Hi, I am a frequently user of Aldrianas combat roguesheet and yesterday I run into some problem, I am using this main hand weapon[Raging Deathbringer] and it does not exist in the roguesheet, I thought perhaps it is so bad Aldriana didn't count it in, if that is so do you think I should change for [The Lion's Maw] which I also have to use.

I am not certain about if this is counting as hand holding, I hope not, my idea is that the item lvl 245 wep is better due to its dps but that it has been left out of the roguesheet because of lack of stats, I would not want to enchant the lions maw with berserking just to foudn out the wep I use indeed is better.

It would certainly be hand-holding if I clicked the link for you, but...
http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t75465-g..._deathbringer/

I think what proc testing has been done with these weapons has shown them to be about on par with those of one tier lower that have stats, so in line with that ilvl 232 Lion's Maw you have.

1) Is there any cap for expertise ? (it doesn't appear in the TTT), I guess it's 26 like every other classes (6.5% dodge on a boss).
2) When using the spreadsheet, my attacks have 0.00% chance to be dodged but the EP value of expertise is still somewhere near 1.96, why ?
3) Why "spell hit" and "melee hit" are in the EP values ? Only talents, buffs and debuffs still differentiate hit for melee and for spell. Which number do I need to choose for regular "hit rating" on equipment as it stands for both ?
Thanks in advance, sorry for my english.

If I remember correctly Exp and Hit values are calculated by calculating how much dps you would lose for each point of the stat (exp, spell hit, style hit und white hit).

And yes the exp cap is 26.

1) and 2) To further expand on what InFi wrote, I believe the EP values of the spreadsheet are a bit more static and to some extent represent a fixed stat value. That means that EP values don't react directly to when you reach a given cap; e.g. the value of Exp isn't reduced to 0 just because you reach 26 expertise in your current gear. I think the reasoning behind this is that if the spreadsheet was modelled to have EP values react drastically to reaching a cap, an item with for example Exp would appear arbitrarily crappy to players already at that cap - thus not doing justice to the other stats on that item and in that way reducing the overall usability of the spreadsheet as a tool to mix and match gear.

3) A reason why the spreadsheet accounts for both spell and melee hit is that poison attacks are categorized as spell damage whereas the rest of a rogue's attacks are categorized as physical damage. As such, rogues operate with a set of different hit rating caps, if you will, since in order to reduce your chance to miss with a spell by 1%, you need to increase your hit rating by 26,23 and in order to reduce your chance to miss with a physical attack by 1%, you need to increase you hit rating by 32,79.

Was wondering if someone can confirm if I am doing this calculation for FoK dmg, ignoring poisons.

Trying to figure out the reason why my FoK dmg on H Anub is lagging behind the other 3 rogues in the raid.

Rogue 1: mace/dag
Rogue 2: axe/axe
Rogue 3: fist/dag
Rogue 4 (me): axe/axe

Since FoK is based off of weapon damage, is it two tiered in terms of first calculating your MH dmg (check weapon type, then use appropiate multiplier for that weapon), then calculate OH dmg (redoing the check for which multiplier).

Next question would be concerning where this weapon damage is taken from? Would it be the average dps number on the weapon?

Thanks.

So I've noticed mongoose gets better and better as gear improves (atleast for combat), now that I'm muti, would mongoose outvalue berserking in 3.3, especially in ICC gear due to haste getting also better?

Change it immediately. The proc on that axe from Onyxia isn't worth the static stats that Lion's Maw has. Switch it out.

Can you say that with certainty? [Raging Deathbringer] has a 2.7 speed, while [The Lion's Maw] has a 2.6 speed, and that difference plus the higher raw DPS can compensate for a lot of the lost damage caused by the lack of stats on the Deathbringer. Are you absolutely sure the proc doesn't compensate for the rest?

Alright, this is going to fall into the "test dummy/personal experience in raids/etc." sort of response because, quite frankly, there isn't really any model (that I am aware of) to account for any DPS spikes occuring from it's proc. But... here is my personal experience: I got that weapon early in Ony's re-release and I chanted it and put it to work. I spent time on the dummies, I took it with me into some fairly straightforward tank-and-spank encounters (e.g., Koralon, Gormok, Valkyr twins, etc.) and the proc was very infrequent. I've talked w/ other rogues on my server who theorycraft and run in high end guilds and the consensus was the same -- that Ony axe belongs in the bank if you have Lion's Maw.

I wish there were more concrete data and stats I could offer up. Your question about the raw DPS and slower speed is legit, though. I just wish I had more to offer besides my rogue-stinct.

There has been more concrete data offered up in these threads in the past and it has been determined that the 3 Ony weapons scale pretty much directly to weapons one tier below (i.e. 245 Vis'kag to Serilas).

I'm just wondering if the 2pt9 set bonus it becomes worth it to use rupture once you've adopted a ruptureless cycle at any point.

My reason for asking is that it seems as though a 1 cp rupture costing 25 energy could reduce the cost of your sinister strikes to 5 energy, thus improving your dps, though I guess that depends on the proc rate, which I would also like to know if you could provide it.

The proc rate is in the 1-2% range, far too low to make up for the dps loss of using rupture.

I don't believe that it works that way- the threat transferred is merely that gleaned from damage and other actions, not latent threat.

That's backed up by the tooltip as well:
Tricks of the Trade - Spell - World of Warcraft

If you popped a healthstone, he'd get the aggro from the healing event, but not from the threat being given to you from the other rogue, since you aren't taking over his "actions".

Background: combat spec with ruptureless cycles, ArP soft capped with Grim Toll

Quite often it occurs where I have 4 combo points and a buff is about to expire (eg Grim Toll, Paragon), I have the option of doing a 4 point evis with the buff or SS once more for a 5 point evis without the buff.

Which option would yield more dps if applied consistantly?

So we started raiding again 3 weeks ago and finally got started with ToGC. I play Mutilate and realized that I barely use Rupture when fighting the first three bosses and that the burst dps is the one more important.

I do not have combat weapons and I do not have 2 offhand weapons of equal quality.

But I want to gut ruptureless because I think TotT glyph will bring more Raid dps. My question is without weapon swapping and no rupture, should I spec 51/13/7 with Fleet Footed ire should I go 51/18/2 despite not having the option to weapn swap.

thanks in advance.
(I can't use Mavanas' Simulation Sheet, got only OO)

For more information, see the Pocket guide to WOTLK (a few threads down)

Odd, I thought I remember that section not being in that thread, oh well.

So Sunder/FF do not stack with personal ArP % .. ?

Does that mean all values are multiplicative?

It's neither additive nor purely multiplicative. There is a complex formula involving a cap on how much armor is subject to your personal armor penetration and it is not always what is left after applying sunders and faerie fire. If forum moderators fix the Latex renderer, you can see the formulas in this post: http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t29453-c...8/#post1201773.

I seem to recall a discussion a while ago, the result of which claimed that:

As a combat rogue if a stack of 5 deadly poison is about to fall off it is a dps loss to shiv on deadly poison on at the last moment to refresh the stack.

A.) Is that true, or am I thinking of something else?

B.) Does that remain true for both the "classic" 15/51/5 spec *and* the poison variant with 3/3 vile poisons.

C.) Will the upcoming deadly poison change (when you refresh it your MH poison procs) change any of this?

background: combat with 4p8.5 with Raging Deathbringer - Item - World of Warcraft and 320 ArP rating

I got 2 questions: When should I gem for ArP and go ruptureless? I know the answer is to spreadsheet it but since the sheet doesn't have the weapon I use, should I use the 232 sword in the sheet instead? wouldn't the additional stats I'm inputting affect the calculations?

When should I change to tier9? I was told to do so at the same time I go ruptureless, but that's my first question so I'm kind of stuck

I'm sorry if it sounds like "this is my armory help me" but I haven't found the answer on any thread u_u

It has been answered here in repeated threads in all of the different sections. Essentially, you should hold on to t8/25 4pc until you have all 4 pieces of T9 245 Triumph gear AND 4 to 5 other 245 items before gemming for Armor Pen is ideal.

However, it's a matter of personal preference. If you are interested in min/maxing your rogue and providing the most DPS to your raid, you'll wait. If you want to try the rupture-less spec to get a feel for it, you can definitely waste your gold on gemming before you should. You'll lose DPS though if your gear is not where it needs to be.

IMO, it's one of the primary blunders Blizzard made with class itemization in the 3.2 gear. All the different classes get the shaft from time to time. It just happened to be our turn with the T9 bonuses and gear itemization.