Well, you really shouldn't be waiting specifically for 5 CPs to do your finishers, that may be part of your problem. As soon as you hit 4 CP you should perform your finisher. Sometimes yes, you will hit 5 (if either Ruthlessness doesn't proc, or your Mutilate doesn't crit), but about ~50% of the time you should be able to get 4 CP with just one Mutilate. Once you switch to that, it's very easy to do two Envenoms for every Rupture. And remember, as the amount of Envenom buff uptime increases, so does the speed of getting up 5 stacks of DP. It's rather common to Envenom and be up to 3-4 stacks within only a handful of seconds.

If you are raiding with an Enchancment Shaman are you using Windfury on the MH and DP on the OH? We only have 1 shaman in our guild and I'm not very familiar with the Windfury buff. I know how it works, but I don't know if it is still applies to our class.

thanks.

See, that's the problem. I think it's my (lack of) gear, but I'm finding myself doing 1-3 CP envenoms to refresh S&D due to energy starvation, and I'm wondering if it's worth getting either 1/2 or 2/2 S&D for longer uptime and/or glyphed Vigor for a larger energy pool to work with to be able to get up 4-5 CPs. I'm not waiting on 5, but I also want to be doing 4pt envenoms for the additional buff time and damage.

And to the guy above me, Windfury's not a totem with a buff to your weapon anymore. Use dual poisons.

It's definitely gear attributed, I think perhaps as our gear gets better and better, you can gradually go from 2/2 SnD( which imo is required at beginning gear levels), then gradually step down to 1/2 or even 0/2 SnD. With that those extra points going into CQC. But imo, the Vigor investments are still worthwhile.

In the end, all it really changes is DP uptime after Envenoms. Which, I seem to suffer alot from atm.

I took the advice of a few and began focusing much less on Hit after special cap and below poison cap, and well, lets just say my DP stacks are suffering quite a bit alot of the time, both before Envenom, and after.

It's really irritating. Sitting there with nearly full energy and 5 seconds left on SnD, and I find myself reaching for Eviscerate.... cause theres only a 1 stack of DP.

For Mutilate, I'd try your best to get to the poison hit cap, provided you aren't taking downgrades to get there. You should be able to get nearly 200 hit without compromising your gear selection, and that will help a lot with your DPs getting resisted. I'm running only ~180 hit and really don't have any problem with quickly getting DP stacks up after an Envenom.

Running r/n/n, you may sometimes get into a bad situation and have to do a 1-3 CP Envenom. But generally if that happens, that means you probably made an unoptimal decision at some point earlier in the cycle. A key to running r/n/n is realizing that sometimes you have to compress it to n based on where your timers line up. As you play the spec more and more, you will get a hang of when to make the decision to compress to n, and when you are in the clear to go r/n/n.

It's all about timing and practice, really. It has nothing to do with the gear. Once you get that down, you will be able to have 100% SnD and HfB uptime, while still getting something like 90% rupture uptime, without ever having to do a 1-3 CP Envenom.

EDIT: Not to say certainly that gear doesn't play a part. Of course, as your gear improves your Mutilates will crit more often. But that won't change your Ruthlessness proc rate.

WF was changed, its no longer a chance to proc an extra attack. Now its a flat 20% (24 talented) melee haste buff. Makes it so poisons can go on both weapons without penalty.

5% is 5% of 100%, but only 3.85% of 130%. Additive vs Multiplicative.

I would still Envenom with 1 stack of DP. 5CP 1 DP Envenom still does quite a bit of damage and you will benefit from the Envenom poisons buff.

I never Eviscerated unless it was on a Poison immune mob or I had less than 3 seconds of SnD left and no DP up.

Even when I first hit 80 keeping SnD up wasn't much of an issue and those points are definitely better spent in CQC.

That'd be it, I just did the standard 5% and 5% of 30%, didn't think of 130%.

Cheers. Makes dropping my 2 pc a bit easier now.

Does anybody know if opportunity increases mutilate damage when you are not behind a target? I can't test this myself as I'm sub spec; however it seems that now that you no longer need to be behind your target to use mutilate it would be a waste of 2 talent points if you used them on opportunity, which states "increases the damage dealt when stricking from behind."

My bad, sorry. I just checked in game and found out opportunity no longer requires you to be behind your target. If I knew how to edit or delete my post I would. Flame away...

I'm looking for some help to boost my numbers on both trash and bosses. Both technique and gear critiques are more than welcomed. On Patchwerk I held 2.7k DPS but I feel like for my gear this is a relatively low number.

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I use a 5s/5r/5e rotation on bosses and am specced 15/51/5. On trash I typically open with SS and do a 1cp SnD then proceed to 5r if it appears that the mob will be alive for an entire duration, if not 4/5e while also maintaining SnD.

1) On trash is keeping up SnD a priority? Or would a simple 5e spam be more beneficial?
2) For pooling energy with this build/rotation, should I be SSing ASAP or typically wait until I accrue 60 energy? I rerolled from MTing on my warrior so I'm used to the button mash associated with rage dumps.
3) My spreadsheet says that a 2s/5r rotation yields the highest numbers. How do you do a 2s/5r? Does it entail a lot of energy pooling?
4) In 5mans I seem to be barely keeping up with DK tanks' damage. I use the same strategies listed above. Is there something going wrong or are DKs doing this sort of damage normally?
5) Am I doing the proper specials use?
-AR as soon as I run out of energy at the beginning of the fight in hopes that it will come off of the CD
-Stack BF with AR when possible, if not BF when AE applicable, if not BF when CD is up
-KS when waiting on energy regen or when sitting at 5cp and giving SnD a little bit of time while also letting energy regen
6) Am I performing the rotation properly? I literally stack 5cp then SnD, stack 5cp then Rupture, stack 5cp then Eviscerate, and if it appears that time alots I'll 5cp Eviscerate again (which I usually do). I do the first 5s/5r/5e without regards to SnD or Rupture duration.
7) With the SS glyph sometimes proccing, is it more beneficial to use an ability if you had 4cp so you didn't "waste" the extra cp from a proc? On all abilities? On specific ones?

It was bugged. It appears to either have been hotfixed, or fixed in Tuesday's maintenance.

Slight correction : it's 16 % base, 20 % talented, actually.

Hello fellow rogues, i have one question about ToT macro. I'm not so strong in macros and want to know is it possible to create macro which will cast ToT on focus target without changing your current target? And if yes i would appreciate to know it! Or maybe there is an addon for such trick, thou i havnt seen any like that.

Thanks for anwsers flaminghomer and Ashere

Sticking up to the 'Mongoose on level 80' sub-thread.
As far as I can see, the number of proccs at level 75 / 76 are the same as level 70, but I am concerned about the changing in Agi -> Crit conversion.
Considering someone already proved that at level 70 Executioner was +1% damage from Mongoose, do you guys suggest to go Executioner / Mongoose at level 80? Or there's another enchant that will replace those 2?

Btw... is Armor Penetration rated and thus de-scaling at level 80 also?

Berserking seems to be the new PvE enchant of choice.

As for ArP... http://elitistjerks.com/f31/t29453-c...gs_level_80_a/ contains rating conversions for all stats including ArP.

Whoops, you're right, sorry bout that =)

Berserking is definitely the best but with Abyss Crystals running 150-200g on my server, I'll be sticking with my 100-150g mongoose enchants for awhile yet.

Hello all. I'm a long time lurker.

My guild is made up of a small group of hardcore Alliance MC-SW burnouts that have decided to reroll Horde and stay predominantly on the 10 man raiding model for casual fun with friends and family members. Doing only 10 man instances though, we are short on virtually every major melee raiding buff.

My question is this-

Can anyone offer me any advice on how to spec or gear differently for 10 man only raiding? I presume my hit would need to be higher without raid buffs, and I don't have access to shaman, hunter or even feral buffs.


My apologies if this is the wrong place to ask. Thanks for the look.