Rogue: Simple Questions/Simple Answers - Page 21

Greggto · 12/05/08, 1:32 AM

Hello, I have a question about mutilate rotation.

I know that it's 4 or 5 pt Snd then rupture then envenom...but what if you got already got rupture up and ur energy is being capped and u still have like 6 seconds of SnD left. What do you do? Just cut off those 6 seconds and envenom? or mutilate one more time to get the 5th combo point in case it was 4 before

rkedia · 12/05/08, 2:26 AM

Hi ,

Have got 2 questions. Currently running 2 -10 man's while guildies work their way to 80. My group does not have an arms warrior or feral druid. Without the bleed debuff bonus, is talented eviscerate with glyph conceivably a better option than rupture ? I do have the 2-piece t7 bonus though.

Had a weird and probably bad idea. When you have another rogue ( basically target is poisoned) , could both hands IP , with talented glyphed evisc beat out IP,DP + envenom? In recount I see a huge difference between IP and DP damage ,
is the difference offset by superior envenom dmg ?

Xangetsu · 12/05/08, 2:35 AM

Originally Posted by rkedia

Had a weird and probably bad idea. When you have another rogue ( basically target is poisoned) , could both hands IP , with talented glyphed evisc beat out IP,DP + envenom? In recount I see a huge difference between IP and DP damage ,
is the difference offset by superior envenom dmg ?

If you're Mutilate, Envenom is better to use not just because of the damage of the Envenom itself, but also because of the bonus IP and DP procs you get from the Envenom buff.

demibaka · 12/05/08, 5:14 AM

As a mutilate rogue, what is the best way to reestablish my dps cycle after it has been interrupted? Obviously anticipating incapacitation and refreshing HfB and SnD just before it occurs would be optimal, but in a worst case scenario what should I get going again first? Presumably SnD for more focused attack procs and then HfB?

Also, is there a point in a fight where you are better off leaving HfB down and spending the energy on more instant damage? Something like 25 seconds before the target dies/vanishes/switches phases/ etc?

Many thanks in advance.

Ormack · 12/05/08, 10:00 AM

Originally Posted by demibaka

As a mutilate rogue, what is the best way to reestablish my dps cycle after it has been interrupted? Obviously anticipating incapacitation and refreshing HfB and SnD just before it occurs would be optimal, but in a worst case scenario what should I get going again first? Presumably SnD for more focused attack procs and then HfB?

Also, is there a point in a fight where you are better off leaving HfB down and spending the energy on more instant damage? Something like 25 seconds before the target dies/vanishes/switches phases/ etc?

Many thanks in advance.

You should never let Hunger for blood fall off. It is 90 energy to get it back up if you miss refreashing it. best way I think to restart my cycle is to Vanish and restack HfB then get SnD back up asap.

Vayyde · 12/05/08, 10:44 AM

What UI mods are the rest of you guys using for PvE raiding? Currently I'm using NeedToKnow and TellMeWhen for keeping track of my Mutilate cycles. The addons are nice and work well against stationary targets but in fights requiring a lot of mobility I find myself in danger of letting buffs drop as I'm not able to watch the timers as much as might be needed. It's less of an issue now as my internal clock has gotten used to the spec but can anyone offer up some different suggestions?

I've toyed with the idea of trying to modify NeedToKnow to have the bars start to pulse or flash as a timer ticks down (or maybe add some type of audible que) but alas, the codings skills are weak.

Leto · 12/05/08, 11:37 AM

Originally Posted by Vayyde

What UI mods are the rest of you guys using for PvE raiding? Currently I'm using NeedToKnow and TellMeWhen for keeping track of my Mutilate cycles. The addons are nice and work well against stationary targets but in fights requiring a lot of mobility I find myself in danger of letting buffs drop as I'm not able to watch the timers as much as might be needed. It's less of an issue now as my internal clock has gotten used to the spec but can anyone offer up some different suggestions?

I've toyed with the idea of trying to modify NeedToKnow to have the bars start to pulse or flash as a timer ticks down (or maybe add some type of audible que) but alas, the codings skills are weak.

Where do you have the bars on your screen? I keep ntk about 50 pixels below my character's feet, so it is very easy to note the status of the bars without even thinking about it. I had to watch it a little at first, but it's just become second nature now.

The great thing about having it directly in the middle of my screen, is I can easily see when the bars have less than half duration remaining due to the color imbalance, so it keeps me aware even when I'm focusing heavily on multiple other tasks.

Vayyde · 12/05/08, 11:53 AM

I have mine up by the target frame at the top left. That way I can keep track of bar tmers at the same time I keep track of Combo Points. I'll try moving them down to the center of the screen though and see how I like it,

That's actually one of the reasons I also use TmW. I have the buff icons just to the right of my character. Sadly the icons don't have a real timer attached to them just a gradual shading process as a buff ticks down.

Tinwhisker · 12/05/08, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by Leto

Where do you have the bars on your screen? I keep ntk about 50 pixels below my character's feet, so it is very easy to note the status of the bars without even thinking about it. I had to watch it a little at first, but it's just become second nature now.

Having such things at your feet also makes it much easier to watch for epic bad stuff on the floors.

I've found that having my most important bars, my health and a couple other things (total of maybe 5 items) in the area around my feet was the best move I ever made way back when.

Leto · 12/05/08, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Vayyde

I have mine up by the target frame at the top left. That way I can keep track of bar tmers at the same time I keep track of Combo Points. I'll try moving them down to the center of the screen though and see how I like it,

That's actually one of the reasons I also use TmW. I have the buff icons just to the right of my character. Sadly the icons don't have a real timer attached to them just a gradual shading process as a buff ticks down.

Then I would most definitely recommend you reposition your unit frames to a more central location. I'd recommend pitbull for unitframes if you are using the default ui.

I cannot stress how much of a difference efficient ui layout makes on your ability to focus on multiple events while in a raid, especially playing as mutilate.

There is a whole ui forum here with numerous topics on optimization and layout theory, as well as recommended mods to maximize your raiding efficiency.

Bamago · 12/05/08, 12:24 PM

Originally Posted by Kakon

Wondering how to bind TotT to Sinister Strike basicly I want it to work like this

If Tricks of the Trade is up
/cast [target=focus] Tricks of the Trade (also to make it to use it if focus=exisits, dunno how to do that, so its not constatly error messaging when I am soloing)

If Tricks of the Trade is on Cool Down
/cast Sinister Strike (on currently selected target)

Gonna use a simple macro and Grid to choose who my focus is, whether the main tank in the beginning of a boss fight then my rogue buddy and me casting it on eachother for dps, or a "oh shit that resto druid had to go bear for" on a bad trash pull so I need to put threat on him.

Hardest Part for me is that I want it on a single button mash, both abilities are on GCD, TotT is 15 energy, my SS currently 40.

Right now I have it so I focus a target, hit E to use my tricks and have DoTimer watching my CD, would just be nice fora macro so I dont have to have an extra bar on my screen. I just change it by using Grid focus=mouseover macro.

Hi, I can't find an answer to his (and my) problem. I'd like to bind mutilate instead of Sinister Strike.
Any ideas?

saedo · 12/05/08, 2:01 PM

Originally Posted by Ormack

You should never let Hunger for blood fall off. It is 90 energy to get it back up if you miss refreashing it. best way I think to restart my cycle is to Vanish and restack HfB then get SnD back up asap.

Why vanish? It's not like it gives you back all your energy or it's required to stealth before stacking HfB. Can spam HfB to restack/refresh anytime as long as you have the energy. So even when forced to be running around not dps'ing and stuff.

sephfiroth · 12/05/08, 2:03 PM

Originally Posted by saedo

Why vanish? It's not like it gives you back all your energy or it's required to stealth before stacking HfB. Can spam HfB to restack/refresh anytime as long as you have the energy. So even when forced to be running around not dps'ing and stuff.

Vanish itself costs no energy, but the Overkill talent lets you shave off 10e off each HfB, so you can quickly get a 3 stack while only costing 60e. Compared to 90e.

Which will let you get your cycle going more quickly. Its not the stealth factor itself, but rather the energy savings.

dplafoll · 12/05/08, 3:00 PM

For mods, I'm hooked on Rogue Power Bars and Rogue Focus Classic. These are good with Dominos, Pitbull, Autobar, and ElkanosBuffBars.

Edimus · 12/05/08, 4:06 PM

Originally Posted by Bamago

Hi, I can't find an answer to his (and my) problem. I'd like to bind mutilate instead of Sinister Strike.
Any ideas?

#show Tricks of the Trade
/script UIErrorsFrame:Hide()   
/cast [target=mouseover,help,exists] [target=focus,help,exists]Tricks of the Trade
/cast Mutilate
/script UIErrorsFrame:Clear(); UIErrorsFrame:Show()

I'm just throwing out an idea, I haven't tested this or anything.

yamahammer342 · 12/05/08, 4:17 PM

I was wondering about spec and gearing for a rogue that only plans on doing 5 mans mostly and possibly and occasional 10 man pick up. Would combat be the spec to go? and how much priority should i put into hit rating if combat is the way to go and 5 mans is all i plan to do? here is my armory link The World of Warcraft Armory

rutheford · 12/05/08, 4:21 PM

Originally Posted by yamahammer342

I was wondering about spec and gearing for a rogue that only plans on doing 5 mans mostly and possibly and occasional 10 man pick up. Would combat be the spec to go? and how much priority should i put into hit rating if combat is the way to go and 5 mans is all i plan to do? here is my armory link The World of Warcraft Armory

I think either combat or HAT would work well for you. I can say that I personally hate doing 5mans with my current mutilate build. Managing HFB is a pita, even more so than in raids.

• Feist-Mok · 12/05/08, 4:28 PM

Originally Posted by yamahammer342

I was wondering about spec and gearing for a rogue that only plans on doing 5 mans mostly and possibly and occasional 10 man pick up. Would combat be the spec to go? and how much priority should i put into hit rating if combat is the way to go and 5 mans is all i plan to do? here is my armory link The World of Warcraft Armory

Combat is basically the premiere 5 man build at the moment. The best mobility & Survivability the best AE, the best controlled burst, and the most utility (Tricks + Throwing Specced FoK-> Bladeflurry->Killing Spree => Everything is silenced, converging on your tank, and no way in hell getting off). It's competitive raid DPS with Mutilate as well at the moment, and is very easy to play and manage. Hit rating is a nice stat but not worth gemming for, if you can reach the poison cap, it's worth it to. Your best stats are Expertise (to cap) -> AP -> Agi -> Haste/Crit -> Hit -> ArP.

cutfang · 12/05/08, 5:26 PM

I'd also recommend having a raid ui like Grid or Xperl with a range finder, to make sure you are in range of healers on fights such as Sapphiron, or to help detect impending wipes for a sneaky vanish

Cyllan · 12/05/08, 5:51 PM

Originally Posted by Lookingcute

Are you aware you can stack HFB while stealthed?

Clearly, I am not. Must never have tried it, assuming that it would drop me out. Oh well. Next time I'm Mut spec, I'll remember.

Thanks for the tip, though.

weka · 12/05/08, 6:55 PM

I was wondering, given the mechanics of HAT, would it be viable to spec 0/27/43+1 to get weapon expertise to alleviate finisher misses?

◊ chalon · 12/05/08, 7:01 PM

Not having Imp. Evis when 50% of your damage is from Evis seems like a bad idea.

weka · 12/05/08, 8:17 PM

Originally Posted by chalon

Not having Imp. Evis when 50% of your damage is from Evis seems like a bad idea.

I guess you would be stuck at 1/2 IE or 1/2 Wep. Exp. Prob 2/26/43 then.

silvz · 12/05/08, 9:36 PM

I just wonder about the Mutilate Cycle described in the Pocketguide.

It says: Stack up HfB and start SnD however you want <- i'm fine with that
But my Problem is the 4+ CP from Mutilating, since it's not always critting + Ruthlessnes doesn't proc often tbh.
That sometimes results in having 3CPs on the target after rupturing with 4+ CPs before snd runs out.

Got any Solution for that? Or am i just doing smt wrong with my cycle?

Iscariot · 12/05/08, 10:00 PM

Originally Posted by silvz

I just wonder about the Mutilate Cycle described in the Pocketguide.

It says: Stack up HfB and start SnD however you want <- i'm fine with that
But my Problem is the 4+ CP from Mutilating, since it's not always critting + Ruthlessnes doesn't proc often tbh.
That sometimes results in having 3CPs on the target after rupturing with 4+ CPs before snd runs out.

Got any Solution for that? Or am i just doing smt wrong with my cycle?

If im reading you right then you should mutilate again at 3 combo points. If your meaning is that you have 3 combo points and slice and dice is about to fall off then you should use envenom to refresh slice and dice.

My own question: Are people only refreshing HfB before pooling your energy and using a finisher? Or is refreshing HfB anywhere in your cycle equally as good? Im finding im refreshing HfB more often than I think is neccessary at the moment as I am trying to avoid refreshing it while I still need to generate combo points (i.e. slice and dice on 12 seconds left, HfB on 12 seconds left, 4 combo points so ill refresh hunger for blood now and then pool energy for the envenom).