This depends entirely on your group composition.

Take a look at the MMO-Champion Raid Composition Tool, plug in your group config, and see what buffs/debuffs/etc you're missing and adjust from there.

Thanks for the link! That's exactly what I was looking for.

My problem with Berserking is that at 5k DPS, Berserking is maybe ~15-20 DPS more than Mongoose. But Berserking has a huge, huge penalty associated with it (especially in terms of soloing/PvP), whereas Mongoose doesn't. Then factor in the cost, and I really can't see generally wanting Berserking on a weapon, unless I only plan on using said weapon during raiding.

Yeah, makes sense. It's sort of disappointing to have so few new weapon enchants available.

I am having a problem with combat dps. My gear is like this, The World of Warcraft Armory. My spec is 7/51/13. Im using the 5n/5r/5e. When I have a fury warrior doin 4-7k dps on fights, and the other dps in the 3-6k, my damage isnt cutting it. Im getting anywhere from 2.8k-3.6 depending on the fight. Im not even getting in the top 10 in dps. Is it just raid dps is just that good or am I doin something wrong? Am I going to have to go mutilate to produce for the guild or wait til my grp gets more crit to go HaT? Any info will help.

Hello!

Was thinking if there's any final conclusion on Sunder vs Expose Armor application. Who makes a better job, rogue or warrior, activating the debuff and why. I remember reading about the topic on other threads but never saw numbers that said one was better than the other.

Thanks a lot

BM hunters can also run a pet with a major armor debuff (not sure if it is a dps loss).
Mutilate is much inferior to keeping up EA, especially if you don't only 5 CP EA.

A 3 Finisher Cycle as combat can easily keep EA up 100%.

That's true; the exotic pet can put up major armor, though it is a bit of a DPS loss.

I guess if it's really important to absolutely always have 5cp EA, then yeah, you're better off going with a Combat rogue and having them drop the Eviscerate from the cycle and replacing it with an EA. I guess it's also less juggling than with Mutilate cycles. However, when I try I can run Envenom, Rupture, and EA all in the same cycle without too much issue, though it does require paying attention quite a bit.

I'm being a bit of a stickler here, but that macro is ridiculously redundant, although fuctional. Here's a cleaned up version of the same macro, that will behave the same way:

/cast [target=mouseover,help] [help] [target=focus,help] [target=targettarget,help] Tricks of the Trade

Note that "exists" and "nodead" are already implied by the "help" conditional, and therefore are not necessary. Also, "target=target" is a conditional that is never required as your target is always assumed by default.

Personally, I don't think a mouseover should be included in the macro because I never know where my mouse might be at a given moment, so I actually use this instead:

/cast [help,group] [target=focus,help,group] [target=targettarget,help,group] Tricks of the Trade

This will also check that the person is in your group first.

Is it a bug? Yes.

Has it been reported? Yes. I reported it on the Blizz bug forum several weeks ago along with some screenshots.

Does the fist that you equipped happen to be the Vanir mainhand? Iirc, in my experiements it was the Vanir fist causing the bug. Rage, for example, didn't cause the bug. I could be remembering wrong.

Will it be corrected soon? Semi-doubtful, as I'm sure the devs have a million and one higher priority bug fixes and changes to implement.

The most important question is if the extra crit chance is only a display bug or if the bugged fist(s) actually cause an additional 5% crit. I attempted to do some tests to check this, but I'm lousy at running tests.

If a particular fist, or any fist for that matter, was giving an extra 5% crit, the relative (albeit temporary because it should eventually be fixed) value of that weapon is considerably higher than otherwise expected, especially as a mainhand weapon whose crit chance affects the majority of your specials.

I was wondering what the calculations where for Blood Splatter + Serrated Blades + 2 piece T7 bonus.

I thought I recalled someone here saying that they didn't stack additively and that blood splatter and serrated blades would be 50%.

Thank you for the information Vulajin.

Okay, yesterday i posted my problem (in the wrong thread) about how I'm currently only doing a measly 1.1k dps as a level 80 rogue.

I've shamelessly come here asking for help in how to improve, after posting my concerns i was asked to upload a WWS report, so that people could see what I'm doing and could help me and after much confusion i belive i have finally done one

Combat Swords rogue (15/51/5)

Instance: Utgarde: Pinnacle.
WWS for group: Wow Web Stats

My armory: The World of Warcraft Armory - Guess I'm not so anonymous anymore :-(.

Group make up: The group make up consisted of me, a Holy Priest, Prot Paladin, Frost(i think) Mage and a Ret Paladin.

Additional information: I died two times throughout the instance, once when i got clipped and chased down by the third bosses whirlwind (wasn't after me someone ran him into me after i ran out of room), and on the last boss when someone killed me with bane.


I basically am calling upon any help i can get for my dps to be upto par, inb4 I suck and blah blah blah, any and all help is appreciated!


edit: Fixed spelling errors.

What rotation are you using?

Also, use the Roguecraft spreadsheet to determine optimal enchants/gems. Read the Pokcetguide thread for more information on poison use.

I'd encourage you to take a cue from Warlock WWS Help and Analysis and start up a similar thread over here. It's exactly the sort of thread a Rogue subforum was set up to encourage, and would serve to segregate such discussion pretty nicely.

I hope this is the right place to ask, it's problably not a simple question but i don't know where to post it elsewhere.


Honor Among Thieves

Is there a calculation or approximation of the extra Damage through combat points it will add for a given group?

For example
3 Rogues with Daggers , +2 other fast hitter/critter can create lot's of combat Points.

Let's assume 1 criticaly hit every 2-3 Seconds -> approximatly 2 Combopoints/Second.

Sounds like a realy good dps boost, need more numbers ^^ .

Searching for "Honor Among Thieves"
->96 Results

Most of them were:

Honor Among Thieves is bugged.
Honor Among Thieves isn't bugged.

The first post including some math i found was:

PvE DPS / WotLK Discussion

However calculated with wrong assumptions



Please can you link me the moddeling that comes to the conclusion it's not worth the work.
Couldn't find it, maybe i'am not skilled enough to use the search function, don't know .



If there are no approximations for this build that's ok, but where do i have to post to discuss it? The according Topic PvE DPS / WotLK Discussion seems to be closed.

Simplest Math would be:

3000 AP -> 2727 Eviscerate without Crits/Talents/Armor 2 ComboPoints/Second
->1000 DPS increase because of the Talent.

As I said simplest Math, i know it's wrong because of Armor/Talents/Crits/Missing Energy or alternative moves
Even more simple Math..

..wrong math were here..

Comparing it to other Builds:

-White DPS will be lower
-Poison DPS probably comparable to Combat builds
-Rupture DPS will be higher
-Envenom or Eviscarate DPS will be higher
-Mutilate or Sinster Strike DPS depends on the cycles and other attacks like Shiv/Ambush/Hemo but of course it will be lower.

Hello,

I've found this WWS on the Rogue Class Forum:
Wow Web Stats.

Both rogues were HAT specced, 5k, and 6k dps. Their gear is far from perfect yet, so i guess HAT is pretty viable in a proper group setup at decent gear levels. Untill Blizzard fixes combat and even mutilate dps, i think HAT is the top PVE raiding spec in tier7 raiding gear.

I think their glyphs were Eviscerate, Slice and Dice, and the third one is a really hard choice. I guess one of them took the Shadowstep+Prep glyph combo, the other took the 2/2 Blood Spatter+rupture glyph combo.

Need more input and theorycrafting on this spec.

Just a quick question. [Figurine - Emerald Boar] How is this with two 27 agi prismatic gems in it compared to other trinkets?

As others have stated: it's too much work (for now) to get models for HaT. This also means it's pretty hard to give definite guides on gemming and even on gearing.
Strong estimates we have for now:

Group setup
Preferably classes/specs with not only high crit chances, but also many crittable abilities/second. This includes
-Holy Paladins
-Arms & Fury Warriors
-Arcane Mages
-Hunters
to name some of the most ideal ones. Other rogues are interesting enough NOT high on our wishlist for groupmembers, since dispite our high crit rate, the amount of abilities per second we use is actually a little bit lower. Our energy regeneration rate effectively caps a rogue at 1 crittable ability every ~3 seconds

Once we get some good numbers about the amount of crittable abilities used per second by these classes (remember certain channeling spells, like Arcane Missiles), it's probably possible to make a small tool to calculate the amount of CP's gained per second for a given group.

Item Stats
-Save for reaching the yellow cap, which s very important, a HaT spec is less reliant on +hit than for example a Combat spec (no Combat Potency) or Mutilate (lower reliance on Poison procs)
-A HaT spec has no other use for +haste than increasing white damage, unlike Combat (again to improve Combat Potency) or Mutilate (Poison procs, Focussed Attacks)
-Expertise is slightly more important to cap out on, with the higher reliance on yellow damage, and the requirement for your finishers to land to be effective
-Crit rating is probably within the ballpark of how important it is for HaT, since it's one of your sources of generating combopoints.
-AP and Agi are strong stats because your most used finisher would be Eviscerate, which scales only on AP, not on weapondamage. The same applies to your Ruptures

How would you modify this macro to only ToT the focus target if you use a key modifier?

If I ToT a tank, it would generally be the target of target, otherwise I would use it on a focused dps.

Thank you for your response.

However i doubt that you are correct on the point about other (HaT)-Rogues beeing no good suporters.

If you take a look at:

Wow Web Stats

(thanks @ Cherri)

(and asume it isn't faked)

Combat Duration:
222 seconds
Pimpy -> 123 Eviscerate -> 1 crittable ability every 1.8 seconds
Thunderlips -> 87 Eviscarate > 1 crittable ability every 2.5 seconds
(no idea why there is such a big difference)