the % chance will be lower than it was without the haste. My instinct would be that tying a haste cooldown to envnom, given these two effects, would be a net loss but that's just an educated guess. Tying the cooldown to your instant would not be much better but tying it to rupture would probably eliminate the possibility of overlap with the envenom buff.

My vanity is justified.